ok! a little help with vocal recording

[rpb]

i'm doing some vocal recordings (mostly pop, country sort of stuff). i'm using Mbox with AT 3035 mic along with a Presonus COMP16 compressor.

when i get into the upper register (vocally) sometimes the signal distorts, getting a little fuzzy and sort of boxy sounding. i tried using the compressor to track, which definitely helps, but only to a degree (not sure i'm using it optimally, since it's the first outboard gear i've used). this happens (pretty consistently) even though the gain meter on the vocal track never goes into the reds (it starts to distort sometimes when the meter gets up to about 7/8 toward the reds).

so my question is.....why is this happening and how do i fix it?

someone had previously suggested that condenser mics tend to overload the Mbox....if this is true, would upgrading to digi002r (which im' considering) alleviate the issue?? are the preamps in the Mbox just not that good? are they easy to overload/distort?are the pres in the digi002 system that much better?

should i get other preamps and bypass those in the Mbox?? (any suggestions for what might do the trick?)

is it possible i'm overloading the mic itself and causing the distortion? should i look into getting a different, more resilient mic (any suggestions?). i guess i'm just not sure where the problem lies.

or is there just something i'm doing wrong????????

i just want a clean vocal recording!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

thanx a mil for any help!!!

ryan

[tele_player]

Have you tried moving away from the mic a bit? Have you lowered the gain on the Mbox mic input?

[rpb]

yes...but i'm also recording in a room that is not exactly acousticly treated...so then it just get muffly and reverby

but thanks for the suggestion!

[vicwind]

The preamps in the mbox are focusrite platinums which sound better than the 001 or 002 pres. trust me, i've owned all of these. as far as distortion is concerned, try singing about a foot back or so from the mic. sounds like you may be too close. when you set your gain on the mbox, sing that high G or whatever at full voice, the way you would during the performance, and trim the gain accordingly. try to leave a little headroom, you can always add gain later. definately do not upgrade to the 002 for the sake of pres. The mbox pres are sweeter for sure. also, try tracking with a minimum of compression. the old method of being a human compressor by moving back and forth toward the mic works for me. i only use my compressor for backing vox. make sure that your compressor is set up optimally for each performance. usually, distortion is because it's too hot going in or coming out. make sure that output isn't too high. i would always go to mic placement first though. make certain that you do a good sound check using the notes and words and intensity you wish to put to tape while setting that level on the mbox. then move back from the mic as needed. also, tracking in low latency monitoring mode is a must for almost anythng.
there are whole books on this topic, but also remember your accoustic space when tracking. if you can, experiment with venue and mic choice as well. some like it dry, (closet or vocal booth) and some like it wet (church or hall). i have to say that my favorite tracks are ones done in large spaces. depends on application of course
hope this helps!

[vicwind]

have you tried other mics? i like the RODE NTK. great value and sound! also the c1 from studio projects is a great vocal mic. it depends on your budget

[tele_player]

One thing at a time. Figure out how to get a good, clean signal - then figure out how to take care of the unwanted echo.

I don't think you need a different preamp. The Mbox can sound real good.

Experiment with distance from the mic, and try singing at slightly different angles to the mic, instead of dead on. You might need to be 12-24" from the mic.

[vicwind]

the 3035 is a great mic also, but it's best to go to a store that you can sing into all of the mics, in order to get the one that accentuates your nice vocal qualities and hides the less than nice ones. (we all have both)

[Infa]

Well at 7/8 towards the reds this should NOT be happening. Backing up from the mic would not seem to solve it since it does NOT seem to be a to hot of volume issue because 7/8 towards the reds is still got alot of headroom left..

I would ask if you have your mic in a nice shock mount or not ?? Sometimes the metal vibration from the mic stand, or anything in the room will cause that sound you are discribing. Also, maybe that mic just sucks, and can't handle the signal once it gets to a certain level AND /OR frequency.. Which leads me to this question, I once had this problem at a LE studio I set up for a friend, and it WASN'T really distortion as much as a funny, crackly, fuzzy, maybe a bit of a ringing sound ONCE it not only got to a certain volume , BUT mainly once a certain vocal frequency was hit, and especially for us when the vocalist said any upper pitched Ooooo's , or A sounds at a realitively nice volume , but still NO WHERE near what should be distortion levels. The solution ended up being getting a better Mic that could just handle that frequency better I guess...

So the question was,,, is it more like how I describe the sound(funny, crackly, fuzzy, maybe a bit of a ringing sound)??. Or is it really distortion ? Also try to see if it is more indictative of frequencies and Oooos, and A sounds along with volume, instead of JUST volume..

Let me Know

[rpb]

so you think i should not track with compression?? (take the compressor back?)

[IntelDoc]

Really sounds like you are clipping the PRE stage of the Mbox, not the mic. You will clip the pre first. Like Tele said, back off the mic some and try to angle it a tad away from you. say 12 degrees or so to cut some of the harshness away. raise it up some above your mouth and sing below it. It will pick up sound trust me. As far as the Pre's in the Mbox versus the 002's I would fight that, but I really will not comment because I d not use the Pre's in my 002 at all. Never have except for talkback. Really do not like them, but they are not bad for some things. I just use all outboard pre's instead.


Good luck, and try to turn your gain down a db or two. You can always raise that back up later with compression and EQ.

Good luck!

- Doc