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Pro Tools 11 Information


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  #1  
Old 02-09-2009, 11:39 PM
yyyesbaby yyyesbaby is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Posts: 33
Default Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Hi,


I can't make it to the end of the song!

I'm relatively new (a year now) to the digital audio arena and my addiction to Pro Tools is becoming a growing source of FRUSTRATION for me.

My problems, specs (including SANDRA report) and attempted fixes are all listed below. (this is one looooooong message)

I'm just a musician... yisturday i didint no how ta spel dijatal awdio engenere... taday i r wun.

PLEASE... HELP ME.

THANX for your time... (^_^)

-------------
SESSION SETUP
-------------
Pro Tools 8 LE
Digi 003
96kHz recording

1ea Master fader track with IKMultiMedia's ARC plug-in (room correction for the monitors... NON NEGOTIABLE for mixing and/or getting record "tones", I'll deactivate it for recording though).

2ea Aux Return stereo tracks.

6ea MIDI tracks SEND to the Strike drum plug-in AND I use it's built in inserts for EQ, Mics and verb.

1ea Stereo instrument track RETURNs the Strike drum plug-in.

1ea Stereo Instrument track (sends to & returns from) an external ROLAND PMA-5 sound module that also gets inserted to Line 6's Pod Farm plug-in.

17ea Waveform tracks (no sugar on these tracks... I'm afraid to insert any more plug-ns).

(NOTE: I keep ALL tracks "inactive" EXCEPT for the ones needed to complete the task at hand)

-------------------
Playback Engine settings (currently)
NOTE: I've tried a ton of different combinations
-------------------
H/W Buffer = 1024
RTAS Processors = 3
CPU Usage Limit = 90%
RTAS Engine = (see notes in PROBLEM #1 below)
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal
System Usage Meter Window:
PCI = 0%
CPU (RTAS) = 25% - 32%
CPU (Elastic) = 1%
Disk = 3% - 6%

NOTE: I don't know why "Elastic" registers on the meter. I haven't used it yet.
=============================
NOTE: twice I've done "complete" uninstalls and reinstalls (including deleting the relavant database and preference folders)
=============================
PROBLEM: #01
Playback stops (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
#9128 Running out of CPU power. Remove RTAS plug-ins, increase CPU usage limit
=============================
PROBLEM: #02
003 goes offline and PC freezes (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
N/A
=============================
PROBLEM: #03
Pro Tools locks up (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
N/A
=============================
PROBLEM: #04
Need to exit and restart Pro Tools (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
Pro Tools application has encountered a problem and needs to close.
=============================
PROBLEM: #05
Access Violation, need to exit and restart Pro Tools (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
#1
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x0000CC04 at address: 0x1001F000 in module CFnd.dll
#2
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x6C756196 at address: 0x009F$F$D in module DFW.dll
#3
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x6C75619E at address: 0x009F43E9 in module DFW.dll
#4
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x00006900 at address: 0x009A6625 in module DFW.dll
#5
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x000001D2 at address: 0x03E3601A in module Protools.dll
#6
Access violation occurred, unable to write location: 0x0F5DF7ED at address: 0x00364359 in module DigiPlatformSupport.dll
#7
Access violation occurred, unable to write location: 0x00000011 at address: 0x77F36C4B in module GDI.dll
=============================
PROBLEM: #06
Digital Feedback??? (multiple instances) Some of the meters "peg". During any single instance of this problem the pitch of the feedback remains constant. Pitch can vary "between" instances. I usually can grab the volume knob fast enough to save the speakers but one time (while listening to a louder take AND the feedback sounding like a high pitched "white noise") I ended up losing both my tweeters on my NS-10M monitors. Sometimes the PC freezes up. Sometimes just Protools freezes up (and sometimes freezing is accompanied by speckles of "pixilization artifacts" occurring on the display screen).
ERROR MESSAGE:
N/A
=============================
PROBLEM: #07
Blue screen of death (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
#1
A problem has been detected and windows has been shut down.
PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA
If this is the first time ... yada, yada, yada...
#2
A problem has been detected and windows has been shut down.
If this is the first time ... yada, yada, yada...
Technical Information:
#1
*** STOP: 0x00000050 (0xE3DA66F8,0x00000000,0x80551255,0x00000001)
#2
*** STOP: 0x0000008E (0xC0000005,0xBF805378,0xB5F1EC84,0x00000008)
*** win32.sys - address BF805378 base at BF800000, datestamp 48ce513a
=============================
PROBLEM: #08
MIDI instrument is inactive after opening Protools. Sometimes Pro Tools "loses" the 003's input & output ports on MIDI Setup Screen window (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
N/A
=============================
PROBLEM: #09
Meters go blank (although playback is working), able to save file, but then, the program locks upon exit (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
N/A
=============================
PROBLEM: #10
Meters freeze, MIDI tracks stop playback, waveform tracks keep playing... able to click "OK" to error message, stop playback and exit then renter Pro Tools. (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
Access violation occurred, unable to read location: 0x99E634A6 at address: 0x04284373 in module Protools.dll
=============================
PROBLEM: #11
Playback stops (multiple instances)
ERROR MESSAGE:
The operating system held off interupts for too long. If this occurs often, try increasing the "HW Buffer Size" in the Playback Engine Dialog box -9094.
==========================================
==========================================
COMPUTER SETUP
==========================================
==========================================
NOTE: System is a "dedicated" digital audio workstation running with DUAL MONITORS
--------
MSconfig
--------
DO NOT load Startup Items, ALL services diabled EXCEPT FOR... Microsoft, Digidesign MME Refresh, digiSPTI, and M-Audio Series II MIDI Installer
-------------------------------
PRO TOOLS CUSTOM DEVICE PROFILE
-------------------------------
I disabled all "known" (un-needed) devices per Digidesign recommendations. I'm not a savvy device guru so... if I didn't know what a device was (or did), I DID NOT disable it.

