Mbox Pro "Inserts" vs "Hardware inserts"

[GoGoJoe]

I have The Blue Max PreSonus Smart compressor and i would like to use it with my Mbox 3 Pro Setup.

The Condenser mic is in input 1 and i am using Headphone A to track.
How do I set this up properly if i want to use the compressor on the live feed while recording?

Also would it be better to set it up as a plugin on a track after the fact? if so how would i do that?

[mesaone]

You have a couple options. This is a stereo compressor, so you can either hook it up as a stereo insert to be used with 2 inputs, or you can set it up as a stereo insert to be used with the DAW. Or a combination of both!

So here's what I would do, if you only plan to use it with mono sources such as a single microphone:

Use a dedicated insert jack to feed the compressor LEFT/MONO input and return from LEFT/MONO output. That way you can use it as a hardware insert with your mic, on the way in. Then set up an insert send/return pair in Pro Tools, so you can use the RIGHT side of the compressor as a hardware insert in Pro Tools (for example, Output 3 and Line Input 3 on your MBOX).

So you would only be using one at a time. But this would allow you to use the single compressor two different ways, without patching. The drawback is that you now have restricted yourself to mono compression only, and you can't use it for input signals and PT inserts at the same time.

[GoGoJoe]

Originally Posted by mesaone

....Use a dedicated insert jack to feed the compressor LEFT/MONO input and return from LEFT/MONO output.

From Insert 1/4 line out to the (L) Input of the Compressor. Then (L) Compressor out to Line Input 1 of the Mbox 3?

So instead of looking to use Input 1 XLR i would now be using Line input 1 in pro tools etc?

Originally Posted by mesaone

The drawback is that you now have restricted yourself to mono compression only, and you can't use it for input signals and PT inserts at the same time.

But don't most people only record mics in mono? What other forms of compression is there for a Condenser mic?

Thanks!

[albee1952]

I take the other side on this. With this compressor, as with any inexpensive piece, I would skip it and use plugins. While mixing, there are so many better sounding compressor plugins, and none will entail the round trip out and back, with the associated latency to compensate for or the patching you may need to constantly change. Now, if you really want to improve the signal going in, I would save up until you can afford a very good channel strip(like the API or Grace boxes) or get a small lunchbox(API 500 rack) and stuff it with a really good preamp, compressor and EQ modules. Meanwhile, the Mbox 3 preamps is a solid performer, and you might get better "bang for the buck" by buying a better microphone(which you never mention) and/ or adding some acoustic treatments to your space(the best mic in the world can sound like crap in a bad room)

[Southsidemusic]

Originally Posted by albee1952

I take the other side on this. With this compressor, as with any inexpensive piece, I would skip it and use plugins. While mixing, there are so many better sounding compressor plugins, and none will entail the round trip out and back, with the associated latency to compensate for or the patching you may need to constantly change. Now, if you really want to improve the signal going in, I would save up until you can afford a very good channel strip(like the API or Grace boxes) or get a small lunchbox(API 500 rack) and stuff it with a really good preamp, compressor and EQ modules. Meanwhile, the Mbox 3 preamps is a solid performer, and you might get better "bang for the buck" by buying a better microphone(which you never mention) and/ or adding some acoustic treatments to your space(the best mic in the world can sound like crap in a bad room)

+1 on all this.

[mesaone]

Originally Posted by albee1952

I take the other side on this. With this compressor, as with any inexpensive piece, I would skip it and use plugins. While mixing, there are so many better sounding compressor plugins, and none will entail the round trip out and back, with the associated latency to compensate for or the patching you may need to constantly change.

This is all true... But does not cover the use case of someone wanting a compressor on the way in, just for the utility of gain reduction. Like someone using Skype or Teamspeak or whatever. For stuff like that, anything that can reliably reduce gain is worthwhile - even those one-knob compressors built into cheapo yamaha mixers! I used one of those for a long time (Yamaha MG124C) when doing tutorial vids, just so I could narrate live and have my voice at just the right level versus the other audio, without having to edit anything. Worked a treat. For years I recorded all vocals through a DBX 266XL, before I treated my room. Expansion and compression in one box, and it also worked quite well - but I did take the time to learn the ins and outs of what I was doing first.

Originally Posted by GoGoJoe

From Insert 1/4 line out to the (L) Input of the Compressor. Then (L) Compressor out to Line Input 1 of the Mbox 3?

