001 user upgrade question - HD 96 vs MOTU 2408mk3

[fmckinnon]

Hi - I've posted this on the TDM board, as the HD system is TDM-based, but also wanted the opinions and input from fellow DIGI001 host-based users ... see message:

Hello -
I'm currently a DIGI001 PTLE user, and have been thinking about upgrading to the HD system at some time.
A couple of the things that have disappointed me the most with the PT systems are the # of available "simultaneous" inputs and the lacking of SMTPE sync. We do lots of live tracking on Tascam DA-XX series machines, and like to move it into ProTools for editing and mixing.

Given the price of the PT HD core system without the audio interface, what is the biggest reason to go HD vs something like the MOTO systems?

For example - what is the difference between the new HD 96 I/O unit vs. the new MOTU 2408mk3? Both have 96kz, both have 8 simultaneous inputs, and both have ADAT optical.

However, the MOTU also includes:
1) SMTPE time code sync (w/o buying somethign extra)
2) THREE banks of ADAT optical or TDIF (for 24 simultaneous digital inputs) vs only 8-channels of ADAT optical on the PT 96 i/o.
The interfaces are approximately the same list price ... around $2K. I guess the obvious difference is that the MOTU piece has it's own CORE system included.

I feel like I must be missing something here ... so if my question is totally ignorant - please excuse!

Seriously though - I'm a ProTools lover - I love the software, and I love the compatibility I have with PT.

Both pieces offer 96Kz ... so, what's the advantage of spending $10K+ for PT HD over $2K for more inputs, and 96kz??
(I'm assuming that you cannot use PT software with the MOTU piece, and I have no clue how the MOTU software compares to PT (AudioDesk?)

Thanks in advance,
Fred F. McKinnon

Highest Praise Productions, Inc

[Atana]

Originally posted by fmckinnon:
I'm assuming that you cannot use PT software with the MOTU piece, and I have no clue how the MOTU software compares to PT (AudioDesk?)
/URL]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, you can't run PT with MOTU hardware.
And, actually, it's Digital Performer. (You can get Audio Desk when you buy a MOTU system,
but it's a limited version.)

Come and join us!

http://www.unicornation.com/

You'll see a bunch of guys who're waiting so badly for an upgrade for DP3.1 which's going to have ultimate undo/redo with history...

About your other questions... Sorry, I have no idea!!

[manowar]

I dont think this question is ignorant at all!

The TDM, HD guys can give you the pros and cons from there end, they would know better...
But HD is a lot of $.

The Motu stuff will NOT work with PT. You get Audiodesk (stripped down version of their flagship Digital Performer, which you can buy for about $500)

I havent used the 2408mk3, but i have seen it in use. Mostly guys doing what you are (loading tons of ADAT in).

The main thing i always felt was the reason for TDM and HD was, better sound quality, no latency, unlimited tracks and smtpe. Take a ride to your local music store and ask for a DP demo. If you feel comfy, and if the TDM/HD guys can't come up with 10 grand worth of reasons that you personally find worth it, you might be better of with the MOTU.

If you like your 001, their 828 is similar, but with firewire. You can chain more than one together (i think up to 3).

MANOWAR!

PS - just so you know, I'm a know MOTU backer. So wait till you get some other opinions first! [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

[Atana]

Oh, I mean...sorry, I can't help you!
I'm gnorant! [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

Atana

[kenhawkins]

Originally posted by manowar:
.You get Audiodesk (stripped down version of their flagship Digital Performer, which you can buy for about $500)

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">i poked around their site and found that you can get a competative upgrade if you use PT LE and the cost is 395.00. i personally have been a 001 user since it hit the market however with my recent purchase of wavews GOLD 3.5 a host system is seeimg less and less the way to go in general. i do not know how many plugins you are planning on using but bear that in mind. even though DP is on the OSX many of the big plugin developers have not reworked their stuff yet. just a note on OS systems.

all that said i am looking into this as a means as well. it is cheaper and gives you much more flexability. where's digi?
[img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Duardo]

For example - what is the difference between the new HD 96 I/O unit vs. the new MOTU 2408mk3? Both have 96kz, both have 8 simultaneous inputs, and both have ADAT optical.
However, the MOTU also includes:
1) SMTPE time code sync (w/o buying somethign extra)
2) THREE banks of ADAT optical or TDIF (for 24 simultaneous digital inputs) vs only 8-channels of ADAT optical on the PT 96 i/o.
The interfaces are approximately the same list price ... around $2K. I guess the obvious difference is that the MOTU piece has it's own CORE system included.
I feel like I must be missing something here ... so if my question is totally ignorant - please excuse!

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't think that the question is totally ignorant, but you're kind of comparing apples and oranges here...first off, the 2408 lists for about $1K, not $2K...and the 2408 system is pretty much a standalone system, similar to the 001, except that the software it comes with (AudioDesk) is basically an old version of Digital Performer (equivalent to 2.4 I believe) with no MIDI. The 96IO is just a high-end converter to be used in conjunction with a Pro Tools HD Core system. Its converters will probably sound better than those in the 2408mkIII, but it's really hard to say since the MOTU hasn't started shipping. Compared to other high-end converters from companies such as RME, Apogee, etc, the price isn't out of line. The real advantage, though, is not so much the interface itself as the Pro Tools core system it runs with.

Both pieces offer 96Kz ...

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Almost everything does these days, but there are still some 96 K boxes that don't sound nearly as good as some of the older high-end 16/48 converters...96kHz is just a number, it doesn't mean anything alone!

so, what's the advantage of spending $10K+ for PT HD over $2K for more inputs, and 96kz??
(I'm assuming that you cannot use PT software with the MOTU piece, and I have no clue how the MOTU software compares to PT (AudioDesk?)

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The main advantage of spending over $10K for an HD system is the power on the DSP cards that form the core system (or that can be added if you need more power). Although today's computers are very fast, there's still a ceiling, and once you hit it with an LE system, there's nothing you can do. If you do hit that ceiling with an HD system, you can add more cards. But a three-card HD3 (or even HD2...or HD1, depending on what you're doing) offers an immense amount of power, especially when you consider you can also run RTAS plugins on the host processor as well. There are some plugins, such as reverbs and amp simulators, that sound better than any native plugin, simply because there's enough DSP available that the algorithms can be written without having to compromise to make them practical to run. If you get a chance, compare Digi's TDM Reverb One to their native D Verb, or TC's TDM reverb to their native...it's night and day. And there are some plugins, like the Virus plugins, that aren't available at all for host systems.

Plus, there are the extra tracks you can get...

-Duardo

[Maceo]

Also...

PT is THE standard for professional users. Period. You'll be able to still use your existing LE sessions, and work with other people's recordings and studios easier.

It's much more stable than any DAW program you could run with the MOTU. And as long as you're not doing too much MIDI stuff, the TDM version is as full-featured a package as you can get.

More DSP power, mo' better plug-ins, more I/O, more tracks, mo' better (pro) sounding I/O & converters.

Very low-latency (the audio does not have to loop through the computer when tracking).

But, yes, it is more money also.