NOTE: Network and Printers were ENABLED to assemble the Sandra and Device Manager reports (those are normally disabled when I run Pro Tools).
-------------
SANDRA REPORT
-------------
System
Host Name : STUDIO1
User : f
Workgroup : ADMINISTRATION

Processor
Model : Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz
Speed : 2.40GHz
Cores per Processor : 4 Unit(s)
Threads per Core : 1 Unit(s)
Type : Quad-Core
Internal Data Cache : 4x 32kB, Synchronous, Write-Thru, 8-way, 64 byte line size
L2 On-board Cache : 2x 4MB, ECC, Synchronous, ATC, 16-way, 64 byte line size, 2 threads sharing

System
System : System manufacturer P5K
Mainboard : ASUSTeK Computer INC. P5K
Bus(es) : ISA PCI PCIe IMB USB FireWire/1394 i2c/SMBus
Multi-Processor (MP) Support : No
Multi-Processor Advanced PIC (APIC) : Yes
System BIOS : American Megatrends Inc. 0603
Total Memory : 3.25GB DIMM DDR2 DDR3

Chipset
Model : ASUS P35/G33/G31 Processor to I/O Controller
Front Side Bus Speed : 4x 267MHz (1.07GHz)
Total Memory : 22.25GB DIMM DDR2 DDR3
Memory Bus Speed : 2x 401MHz (802MHz)
Memory Module(s)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X1024-6400C4 1GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5.0-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X1024-6400C4 1GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5.0-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X1024-6400C4 1GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5.0-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X1024-6400C4 1GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5.0-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)

Video System
Adapter : NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GT (256MB DDR3, 500MHz/1.16GHz/2x702MHz, PCIe 1.00 x16, PS3.0, VS3.0, 2 Heads)
Adapter : NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GT (256MB DDR3, 500MHz/1.16GHz/2x702MHz, PCIe 1.00 x16, PS3.0, VS3.0)

Graphics Processor
Adapter : GeForce 8600 GT (1.01, 256MB, 1.19GHz)

Storage Devices
WDC WD800JD-22MSA1 80GB (SATA300, NCQ, 8MB Cache) : 75GB (C:)
WDC WD5000AAKS-00YGA0 500GB (SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, NCQ, 16MB Cache) : 466GB (D:)
WDC WD5000AAKS-75YGA0 500GB (SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, NCQ, 16MB Cache) : 466GB (E:) (H:)
WD 2500JB External 250GB (USB) : 233GB (G:)
LITEON DVD-ROM LTD163 (SCSI, DVD-R, CD-R) : N/A (F:)

Logical Storage Devices
System (C:) : 75GB (NTFS) @ WDC WD800JD-22MSA1 80GB (SATA300, NCQ, 8MB Cache)
PTdata (D:) : 466GB (NTFS) @ WDC WD5000AAKS-00YGA0 500GB (SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, NCQ, 16MB Cache)
Data (E:) : 462GB (NTFS) @ WDC WD5000AAKS-75YGA0 500GB (SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, NCQ, 16MB Cache)
VM_PageFile (H:) : 4GB (NTFS) @ WDC WD5000AAKS-75YGA0 500GB (SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, NCQ, 16MB Cache)
CD-ROM/DVD (F:) : N/A @ LITEON DVD-ROM LTD163 (SCSI, DVD-R, CD-R)
MediaMp3 (G:) : 233GB (NTFS) @ WD 2500JB External 250GB (USB)

