Pro Tools 12.6 Overload

[Guilla]

Hello everyone,

I've read this forum a lot by the past and I finally decided to post something.

I've got Pro Tools 12.6, pretty happy with it. Except that it create a lot (and I mean by a lot that it's clearly IMPOSSIBLE to playback my session) of CPU Overload.

I don't understand why since my computer is quite powerfull. Ar least, powerfull enough regarding his spec :

Macbook Pro.
i7 Quad Core 2,8 Ghz to 4 Ghz.
512 Go SSD.
16 Go RAM
(5 month old...)

The project I took as reference has :

33 tracks with 2 reverb aux and 1 delay aux (pretty standard setup).
10 sends to those aux.
91 plugins in total (I know it's a lot but I've got my reasons for that).

And it overload a loooot (even with the highest buffer size. It does it at ANY buffer sizes).

I used mainly VCC + Brainworx Bx Console. And sometimes a differents compressors as Waves LA2A, MJUC, Waves API or one of the Slate VBC.
I used Slate Verbsuite as reverb and Slate Repeater as delay (pretty basic stuff).

I used VCC on the master bus + PSP E27, Slate FG-MU and Waves Linebroad band EQ.

I wish I could play with the processors host as it was possible in Pro Tools 10.
When I look at the CPU indicator, when it peaks to 100 %, some cores are only at about 30%, the graph looks like a pyramid.

I don't understand since with my previous PC Computer (which was a desktop PC with the same kind of spec that my actual laptop), I could run about 65 tracks full of plugins and Virtual Instruments without overloading the CPU (on my PC, I used Mixcraft 7).

I don't understand does my Macbook not powerfull enough ? If it is, it's really bad considering his outrageous price...

Thank you a lot for your help !

Cheers :) !

[Guilla]

IMG_20170406_030152.jpg

Here it is when it's not even reading the tracks.

And when it peaks to 100 %,

The core 6,7 and 1,2 doesn't exceed 40%.
It's the core 4 that goes to 50 or 60 % maximum.

I don't know if it's normal at all, but it seems that the core 4 eats more than the rest (twice more than the least solicited cores).

Thank you for your help, because some session are clearly unreadable now ...

[RiF]

This is quite normal behaviour.
Why?
The problem is not that your total CPU power is not sufficient (it's at 74% in this case), but that a single core gets overloaded. Plugins run on a single core and their processing cannot be spread among several cores. Therefore the DAW has to apply some smart plugin-instance-to-cpu-core-allocation schemes to distribute the load of all your plugins evenly to the cores. Sounds easy, but does not seem to be as we can see here. And I am personally guessing that the i7's hyperthreading (the i7 has only 4 physical cores but let the operating system think they are actually 8) does not make things easier, because it makes things unclear about how much actual physical CPU power from the physical cores is consumed throught one virtual cores.

And another restricting factor are CPU intensive plugins where a single instance needs more CPU power than a single core can provide. This will result in a CPU overload although the total CPU consumption is only 12.5% (100% / 8 cores = 12.5% per single core) in the worst case.
On my 2015 2.9 GHz 4-core i7 MBP I am running into this problem regularily, BTW.

Now what?
1. De-select dynamic plugin processing in the PT preferences as it makes the CPU load less predictable and stable.
2. Take a look at PT's CPU usage meter while deactivating (not just bypassing!) single plugins to see which ones are the most CPU heavy ones. Chances are that your overload problem can be caused by a single plugin. Start with Slate VBC, MJUC.
3. If nothing helps, freeze tracks. Preferably those who consume the most CPU.

Side note:
You've mentioned your PC desktop computer with the "same specs". The MBP has a laptop-i7 and your PC probably has/had a desktop i7 CPU. They are not the same. Intel trimmed the laptop-models for low-energy consumption and the desktop for performance. Guess what's more suitable for audio applications.

PS:
PT 12.6 had a problem with random CPU overloads (search the web for Pro Tools -9173 error). On my system, it helped to:
- deactivate the Click plugin (if used)
- uninstall Avid Application Manger
- uninstall Avid Cloud Services
- Update to 12.7.x (maybe this update is enough)

[melloj]

Another one!!!! When the hell will somebody at Avid sort this out???

