Damn Low End!!!

[JFreak]

Originally Posted by AlexLakis

Also to note that toms in most mixes sound VERY boomy in my 2000 and 2006 Toyota Camrys (stock systems.)

car systems often over-emphasize (nicely said) low end, so what you should do is take a reference mix and tune your car to sound almost right with it before judging anything else

[amagras]

The best remedy I've found for the low end of my mixes is HPFs, once I have the low area clean I only have to find a place where the bass and kick sound good and groove together, then I cut below and add as much bass as I want.

Occasional referencing and testing in different systems helps. There was a time when I went to the car around 200 times a day but once I got a few mixes to translate there I didn't need to do it anymore. Keep in mind that most mixes sound pretty different from each other in cars so better take this test with a grain of salt. Hope this helps

[JFreak]

Oh yea, HPF is your friend. Once you set it low enough to find problems, you know where your room needs work. That is also true with PA systems by the way

[AlexLakis]

Originally Posted by JFreak

car systems often over-emphasize (nicely said) low end, so what you should do is take a reference mix and tune your car to sound almost right with it before judging anything else

Or just get used to the sound and know what to compensate for. After 18 years, I know the 2000 Camry pretty well. I test the mixes with the car stereo EQ flat (how I listen to music in there), and then with the traditional "smiley-face" EQ (bas +5 / treb +4). If it sounds decent on both settings, I'm doing well.

[BScout]

Originally Posted by Raoul23

It helps flatten your room so yes should help with null/sum nodes


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nope. No eq calibration can fix a null (room mode). Placement and room treatment can, though.

If you think it through you'll see why... no matter how much amplitude you drive or cut a nulling frequency, the inverse from boundary conditions will still always null the initial wave for a net sum of zero.

If you want to see where these issues exist for your listening position, take a sine sweep measurement and calculate the excess group delay plot. Any peaks (deviations from 0) are points where eq room correction will not help.

[albee1952]

+1 for using headphones as an alt reference as that negates the room acoustics. Having said that, I think the first step in solving this issue is to find out exactly what is happening between the speaker, the room and any acoustic treatment. There are 2 ways to do this:


#1-find someone that has Spectrafoo, SMAART Live or similar(any local sound company probably has someone on staff that has the proper hardware and experience to analyze your speakers in your room. They might charge you $100 to "shoot the room", but the info it reveals will probably be worth any dollar



#2-open a session and add a mono AUX track. Bring the fader down all the way and insert to stock Signal Generator plugin. Set the plugin to a sine wave and put the frequency setting for 500Hz. Now bring the fader up until you hear the tone(set the fader for a comfortable volume). Now, with a pencil and paper handy, start nudging the frequency(of the signal generator) lower and lower. As you do this, pay attention to the volume(using your ears) and if you hear the tone get noticeably softer or louder, make a note on your paper. Continue this until you reach the 30-40 Hz frequency. Now review your notes and look for where the volume changes(up or down) significantly. Odds are pretty good that you will hear some serious peaks and dips between 200Hz and 35-40 Hz. In my old room, there were 2 peaks of +12-13db, and 2 holes of -13-14db, all between 40Hz and 200 Hz(measured at the mix position).



Knowing the frequencies that are on your list will help you so you don't EQ because of the response issue(its tough to make good EQ choices when you are not hearing an accurate representation. In my last room, SMAART Live showed a serious valley in response at 50Hz(with the calibrated mic placed where my head is when I mix. I added a sub-woofer and a a digital EQ and made EQ adjustments to make the sub-woofer fill in the area where the main speakers were deficient(the 50Hz area. Most sub-woofers don't have a ton of response adjustment so they would not be tuneable(the digital EQ solved that). The result was much more even low end when seated in the mix position(if I had a producer sitting on the couch, I would disable the sub as response on the couch was very accurate without the sub).


Last bit of info; many "affordable" subwoofers have really bad internal crossovers On the KRK Rokit sub I had, I was shocked at how much signal(was using pink noise for this) was passing. The crossover knob was all the way down to the 50Hz setting, but pink noise was unaffected all the way up to 150Hz This is what drove me to try the digital EQ(now part of my monitoring chain and will remain in place until it dies, or until I move to a new place(at which point, I will need to start over)

[YYR123]

Along with the other great ideas I will lower my mix quite a bit....and compare the mix Verses mixing at 80 db


Once you lower the mix what ever is loud stands out a bunch....im sure there is some science behind it...but I just know it helps point out problem areas

[Raoul23]

Thanks for chiming in guys!!! So crazy i just checked my latest mix on cheap iphone ear buds and it sounds killer. Bass guitar and kick are solid, its well balanced just how i want it to sound, so is it a mastering thing?? so that it translates well on all systems??

[crizdee]

Originally Posted by Raoul23

My studio is treated and I use ikmultimedia ARC2 to calibrate the room. My speakers are HS8M. Would investing in a sub help me to identify and control the low end better.

Hi,


Studio is treated with what? acoustic foam tiles do nothing for low end standing waves.


ARC2 throw in the bin and work on the room (just my opinion )




A sub will help you monitor the low end better than using just the HS8's but make sure you set it up correctly phased aligned and that it is just providing the sub that the HS8 can't do. if you can't hear whats going on down there you can't possibly get it right it will always be guess work. headphones will never cut it for low end work? you need to be able to reference the low end all the time not just check it occasionally on cans. there's no substitute for good full range monitors.



Maybe post up some pics of your room and speaker position




Chris

[crizdee]

Originally Posted by Raoul23

Thanks for chiming in guys!!! So crazy i just checked my latest mix on cheap iphone ear buds and it sounds killer. Bass guitar and kick are solid, its well balanced just how i want it to sound, so is it a mastering thing?? so that it translates well on all systems??

No


The problem is still there, Its just your buds aren't re-producing those frequencies.




Chris