Peripherals
LPC Hub Controller 1 : ASUS (ICH9) LPC Interface Controller
Disk Controller : ASUS (ICH9) 2 port Serial ATA Storage Controller 1
Disk Controller : ASUS (ICH9) 2 port Serial ATA Storage Controller 2
Disk Controller : ASUS JMB36X PCIE-to-SATAII/IDE RAID Controller
USB Controller 1 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 2 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 3 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 4 : ASUS (ICH9) USB2 Enhanced Host Controller
USB Controller 5 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 6 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 7 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 8 : ASUS (ICH9) USB2 Enhanced Host Controller
FireWire/1394 Controller 1 : Avlab Technology TSB43AB23 1394a-2000 OHCI PHY/link-layer Controller
FireWire/1394 Controller 2 : ASUS VT6306 VIA Fire II IEEE-1394 OHCI Link Layer Controller
System SMBus Controller 1 : Intel 801xx/63xx SMBus

Printers and Faxes
Printer : Microsoft XPS Document Writer (600x600, Colour)
Printer : Microsoft Office Document Image Writer Driver (300x300, Colour)
Printer : Brother MFC-8860DN Printer (1200x1200)
Printer : HP Color LaserJet 4500 (600x600, Colour)
Printer : HP Color LaserJet 4500 (600x600, Colour)
Printer : Adobe PDF Converter (4000x4000, Colour)
Printer : Epson FX-850 (240x144)
Printer : HP Color LaserJet 4500 PCL 6 (600x600, Colour)

Network Services
Network Adapter : Attansic L1 Gigabit Ethernet 10/100/1000Base-T Controller - Packet Scheduler Miniport (Ethernet, 100Mbps)

Power Management
Mains (AC) Line Status : On-Line

Operating System(s)
Windows System : Microsoft Windows XP Professional 5.01.2600 (Service Pack 3)
Platform Compliance : x86

Performance Tips
Tip 2546 : Large memory modules should be ECC/Parity.
Tip 2 : Double-click tip or press Enter while a tip is selected for more information about the tip.
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  #2  
Old 02-10-2009, 12:21 AM
TOM@METRO's Avatar
TOM@METRO TOM@METRO is online now
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Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 13,694
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Have you updated all of your plugins for PT8? Have you removed those that can't be updated? Do you think you could generate a plugin list? Even if you are not instantiating outdated plugins, just having them active in the plugins folder can cause big problems.
__________________
~ tom thomas

Formerly hobotom
No.1 on Wish List... Track Freeze

Pro Tools 11.2.2 (11.1.3 for clients) ~HDX~HDN
HD Omni +192 I/O
Intel Hexcore i7, SSD
Gigabyte GA-X79-UD3
Ampex MM1200 2" 24 trk tape
MOTU 24 I/O W/PCI 424
Outboard, UREI, Eventide, Lexicon, Yamaha, TC Electronics, Orban, ART, EchoAudio, Dolby, Hughes, API, Neve, Audio Arts, BBE, Aphex, Berringer, MOTU, dbx, Allison, etc.

www.metrostudios.com
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  #3  
Old 02-10-2009, 12:29 AM
TOM@METRO's Avatar
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 13,694
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Also which Firewire controller are you using for your 003?
__________________
~ tom thomas

Formerly hobotom
No.1 on Wish List... Track Freeze

Pro Tools 11.2.2 (11.1.3 for clients) ~HDX~HDN
HD Omni +192 I/O
Intel Hexcore i7, SSD
Gigabyte GA-X79-UD3
Ampex MM1200 2" 24 trk tape
MOTU 24 I/O W/PCI 424
Outboard, UREI, Eventide, Lexicon, Yamaha, TC Electronics, Orban, ART, EchoAudio, Dolby, Hughes, API, Neve, Audio Arts, BBE, Aphex, Berringer, MOTU, dbx, Allison, etc.

www.metrostudios.com
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  #4  
Old 02-10-2009, 11:49 AM
bblue bblue is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: El Cajon, CA USA
Posts: 209
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Do you have your 003 connected to the FW port driven by the Avlab Technology TSB43AB23 chip? That's actually a TI and is the one recommended by Digi. I doubt the other one would work very well.

Have you tried faster/different RAM? DDR2-800 is fairly slow for that motherboard.

--Bill

__________________
Asus P6T DLX, Intel i7-920 OC'd to 3.2GHz, 6GB DDR3-1600 (triple), Win XP Pro SP3, PTLE 8cs2, MPTK2, Black Lion 003R, UAD-2 Duo, UA 2192
Monitoring: 24-bit dig to Avocet Crane Song controller, Pass Labs x250.5 amp, B&K N801 monitors, Transparent Audio analog cabling
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  #5  
Old 02-10-2009, 11:33 PM
yyyesbaby yyyesbaby is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Posts: 33
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Hi Tom & Bill,

THANK YOU for your replies.

I hope I'm responding properly (by replying to BOTH of you in the same message). Please let me know if I should follow some other protocol.

Before I respond I forgot to mention in the starting message post... when I was using 7.4 I had to reboot maybe 2-4 times per month. Since committing to PT 8.0 it's about 6-12 times per session.

>>
Have you updated all of your plugins for PT8?
<<
In December (when I originally got PT8) and then again today.

