Avid Pro Audio Community




Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post | Community Terms of Use | Avid.com Home Page

Google the Forum | Search Knowledge Base | Search Avid.com

Find Support | Support FAQ | Avid Support How To Video Series

Software Updates, Drivers, Manuals, Compatibility, Troubleshooting, etc. (Links)

Please post your message once only to the correct forum
Help us Help You - READ THIS Before Posting!



Pro Tools 11 Information









Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Post & Surround > Pro Tools Post & Surround

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-08-2005, 09:21 PM
TheMixShop TheMixShop is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 111
Default Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Hi all,

Here's what we got from the WB last year. The notes on audio levels read as follows:

"The audio dynamic range of program material must be suitable for television broadcast. Instantaneous audio peaks must not exceed +14db, average peaks should not exceed +2db, and average dialog should not be less than -8db".

If -20 = 0, do we all understand this as
*-6 = instantaneous audio peaks
*-18 = average peaks
*-20 = 0
*-28 = lowest dialogue?

The QC guys at the dub house got us into the habit of never exceeding -10.

1) Have the QC guys already seen the audio spec sheet from the various networks?

2) What about spots/promos... do certain mixes get as hot as -4 to -6. Do those commercials get QC'd?

3) Any differance in delivering Surround vs Stereo mixes?

BTW, here's how Fox's reads:
"Relative to test level (nominal -20dbFS), instantaneous audio peaks must not exceed 2dbFS, average peaks should not exceed -4dbFS, and average dialogue should not be less than 10dbFS".

These where given to us for 1/2 hour format TV series that we do. Comments on this topic by all, I'm sure would be helpful for all.


Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-09-2005, 11:57 AM
soundeziner soundeziner is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 262
Default Re: Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Sorry I can't answer those specific questions but thanks for posting the spec's. This type of issue/question is not uncommon lately. See threads; On broadcast levels and QC , Broadcast Audio Levels for PBS?? , and Levels for TV/Movies

I'd also like to know what kind of level standards you all are being given for live uplinks?


Perhaps DIGI could make this a permanent thread for this forum?
__________________
Todd A. Judge, MPSE
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-09-2005, 07:42 PM
Dallas Taylor Dallas Taylor is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 320
Default Re: Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

I'm a Live TV Sound Mixer for Fox 11, UPN 13, and others here in LA. I've worked for 6 stations and various national shows, and I have never been -told- any hard and fast rules for Broadcast Levels. There has got to be a set of standards somewhere, right? Here is what I do:

Never exceed -4
Ave. dialogue -12
Music and Nat Sounds -20

These are News and Sports show mind you and these are only guidelines. The main thing I am watching for is keeping my average peaks at -12. I guess I'm doing things right since I've never been approached by any Master Control/QC people. To answer "MixShop's" question about promos.. I -know- that there are promos that are getting pushed way above what I mix at, but usually they are only the more amateur local promos. Generally when you hear quality national spots that sound hot it's more likely that they are 1. More heavily compressed or 2. The "percieved" level is higher (through EQ or whatever). Great mixes with a full harmonic range sound much louder than what the meters will show. Meters are only meters. In the line of work that I do, I have to mix a lot of different voices. Sometimes I have to ignore the meters because someone's voice just carries better. If I mixed them @ -12 they sound way to hot.

Now as far as Stereo is concerned, I don't make a big fuss out of it... and I won't until everyone's watching HDTVs. The reason is because 95% of televisions out there are crap and if you put something too far in the right or too far in the left your mix will sound aweful. Just remember what your mixing for. It'll sound fantastic in the studio, but aweful over tiny little TV speakers. We don't have the luxury of our audience hearing our work in a big quiet room with 15 high quality speakers and an audience that is actually paying attention like the movie guys... (Just teasing... out of the hundreds of theatres I've been in, I've only been in 2 or 3 that actually sound good.)

I'd be interested to hear other people chime in on this subject. It would be awesome if this was a "pinned" thread. This stuff comes up every other day. Where's Dr. Sound?

Dallas
__________________

DALLAS TAYLOR CAS/MPSE
/// Sound Designer/Mixer @ Defacto \\\ Twitter Facebook
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-09-2005, 09:26 PM
TheMixShop TheMixShop is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 111
Default Re: Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Thanks for jumping in guys. I spoke to someone at Turner who mentioned the-4/-6 thing as the limit they were allowed with regards to surround (I don't recall all the details). I thought he was saying that the QCer's allowed that level when delivering surround (sorry, the chat was a while back).