[José Luis Díaz]

Hi,
In my case, what helped a lot was to move all Air plug-ins from Library > Application Support > Avid > Plug-Ins to Plug-Ins (Unused).
That action made that the System Usage window descends a big amount of %.
No more AAE errors -9173.
Also, it decreased the time of lunch PT (a lot).
I also moved to Plug-Ins (Unused) BF-76, Eleven Free, Eleven Lite, because I never use them. But I believe Air was the guilty.
Even if in the sessions no Air plug-in was invoked I had that -9173 errors.
BTW it is a PT 12.7.1 in Mavericks.

[Guilla]

Thank you for your answer RiF, didn't thought about the differences between i7 laptop and i7 desktop. Well, since I'll have a stable home, I'll take a desktop again. It's a shame that with a such powerfull laptop, at this prices (Apple prices are crazy), it got CPU overload as much as with my very old ASUS laptop (8 years old) that have a 4 Go RAM et a really poor processor...

I will deselect Dynamic plugin processing. I thought that the goal of that feature was, justly, to help the processors bypassing plugins on not read tracks.

I've also uninstall the App Manager and Cloud.

If it's still buggy, I will then try to move the Air plugin as suggested.

And then, at least, I'll try the upgrade (even if I suspect that it wont help me a lot). But it'll be a shame that such a HUGE problem (PT is clearly unusable sometimes) will be solved by a paid update (it would be a steal, but with Apple, you can say that we are already accustomed ).

Thank you a lot anyway guys, I will come back to tell you if it's solved (or seems to free up some CPU).

[Guilla]

IMG_20170406_224155.jpg

I tried uninstalling the app + disabling dynamic processing. It stills the same.

Here is a pic of the CPU, with all the plugin bypass (I know I have to disable them, but bypass can help).

Even bypass they eat at about 38 % to 50 % or my CPU with a single core really pushed hard.

It's the only DAW where I have got this kind of problems and it's a shame since it's the DAW from which I received most of my sessions to work with .

Same with every plugins deactivated, no WIFI, no internet :

IMG_20170406_224924.jpg

Activating all VMR seems to add 2% when bypassed and about 2 to 4% when they are activated (with only VMR, CPU at about 25 %) - 27 instances - Note : VMR includes only VCC and from 4 to 5 times a VPC.

Activating all Bx_Console seems to add about 3-4% when bypassed and about 10 % when they are all activated (with only the Bx, my CPU is at 34 to %) - 22 instances -.

Activating all MJUC, it's seems to not really add something to the CPU when bypassed. Then it ads 20% !!! And my CPU is at about 50 to 56 % with them only ! (and their just 5 instances). I precise that I use the "High Quality" (oversampling) in MJUC as it makes a real difference in sound. Seems to be the culprit ?

Activating all other stuff from Waves (some API, LA2A, LA3A, Pye, Fairchild, Linband EQ, REDD and 2 Guitar Rig from NI - not Waves for those sorry -) : + 2 %. Then switching them on : Didn't change the CPU consumption (wow quite amazed by that) - 10 instances - !

Activating all VTM : No change. ON : + 3 %. - 6 instances -

Activating PSP E27 : + 2%. ON : + 2 % or so. - 2 instances -

Activating all VBC : No change. ON : Almost no change also. - 8 instances -

Activating all Verbsuite : No change. ON (+ switching on the sends) : about + 3%. - 3 instances and 9 sends -.

Activating all the Repeater (only 1) : About + 1 to 3 %. ON : A huge peak when switching it ON then it goes to no change. - 1 instance, 1 sends -.

Note : I've done this test by activating and switching on the concerned family of plugins ALONE. That means without any other plugins on (for example no VCC + Bx).

Project en 96khz (I usually work in 44.1 but anyway).

So the culprit seems to be MJUC. Since, with only 5 instances of it, my CPU goes to about 50% when they are ON. When the HQ is switched off to goes to about 35 %. So the HQ add 15% to the 25% added by the 5 instances of MJUC.

So the culprit seems to be here. I will have to make this test on Logic to see if Pro Tools has his part in this or not, but seems to be more stable on Logic that I remembered using more MJUC (still with VCC and Bx all the way) without overloading the CPU.
It's a shame because I really dig this plugin a lot.