>>
Have you removed those that can't be updated?
<<
No. BEFORE I updated to PT8 I got ahold of Line6 (for PodFarm & GearBox), IK MultiMedia (for ARC) & DigiDesign (for Strike). All manufacturers assured me they were compatible with PT8.

>>
Do you think you could generate a plugin list?
<<
Generate? How do you "generate" a list? If you mean MANUALLY type a list of ALL plug-ins then... uhhhh... how about this (NOTE: all items taken from Pro Tools LE 7.4 and/or 8.0 "bundled packages" EXCEPT for IK MultiMedia, Line6 & Strike):

Bomb Factory (4ea items)
DigiDesign (59ea items INCLUDING Strike)
IK MultiMedia (1ea item)
Line6 (2ea items)
Trillium Lane Labs (4ea items)

>>
Even if you are not instantiating outdated plugins, just having them active in the plugins folder can cause big problems.
<<
I didn't know that. OK, I just uninstalled Reason Adapted 4, Torq and 2ea Izotope plug-ins.

NOTE: Since the Bomb Factory and Trillium stuff isn't listed in Windows "Add/Remove Programs" I don't know how to uninstall them (as of yet I have not used them).

>>
Also which Firewire controller are you using for your 003?
<<
I don't remember the model number but... it is a card I purchased per the spec listed on the DigiDesign web site last January 2008 (when I had the PC built). The card contains the TI chip.

FYI, although I run with the TI card, the 003 also works the same with the motherboard's firewire.

>>
Do you have your 003 connected to the FW port driven by the Avlab Technology TSB43AB23 chip?
<<
Yes (it shows up on the SANDRA report)

>>
Have you tried faster/different RAM?
<<
No.

>>
DDR2-800 is fairly slow for that motherboard.
>>
Slow? Did I screw up somethng? Are my 800s causing these problems?

At the time of my build (January 2008) FASTER chips were available. As I revisit my build spec emails to the local PC shop, this is what I found...

"
---->ItemNo:A4300563--CORSAIR TWIN2X2048-8500C5D 2048MB XMS2-8 Qty: 2
Holy $#!%... a $290 increase to the bottom line?... AND that's after taking the mouse and keyboard off?... AND I don't get to "use" the 4th gb?!!! haHahaHaha... forget that! Use the 800s.
"

I had to chuckle when I saw "that" quote (what a cheapskate I am).

Looks like there's a promo ($78 for 4gb AFTER rebate) on these Corsairs until Feb 15th. What do you think? Will it be a PROBLEM SOLVER?

----------------
Updated two plug-ins (not availible when I got PT8) and removed others (as mentioned above) I started work on a session and here is the result:
----------------

PROBLEM: #11
Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 1024
RTAS Processors = 3
CPU Usage Limit = 95%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

Playback stops (not quite completing the 2nd pass on a LARGE loop)

ERROR MESSAGE:
The operating system held off interupts for too long. If this occurs often, try increasing the "HW Buffer Size" in the Playback Engine Dialog box -9094.
----------------

Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 1024
RTAS Processors = 4
CPU Usage Limit = 85%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

Hmmmmm... strange... I expected an error to pop up a lot quicker after INCREASING Processors and DECREASING Usage Limit. Instead I completed 7 passes on the LARGE loop WITHOUT getting an error (finally had to stop to move on to the next song part).

Played around with a SMALL loop for about an hour without incident.

Increased my selection loop to include BOTH previous selections and started to play along. COULD NOT COMPLETE the first pass. Same error. I'm noticing (when it does occur) it's in the same area of the song (right after a big crash crescendo/break). FYI, my Strike cymbals are set to medium (playback quality).

ERROR MESSAGE:
The operating system held off interupts for too long. If this occurs often, try increasing the "HW Buffer Size" in the Playback Engine Dialog box -9094.

Another thing I noticed is I DID NOT have to REBOOT the PC during my 2.5hr session (which was nice for a change). Still haven't added any sugar to any of the waveform tracks though.

-------------------
BTW, since I am on the front end of this digital audio experience AND out of curiosity... GIVEN... a quad core, 4gb ram and a dedicated 7200rpm audio recording drive AND... IF everything WAS working just fine... what do YOU GUYS think I should "reasonably expect" for an average "active" TRACK and PLUG-IN count?

Well I'm hungry... time for some chow.

THANX AGAIN for your time... Frankie J (^_^)
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  #6  
Old 02-11-2009, 01:59 AM
bblue bblue is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: El Cajon, CA USA
Posts: 209
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by yyyesbaby View Post
Before I respond I forgot to mention in the starting message post... when I was using 7.4 I had to reboot maybe 2-4 times per month. Since committing to PT 8.0 it's about 6-12 times per session.
With any PT version it's usually a good idea to reboot every few days, at least.