So instead of looking to use Input 1 XLR i would now be using Line input 1 in pro tools etc?

You would connect your mic as usual, then use a TRS-to-dual-TS cable to hook the compressor up to the corresponding insert jack of your MBox Pro.

Originally Posted by GoGoJoe

But don't most people only record mics in mono? What other forms of compression is there for a Condenser mic?

Stereo miking, or compressing any other stereo source. Each mic is mono, but in the case of (for example) a stereo pair of drum overheads, you may wish to compress the two signals as a stereo pair.

[albee1952]

All true but there is a simple work-around. Bring in your mic to a mono AUX track, insert a compressor plugin, route this AUX track to an AUDIO track and record

[GoGoJoe]

Originally Posted by albee1952

I take the other side on this. With this compressor, as with any inexpensive piece, I would skip it and use plugins. While mixing, there are so many better sounding compressor plugins, and none will entail the round trip out and back, with the associated latency to compensate for or the patching you may need to constantly change. Now, if you really want to improve the signal going in, I would save up until you can afford a very good channel strip(like the API or Grace boxes) or get a small lunchbox(API 500 rack) and stuff it with a really good preamp, compressor and EQ modules. Meanwhile, the Mbox 3 preamps is a solid performer, and you might get better "bang for the buck" by buying a better microphone(which you never mention) and/ or adding some acoustic treatments to your space(the best mic in the world can sound like crap in a bad room)

My studio mic is listed in my signature (mxl 4000) and it's a very good mic so the pro tool plug ins may suffice. The compressor was given to me so if it's not the best route I won't lose any sleep. Please let me know as my goal is simply to have the best vocals possible. My only reasoning for wanting to use it is simply because I have it and thought perhaps it could be an added bennifit. .increasing gain levels while doing heavy compression on peaking

[albee1952]

No doubt about your goal Many of us feel that "heavy" compression while tracking is a bad idea because you can never undo it. You can always add more in mix. Consider that the concept of recording hot is actually tied to the "old school" practice of maximizing signal to noise, going to tape. While that made sense then, with a digital recording setup, noise is rarely an issue, hence the phrase, "yellow is the new red". Don't feel compelled to "slam" input levels. I suggest an experimental session for you. Create two mono AUDIO tracks, plus a mono AUX track. On Audio track 1-set its input to the mic. Set AUDIO track 2 to an open bus, the AUX track's output to that same bus, and the AUX track input to the mic. Mute the AUDIO track that gets the direct mic input and put it in record. Insert a compressor plugin on the AUX track and put its associated AUDIO track in record and track your vocal(remembering "yellow is the new red". Now you have compressed vocal on the track fed by the AUX track, and uncompressed vocal on the muted track. Insert a compressor on the "dry" track and compare. Something that might give you the best of both would be to leave the dry track without compression and blend the 2 audio tracks. My point thru all this is simply to try everything, and pick what gives you the desired result

[GoGoJoe]

I'm having difficulties with Hardware inserts. I'd like to use the hardware insert functionality for the audio coming in. (Use a Aux track to audition the vocals and get the levels right) then simply add an mono audio track and record using the outbound compressor. This has proven very difficult with the mbox pro 3 as there no support for it it seems (no videos, how to's or documentation) it almost seems as nobody uses the inserts but rather use the loop method of using the same in/outputs numbers to finalize the audio be rerouting the mix through a compressor.

Does anybody know how to properly setup the Mbox Pro 3 to use a Hardware compressor so while recording live vocals it compresses the recorded audio ( I know some will say no your not suppose to blah blah blah) please let me know if you've had experience with this.

My full setup is in the sig.. but i'm using an Mbox pro 3 and pro tools 12.4 on a windows setup.

I've tried using an insert Y spliter cable from my compressor (mono out left/ right of my compressor) into insert 3 of my mbox pro 3. When I add insert 3 to an mono audio track doesn't seem to work. in fact it seems even if i turn my compressor off it has no effect.


Also I've tried coming out of 3 and 4 of my mbox pro 3 into 1 and 2 of my hardware compressor. out of 1 and 2 of my hardware compressor into insert 3 and 4 of my mbox pro 3. When I mount insert 3/4 onto a live audio track the effects are not evident at all. Doesn't work it's like the inserts are useless to me right now because nothing seems to work


Anybody know what i'm doing wrong? Or has anyone actually been able to get the hardware inserts on the mbox pro 3 to actually work as intended (alter audio live with a compressor or effects unit while recording).