EDIT : I've stopped using MJUC, on a new project and I still got this CPU peaks. It seems that 30 tracks is maximum. It's a shame, I bought this computer thinking it was powerfull and I'll have to freeze like with my old ASUS laptop...

[RiF]

Originally Posted by Guilla

Here is a pic of the CPU, with all the plugin bypass (I know I have to disable them, but bypass can help).

Even bypass they eat at about 38 % to 50 % or my CPU with a single core really pushed hard.

Bypassing usually does not save any CPU as the plugins are just taken out of the audio path but still do their processing.

Originally Posted by Guilla

Activating all MJUC, it's seems to not really add something to the CPU when bypassed. Then it ads 20% !!! And my CPU is at about 50 to 56 % with them only ! (and their just 5 instances). I precise that I use the "High Quality" (oversampling) in MJUC as it makes a real difference in sound. Seems to be the culprit ?

MJUC is very nice, but it can eat some serious CPU on the highest quality settings...

Originally Posted by Guilla

Activating all other stuff from Waves (some API, LA2A, LA3A, Pye, Fairchild, Linband EQ, REDD and 2 Guitar Rig from NI - not Waves for those sorry -) : + 2 %. Then switching them on : Didn't change the CPU consumption (wow quite amazed by that) - 10 instances - !

Waves has some really CPU efficient plugins, except for some newer ones like the AR Plate reverb.

Originally Posted by Guilla

Project en 96khz (I usually work in 44.1 but anyway).

Ouch! 91 plugins @ 96K on a MBP? That does not explain your erratic CPU consumption behaviour, but puts quite some load on your CPU.

Originally Posted by Guilla

So the culprit seems to be here. I will have to make this test on Logic to see if Pro Tools has his part in this or not, but seems to be more stable on Logic that I remembered using more MJUC (still with VCC and Bx all the way) without overloading the CPU.
It's a shame because I really dig this plugin a lot.

Freeze the tracks up to MJUC.

Originally Posted by Guilla

EDIT : I've stopped using MJUC, on a new project and I still got this CPU peaks. It seems that 30 tracks is maximum. It's a shame, I bought this computer thinking it was powerfull and I'll have to freeze like with my old ASUS laptop...

The CPU spike errors stopped after upgrading to PT 12.7 here on my system.

[Guilla]

MJUC is indeed very nice. But it's not the culprit. I think PT or my computer is the culprit.
If I look at the CPU usage in my new project, it stays at about 70% and then it peaks abruptly to 100 or <90 causing PT to stop. Otherwise it stays at 70, even I if froze some tracks (6). There is a problem somewhere...

Yes I know that's a lot of plugins at higher rate. But I did wanted to test my MBP ability to mix some "heavy" project (anyway 30 tracks is far from being heavy).

Can Avid explain why the CPU spikes will stop If I upgrade. I find it really revolting to having to pay to have a stable DAW. That's stealing...

Should I downgrade to Pro Tools 10 to being able to manage the host processors ? It'll be a shame.

[Guilla]

There's definitely something wrong with Pro Tools.

I've froze 11 tracks from the 30 tracks that i got on my session, an the CPU just lowered by 10 % (a proof that the plugin on the frozen track weren't eating the CPU a lot). But it still peaks to 100 % for no reason. Going from 60 to 100 % abruptly.
I've to froze 27 TRACKS OUT OF THE 30 to being able to playback properly. And even with that the CPU can nastily peaks from 40 to 85 % in 1 seconds, that totally crazy !!!!
I've noticed that if I'm moving the cursor or the view cursor to navigate through the track horizontaly or verticaly it makes it even worse and can make the CPU overload even with 22 frozen tracks.
Seriously I'm feeling more like princess Anna rather than a music producer right now...
That's totally crazy. I've paid for a professional DAW and I'm feel like I'm getting back to my early days with my poor computer, freezing all the tracks on my Mixcraft session to being able to playback the session.
I'm really upset by the situation...

PS : I doesn't happen on Logic Pro X and Reaper by the way.

EDIT : Hey I've probably found an interesting point to consider :
When I'm using the i/o insert to insert hardware processing, Pro Tools CPU immediatly peaks at 100 % and stays at 100% until I disable the i/o insert.
When I insert i/o, it's ALL the cores that are running totally crazy, they all gain about 40% to reach the maximum. That's a really strange behaviour !!
That's a strange fact...