Quote:
No. BEFORE I updated to PT8 I got ahold of Line6 (for PodFarm & GearBox), IK MultiMedia (for ARC) & DigiDesign (for Strike). All manufacturers assured me they were compatible with PT8.
For the purposes of testing to determine the cause of errors like you're having it's best to remove anything that didn't come with PT8.

Quote:
>>
Do you think you could generate a plugin list?
<<
Generate? How do you "generate" a list? If you mean MANUALLY type a list of ALL plug-ins then... uhhhh... how about this (NOTE: all items taken from Pro Tools LE 7.4 and/or 8.0 "bundled packages" EXCEPT for IK MultiMedia, Line6 & Strike):
You can generate a list with version numbers from the Digidesign Tech Support Utility. It's in the Downloads section of the website.

Quote:
>>
Even if you are not instantiating outdated plugins, just having them active in the plugins folder can cause big problems.
<<
I didn't know that. OK, I just uninstalled Reason Adapted 4, Torq and 2ea Izotope plug-ins.

NOTE: Since the Bomb Factory and Trillium stuff isn't listed in Windows "Add/Remove Programs" I don't know how to uninstall them (as of yet I have not used them).
All RTAS plug-ins live in the directory c:\program files\common files\digidesign\DAE\plugins. There is a .dpm and .rsr file for each plugin. Simply move an appropriate pair out of that directory (into the 'unused' directory, for example). You don't actually have to go through the uninstall process except for permanent removals. Moving them just prevents PT from seeing them when it runs.

Quote:
>>
Also which Firewire controller are you using for your 003?
<<
I don't remember the model number but... it is a card I purchased per the spec listed on the DigiDesign web site last January 2008 (when I had the PC built). The card contains the TI chip.

FYI, although I run with the TI card, the 003 also works the same with the motherboard's firewire.
Confirm that the 003 is really connected to the card with the TI chip.

Quote:
>>
Have you tried faster/different RAM?
<<
No.

>>
DDR2-800 is fairly slow for that motherboard.
>>
Slow? Did I screw up somethng? Are my 800s causing these problems?

At the time of my build (January 2008) FASTER chips were available. As I revisit my build spec emails to the local PC shop, this is what I found...

"
---->ItemNo:A4300563--CORSAIR TWIN2X2048-8500C5D 2048MB XMS2-8 Qty: 2
Holy $#!%... a $290 increase to the bottom line?... AND that's after taking the mouse and keyboard off?... AND I don't get to "use" the 4th gb?!!! haHahaHaha... forget that! Use the 800s.
"

I had to chuckle when I saw "that" quote (what a cheapskate I am).

Looks like there's a promo ($78 for 4gb AFTER rebate) on these Corsairs until Feb 15th. What do you think? Will it be a PROBLEM SOLVER?
Not a guarantee that faster RAM will fix all (or any) of the problems you're describing, but it will certainly improve overall performance.

You should be able to find good DDR2-1333 RAM for about that same price (as the sale).

Quote:
PROBLEM: #11
Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 1024
RTAS Processors = 3
CPU Usage Limit = 95%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

Playback stops (not quite completing the 2nd pass on a LARGE loop)

ERROR MESSAGE:
The operating system held off interupts for too long. If this occurs often, try increasing the "HW Buffer Size" in the Playback Engine Dialog box -9094.
----------------

Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 1024
RTAS Processors = 4
CPU Usage Limit = 85%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

Hmmmmm... strange... I expected an error to pop up a lot quicker after INCREASING Processors and DECREASING Usage Limit. Instead I completed 7 passes on the LARGE loop WITHOUT getting an error (finally had to stop to move on to the next song part).

Played around with a SMALL loop for about an hour without incident.

Increased my selection loop to include BOTH previous selections and started to play along. COULD NOT COMPLETE the first pass. Same error. I'm noticing (when it does occur) it's in the same area of the song (right after a big crash crescendo/break). FYI, my Strike cymbals are set to medium (playback quality).

ERROR MESSAGE:
The operating system held off interupts for too long. If this occurs often, try increasing the "HW Buffer Size" in the Playback Engine Dialog box -9094.

Another thing I noticed is I DID NOT have to REBOOT the PC during my 2.5hr session (which was nice for a change). Still haven't added any sugar to any of the waveform tracks though.
I usually run the disk cache size at LARGE rather than NORMAL. It can eliminate transient problems. Sometimes, moving the buffer size to 2048 will help smooth things out.

Quote:
-------------------
BTW, since I am on the front end of this digital audio experience AND out of curiosity... GIVEN... a quad core, 4gb ram and a dedicated 7200rpm audio recording drive AND... IF everything WAS working just fine... what do YOU GUYS think I should "reasonably expect" for an average "active" TRACK and PLUG-IN count?
Dozens. Easily.