In trying to research and get into Surround, I've come accross many notes about calibration and levels which has me going back to making sure the stereo stuff we do is of proper levels and quality!

Do we have any QC people in the house who can share what they have gotten?

Also, is it too soon to talk about how DialNorm and network compression works with all of this?

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-10-2005, 09:38 AM
TVPostSound TVPostSound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,647
Default DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Here are the specs for ALL SD broadcasts on Discovery stations (Travel/History channels etc)

STANDARD DEFINITION AUDIO REQUIREMENTS:

Audio program material shall be produced using industry standard and accepted
norms for good practice and workmanship. The audio portion of the master and
source audio and videotapes must be produced so that no noise, static, dropouts
or extraneous distortion is recorded in the audio.

Audio channels - Stereo audio must be fully mono compatible. The audio channels
must be in the proper phase. NOTE: Full Mono Compatibility means that when the
left and right stereo channels are actively combined to mono there is no
discernible change in audio level or fidelity. Full mix and split audio tracks
should be phase coherent (synchronized) to prevent difficulty editing between
these tracks, as necessary.

Audio Levels: Program audio must reflect reference tone level. Audio levels must
be consistent throughout the program.. Transmission limiters clip at +8 dB. FOR
BROADCAST "FULL MIX" TRACKS, TRANSIENT AUDIO PEAKS MUST NOT EXCEED +10 dB ABOVE
REFERENCE TONE WHEN MEASURED ON AN AUDIO METER USING THE "TRUE PEAK" BALLISTIC
SET (0 MS RISE, 200 MS FALL). FOR SECONDARY AUDIO TRACKS, SUCH AS MUSIC AND
EFFECTS TRACKS, AND AUDIO ELEMENTS, PEAK LEVELS MUST NOT RISE ABOVE +17 dB (-3
dbfs). When mastering to a digital format and/or using an full scale or peak
meter, where "0" is at the top of the scale and reference tone is at -20 dBfs,
audio for the "full mix" tracks should peak at no more than -10 dBfs.

When using an analog meter, though the ballistics of analog VU meters vary
greatly, the average program audio level of -2 to -5 dB will roughly equal 10 dB
of headroom and not exceed specifications for peak limits. However, all shows
should be evaluated using a peak sensitive meter to assure adherence with
transmission specifications.

Pre-emphasis: FM transmission modulators (USA) use the 75 microsecond
pre-emphasis curve. All signal processing must take into account the
pre-emphasis curve. Improper "Sweetening", i.e. excessive equalization in the
higher frequencies, can cause sibilance and severe distortion and should be
avoided.

Audio compression: Program audio should have good dynamic range, but not be
overly dynamic. While some compression may be needed to control the dynamic
range of the program audio, excessive audio compression of the final mix should
be avoided as this reduces the perception of audio quality by the listener.
Audio signal peaks should be approximately 8 to 10 db above program reference
levels, and average loudness measurements should be comparable to reference
levels.
__________________
Now mixing:
Cold Justice Season 3 (TNT)
Top Chef Season 12 (Bravo)
To Chef Duels Season 1 (Bravo)


Formerly DIAFXMX here on the DUC!!
IMDB
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-10-2005, 09:40 AM
TVPostSound TVPostSound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,647
Default Re: DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Here are the HD specs for DCI


HIGH DEFINITION AUDIO REQUIREMENTS:

Audio program material shall be produced using industry standard and accepted
norms for good practice and workmanship. The audio portion of the master and
source audio and videotapes must be produced so that no noise, static, dropouts
or extraneous distortion is recorded in the audio.

Audio channels - Stereo audio must be fully mono compatible. The audio channels
must be in the proper phase. NOTE: Full Mono Compatibility means that when the
left and right stereo channels are actively combined to mono there is no
discernible change in audio level or fidelity. Full mix and split audio tracks
should be phase coherent (synchronized) to prevent difficulty editing between
these tracks, as necessary.

Audio Levels: Program audio must reflect reference tone level. Audio levels must
be consistent throughout the program.. Transmission limiters clip at +8 dB. FOR
BROADCAST "FULL MIX" TRACKS, TRANSIENT AUDIO PEAKS MUST NOT EXCEED +10 dB ABOVE
REFERENCE TONE WHEN MEASURED ON AN AUDIO METER USING THE "TRUE PEAK" BALLISTIC
SET (0 MS RISE, 200 MS FALL). FOR SECONDARY AUDIO TRACKS AND 5.1 SURROUND MIXES,
PEAK LEVELS MUST NOT RISE ABOVE +17 dB (-3 dbfs). When mastering to a digital
format and/or using an full scale or peak meter, where "0" is at the top of the
scale and reference tone is at -20 dBfs, audio for the "full mix" tracks should
peak at no more than -10 dBfs.