Do you still get the same symptoms when not using Strike? I have since switched to BFD2, but when I was using Strike I found that it was quite memory hungry even at what should be modest settings, AND it started acting strangely (it and the entire system) after making a series of kit piece substitutions, mixer changes, etc. Once things got to that point the only solution was to close PT and restart.

Are you using the /3G switch in boot.ini to get the extra 1G memory allocation to the OS? Without it, PT will quickly run out of memory, especially with hungry VI's.

Most of the problems you describe can be caused by inadequate memory, sluggish disk i/o, or just poor system performance in general, including a heavily fragmented PT data disk. A few of the really crazy messages you're getting could happen with PT is running memory starved (past the point of just starting to have errors) or there is a hardware problem such as bad RAM, flaky mobo, etc. But since everything seemed ok in 7.4 we can at least for now rule out bad hardware issues.

I've seen almost all these issues at one time or another when PT8 (especially) runs memory starved, but it can also happen with PT7.

I hope something from this might be helpful.

--Bill

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Asus P6T DLX, Intel i7-920 OC'd to 3.2GHz, 6GB DDR3-1600 (triple), Win XP Pro SP3, PTLE 8cs2, MPTK2, Black Lion 003R, UAD-2 Duo, UA 2192
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  #7  
Old 02-11-2009, 10:40 PM
yyyesbaby yyyesbaby is offline
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Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Posts: 33
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Hi Bill,

THANK YOU for your reply.

>>
With any PT version it's usually a good idea to reboot every few days, at least.
<<
Actually I boot into the day's work using a Device Profile set up for PT then (when I'm done for the day) I boot out using my default Device Profile (which accomodates my backup and network strategies). My "2-4" times per month" comment had to do with comparing the reboot counts between 7.4 and 8.0 (due to locks, freezes, digital feedback, etc.).

I have three Device Profiles:
DEFAULT
For non-Protools use.
PROTOOLS
When sitting at the desk.
PROTOOLS+NETWORK

When recording (I sit in front of my amp). I use Windows Remote Desktop because I can't reach the 003.

>>
For the purposes of testing to determine the cause of errors like you're having it's best to remove anything that didn't come with PT8.
<<
I know... you're right (I like to play instead of troubleshoot).

>>
You can generate a list with version numbers from the Digidesign Tech Support Utility.
<<
Opps!... I've used that to trash databases and preferences. Didn't register that the utility did more than that... duh.

I see that the "Utility" report picked up the \Line 6 subDir under the \Plug-ins folder. Can I create subDir(s) under the \plug-ins(unused) folder (so I can organize that stuff) and the report will pick it up also?

>>
You don't actually have to go through the uninstall... Moving them just prevents PT from seeing them when it runs.
<<
yyyyyyyyesBaby !! THANK YOU very much.

>>
Confirm that the 003 is really connected to the card with the TI chip.
<<
The wire goes from the 003 to the card.

>>
Not a guarantee that faster RAM will fix all (or any) of the problems you're describing, but it will certainly improve overall performance.
<<
What do you mean by "overall performance"? My display and... the "mechanics" of using the GUI and... the 003 hardware... already feels snappy. Is there some "extra headroom" benifit (in thwarting potential errors) by using FASTER RAM?

>>
You should be able to find good DDR2-1333 RAM for about that same price (as the sale).
<<
Any particular Brand/Model for the RAM?

>>
Dozens. Easily.
<<
Huh? (grumble, grumble)... I'm using 4-5 plug-ins!! I just GOTTA get this rig dialed in!!!

>>
Do you still get the same symptoms when not using Strike?
<<
Strike has always been in the plug-ins folder ever since I first installed Pro Tools.

When you say "not using Strike" do you mean... put it in the UNUSED folder?

>>
I have since switched to BFD2, but when I was using Strike I found that it was quite memory hungry even at what should be modest settings, AND it started acting strangely (it and the entire system) after making a series of kit piece substitutions, mixer changes, etc. Once things got to that point the only solution was to close PT and restart.
<<
NO NO NO... don't tell me that. Strike's my drummer buddy!!

I thought I did my homework back when I got the 003. I needed a drum plug-in and everybody (DigiTechs, Music Store, friends) said to bite the bullet on the $300 and get Strike. Digi did mention it was a memory hog but that I wouldn't have a problem with a Quad + 4Gb + dedicated local drives.

My only bitch with it is... the style editor SUCKS. Other than that... it's tones, subPlug-in capabilities (mics, EQ, effects, etc), kit builder, mixer, and huamanizing algorithms are all GREAT!

Maybe if I get to know it's configuration settings menu a little better (especially since I use it ONLY to RECEIVE midi data).

>>
Are you using the /3G switch in boot.ini to get the extra 1G memory allocation to the OS? Without it, PT will quickly run out of memory, especially with hungry VI's.
<<
No but... I am now! yyyyyyyyesBaby !! THANK YOU very much.

>>
Most of the problems you describe can be caused by inadequate memory,
<<
I'm maxed on the RAM. My drives are set up as follows:
C: Internal 80Gb 10,000 rpm - system drive
D: Internal 500Gb 7,200 rpm - audio drive
E: Internal 500Gb 7,200 rpm - used for Ghost backups, plug-in settings and a 3Gb Virtual Memory PageFile
G: External 250Gb - for MP3 storage

Does PT8 benifit from a PageFile (I create one on all my PCs out of habit)?

>>
sluggish disk i/o,
<<
This one's over my head. I don't know what controls (or how I can control) this.

>>
or just poor system performance in general, including a heavily fragmented PT data disk.
<<
I defrag once a month.

>>
A few of the really crazy messages you're getting could happen with PT is running memory starved (past the point of just starting to have errors)
<<
I'm sure there's memory issues. I'm just not tech savvy enough to know how to troubleshoot and fine tune... other than with the OS/Hardware setup guides I get from the Digi web site.

>>
or there is a hardware problem such as bad RAM, flaky mobo, etc.
<<
No No No No No... NO bad hardware... No No No No No. <grin>

>>
But since everything seemed ok in 7.4 we can at least for now rule out bad hardware issues.
<<
Phew!... thank you.

>>
I've seen almost all these issues at one time or another when PT8 (especially) runs memory starved, but it can also happen with PT7.
<<
Why do you say... "PT8 (especially)"??? The more PT matures... the more you need to treat it with kit gloves???

>>
I hope something from this might be helpful.
<<
Something was... yyyyyyyyesBaby !!

I just did a 6hr session... including walking away for an hour from the open (non-playing) session.

Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 512
RTAS Processors = 4
CPU Usage Limit = 85%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

NO ERRORS... NO REBOOTING... 5 ROCK SOLID hours of FUN... yyyyyyyyesBaby !!

The only thing I noticed was PT took about 5-6 seconds to kick in AFTER I was away for that hour I mentioned (above).

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU. You wouldn't happen to be female would you? <grin>

New question:
Last year (when I first got the 003) I got all excited and transfered some of my analog multi track tape stuff (2 days worth of work not including setup) at... 88.2. I have since learned to use 96 as the default. The material is Classic Rock style uptempo and ballads. Is converting 88.2 files to 96 (within PT) noticable or... do I need to transfer the tape again at 96?

Well.. I'm gonna make some more noise.

THANX AGAIN for your time... Frankie J (^_^)
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  #8  
Old 02-11-2009, 10:54 PM
TOM@METRO's Avatar
TOM@METRO TOM@METRO is online now
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Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Is converting 88.2 files to 96 (within PT) noticable or... do I need to transfer the tape again at 96?

Why not just leave them at 88.2. There is a school of thought that insists that the conversion back to 44.1 is cleaner that way.
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  #9  
Old 02-12-2009, 11:36 AM
yyyesbaby yyyesbaby is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Posts: 33
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Hi Tom,

THANK YOU for the reply.

>>
Why not just leave them at 88.2. There is a school of thought that insists that the conversion back to 44.1 is cleaner that way.
<<
My simple mind figured 88.2 to 44.1 was easy math which is why I started out at 88.2. Personally, I don't know why I should track at anything above 44.1 (or 48 depending on the media/job). But then again, I'm no media guru. I haven't a clue what goes on (in the back room) when it comes to conversion processes, filtering, antialiasing, algorithms, future trends, etc.

What I have seen is... a lot of industry facilities use 96 (and even 192) as standards. My 003 is capable up to 96. There's probably a reason for that but I don't know what it is.

I want my stuff to be portable (adhering to industry standards).

WHAT I DON'T KNOW is... what path should I take (from an audio quality standpoint involving "rock" style material)?

1) Letting PT convert 88.2 to 96?
-or-
2) Re-transfering all the 88.2 material again (re-recording at 96 instead)?

If there is NO LOSS IN SOUND QUALITY by using #1 then I would pick #1 (obviously... less work).

Since I'm new to this stuff, I'm looking for opinions from users more experienced than me (which there should be plenty of <grin>).

THANK YOU for your time... Frankie J (^_^)
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  #10  
Old 02-13-2009, 06:42 PM
bblue bblue is offline
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Posts: 209
Default Re: Pro Tools 8 LE multiple problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by yyyesbaby View Post
When recording (I sit in front of my amp). I use Windows Remote Desktop because I can't reach the 003.

While in theory it shouldn't matter, you might find behavioral differences in PT while running remote desktop. If some of the errors you report occur when RDT is active, try them experimentally without RDT for comparison.

Quote:
I see that the "Utility" report picked up the \Line 6 subDir under the \Plug-ins folder. Can I create subDir(s) under the \plug-ins(unused) folder (so I can organize that stuff) and the report will pick it up also?
I believe so.

Quote:

What do you mean by "overall performance"? My display and... the "mechanics" of using the GUI and... the 003 hardware... already feels snappy. Is there some "extra headroom" benifit (in thwarting potential errors) by using FASTER RAM?