When using an analog meter, though the ballistics of analog VU meters vary
greatly, the average program audio level of -2 to -5 dB will roughly equal 10 dB
of headroom and not exceed specifications for peak limits. However, all shows
should be evaluated using a peak sensitive meter to assure adherence with
transmission specifications.

Pre-emphasis: FM transmission modulators (USA) use the 75 microsecond
pre-emphasis curve. All signal processing must take into account the
pre-emphasis curve. Improper "Sweetening", i.e. excessive equalization in the
higher frequencies, can cause sibilance and severe distortion and should be
avoided.

Audio compression: Program audio should have good dynamic range, but not be
overly dynamic. While some compression may be needed to control the dynamic
range of the program audio, excessive audio compression of the final mix should
be avoided as this reduces the perception of audio quality by the listener.
Audio signal peaks should be approximately 8 to 10 db above program reference
levels, and average loudness measurements should be comparable to reference
levels.
__________________
Now mixing:
Cold Justice Season 3 (TNT)
Top Chef Season 12 (Bravo)
To Chef Duels Season 1 (Bravo)


Formerly DIAFXMX here on the DUC!!
IMDB
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-10-2005, 11:57 AM
JRogers JRogers is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Knoxville, TN.
Posts: 69
Default Re: DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

I have the same specs for DCI but I hear there has was a different set sent to the office a few months ago.
We have had conflicting reports back from QC about audio levels. The latest is that if we get above -12dB for our peaks they tell us that the level may be too hot and the layback needs to be redone. I just tell them we are going by the specs that we were given in writing and we are within their guidelines. They are a little frustrating to deal with sometimes since it seems different people have different specs.
If I can get the new specs sent to me I will put them up here.

It would be great to keep copies of network specs up here in a thread.


Jim
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-10-2005, 01:01 PM
manichouse manichouse is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 299
Default Re: DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

It's a shame that they don't seem to enforce those specs on their commercials though...
Nothing like watching a show you mixed at their specs and then BOOM!!!!!!! HERE'S A COMMERCIAL!! You can hear the broadcast limiters pumping and breathing...

Martin Trum
manichouse@mac.com
__________________
Martin Trum
Sound Propulsion Labs
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-10-2005, 01:07 PM
Eric L Eric L is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 574
Default Re: DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

Quote:
Pre-emphasis: FM transmission modulators (USA) use the 75 microsecond
pre-emphasis curve. All signal processing must take into account the
pre-emphasis curve. Improper "Sweetening", i.e. excessive equalization in the
higher frequencies, can cause sibilance and severe distortion and should be
avoided.

How would one apply the "pre-emphasis curve" in Pro Tools while sweetening? I'm not familiar with the curves specs.

Thanks
__________________
Eric Lalicata C.A.S.
Supervising Sound Editor
Re-Recording Mixer
Anarchy Post
1811 Victory Blvd
Glendale, CA 91201
818-334-3300
www.anarchypost.net
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-10-2005, 02:15 PM
1150Post 1150Post is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 431
Default Re: DCI Audio Specs for Television Broadcast

FWIW, DCI is in the process of building their own uplink facility her ein the DC area, so things may be changing. Haven't seen anything as of yet, but I'll snoop around and see if anyone has a glimps at the future!

Also, I'm not sure all of their networks will then be in house transmission.

Brad McIlvaine
Sr. Mixer/Designer
Henninger Media Services
Washimgton, DC 20036
__________________
Brad McIlvaine
Sr. Mixer/Designer
Henninger Media Services
Washington, DC 20036
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Specs for Broadcast, Leq(a), Peak audio and reference level yazoo Pro Tools Post & Surround 7 04-04-2011 08:26 AM
What is TV broadcast specs for the UK? citysoundman Pro Tools Post & Surround 15 12-02-2009 07:09 AM
Sound Broadcast Specs in UK tj_davies Pro Tools Post & Surround 9 01-10-2008 09:29 AM
Questions on Broadcast Specs sundontlie Pro Tools Post & Surround 8 01-07-2008 01:48 PM
Broadcast Specs Pirate Post Pro Tools Post & Surround 3 09-21-2003 10:28 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:34 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com