Mostly, it would improve PT and overall system performance when PT was active with lots of plug-ins, virtual instruments, tracks, etc. As you add more and more tasks for PT to maintain it makes demands on the entire system, so anything that can be done to improve speed and performance will improve how PT operates. But if you aren't dealing with high track counts, plug-ins and all, it shouldn't be an issue.

Usually any of the name brands, Corsair, OCZ, Patriot, etc., are good choices. It's more a matter of the RAM specs than the specific brand.

Quote:
When you say "not using Strike" do you mean... put it in the UNUSED folder?
No, when you're just not using it. I.E., it's not an active plug-in for that session.

I have since switched to BFD2, but when I was using Strike I found that it was quite memory hungry even at what should be modest settings, AND it started acting strangely (it and the entire system) after making a series of kit piece substitutions, mixer changes, etc. Once things got to that point the only solution was to close PT and restart.

Quote:
NO NO NO... don't tell me that. Strike's my drummer buddy!!

I thought I did my homework back when I got the 003. I needed a drum plug-in and everybody (DigiTechs, Music Store, friends) said to bite the bullet on the $300 and get Strike. Digi did mention it was a memory hog but that I wouldn't have a problem with a Quad + 4Gb + dedicated local drives.

My only bitch with it is... the style editor SUCKS. Other than that... it's tones, subPlug-in capabilities (mics, EQ, effects, etc), kit builder, mixer, and huamanizing algorithms are all GREAT!

Maybe if I get to know it's configuration settings menu a little better (especially since I use it ONLY to RECEIVE midi data).


Those were much the same arguments I heard before buying Strike. As long as you're aware of its peculiarities and recognize the behavior patterns and when it's time to re-run PT it can do a fine job. But it can be frustrating and confusing otherwise.

BFD2 is not without its own anomalies, they're just more subtle and less destructive.

Quote:
Does PT8 benifit from a PageFile (I create one on all my PCs out of habit)?

Since the 32-bit OS's that PT requires to run are memory-limited to 3G, it's a good idea to have the pagefile configured. Usually at 1.5 to 2x the amount of RAM, though some use a size the same as RAM. It only matters when there's a lot of paging going on, and for typical PT systems it shouldn't be that much.


Quote:
>>
I've seen almost all these issues at one time or another when PT8 (especially) runs memory starved, but it can also happen with PT7.
<<
Why do you say... "PT8 (especially)"??? The more PT matures... the more you need to treat it with kit gloves???


Well, er, yes. The PT8 we're using is a first release and is, uh, pretty far from bug-free.

Quote:
I just did a 6hr session... including walking away for an hour from the open (non-playing) session.
Quote:
Playback Engine settings were set at
H/W Buffer = 512
RTAS Processors = 4
CPU Usage Limit = 85%
RTAS Engine = unchecked
Disk Buffer Size = Level 2
Cache Size = Normal

NO ERRORS... NO REBOOTING... 5 ROCK SOLID hours of FUN... yyyyyyyyesBaby !!

The only thing I noticed was PT took about 5-6 seconds to kick in AFTER I was away for that hour I mentioned (above).

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU. You wouldn't happen to be female would you? <grin>


Ah, no.

It's not unusual for PT to delay a little bit after being idle for a period of time. The OS writes parts of inactive processes to the pagefile, and that delay is their recovery.

I think most of your recent session success was the increase of memory from the addition of /3G.

Quote:
Last year (when I first got the 003) I got all excited and transfered some of my analog multi track tape stuff (2 days worth of work not including setup) at... 88.2. I have since learned to use 96 as the default. The material is Classic Rock style uptempo and ballads. Is converting 88.2 files to 96 (within PT) noticable or... do I need to transfer the tape again at 96?


If you really have to have those sessions at 96k for compatibility with an external 'standard', I'd re-transfer them. otherwise, leave them at 88.2k. I saw tom@metro's reply about the 88.2/44.1 relationship, and while there are a number of people that prefer that 2:1 relationship, I don't believe it matters all that much whether you step down from 96k or 88.2k because of the way the resampling occurs.

I usually record and track everything at 96k (even if starting with 48k or 44.1k tracks recorded elsewhere), and bounce final mixes to 48k. They then stay at 48k for any subsequent post, until the final pre-mastering stage which is dithered to 16-bit and forever left alone after that. Always use Tweak-head conversion level when asked.

--Bill
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Asus P6T DLX, Intel i7-920 OC'd to 3.2GHz, 6GB DDR3-1600 (triple), Win XP Pro SP3, PTLE 8cs2, MPTK2, Black Lion 003R, UAD-2 Duo, UA 2192
Monitoring: 24-bit dig to Avocet Crane Song controller, Pass Labs x250.5 amp, B&K N801 monitors, Transparent Audio analog cabling
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