Low Latency Monitoring through external converters

[jrick79]

Is it possible to monitor through an external set of converters via lightpipe on a Digi002 and still utilize the low latency monitoring feature? I'm currently having no luck trying to monitor through a pair of outputs in my Lucid ADA8824. Turning low latency monitoring on and off has no effect.

[gtrplyr1]

I've been through this so I can help you out but I don't think it's going to be what you want to hear.

Basically there is NO way to use Low Latency Monitoring through external convertors because when you check the "Low Latency Mode" you kill the digital outs when in record mode. What digi actually does with Low Latency Monitoring is take a "Send" from your analog input and mix it back in ....

I had to deal with that when I got a Apogee Rosetta 200 for my 002R .. the workaround for me has been to use two outputs to my monitors ... I take the Analog out of the 002R straight into my Monitors as well as the Analog out of the Rosetta 200 ... I got lucky because my monitors have XLR and 1/4" inputs ... so I went XLR out of the Rosetta and 1/4" out of the 002R ... then I can use the Low latency mode and track monitoring the 002r's outs and then easily switch to the Rosetta to make Tonal and or Mix decisions. IF your monitors won't accept two inputs you will need a switching box ....

FWIW the one thing I've really discovered is how bad the 002R's D/A convertors are ... the difference between the two is pretty obvious. Then again considering that I paid nearly 2X as much for the Rosetta 200 and all it does is conversion it makes perfect sense.

One last thing .... if you decide to use this method ... you can select both Analog1/2 and SPDIF 1/2 as outputs on all of your tracks and set up two master faders .... On earlier systems (001) you could "mirror analog outs to the digital outs" .. with the 002 you can't ! You HAVE to assign multiple outputs ... not the biggest deal in the world since there are quick key commands to do so.


If anyone has found a better method I'd love to know about it.

Good luck,

Gtrplyr1

[bzldzl]

Interesting, I go from my Apogee Rosetta 200 to my presonus central station, which then sends the audio to my studio monitors and has a seperate channel for my headphones. I don't notice any latency when monitoring in this way.

The 002 is clocked to and sends audio through spdif to the rosetta, I also have a digimax sending audio in via lightpipe, it is clocked to the rosetta as well through work clock.

All outputs are set to spdif unless they go to an internal bus mix.

[gtrplyr1]

Are you using "Low Latency Mode" or just setting the Hardware Buffer size to a low setting ? You can use a low Buffer setting and minimize the latency but the lowest buffer size still has more latency than the "Low Latency Setting" .... depending on what your doing it might not be a huge deal ... such as vocals but when I'm cutting guitar I notice a difference between the lowest buffer setting and the "Low Latency Mode" ... mostly on rhythm parts.

[jrick79]

I've been through this so I can help you out but I don't think it's going to be what you want to hear.

Basically there is NO way to use Low Latency Monitoring through external convertors because when you check the "Low Latency Mode" you kill the digital outs when in record mode. What digi actually does with Low Latency Monitoring is take a "Send" from your analog input and mix it back in ....

I had to deal with that when I got a Apogee Rosetta 200 for my 002R .. the workaround for me has been to use two outputs to my monitors ... I take the Analog out of the 002R straight into my Monitors as well as the Analog out of the Rosetta 200 ... I got lucky because my monitors have XLR and 1/4" inputs ... so I went XLR out of the Rosetta and 1/4" out of the 002R ... then I can use the Low latency mode and track monitoring the 002r's outs and then easily switch to the Rosetta to make Tonal and or Mix decisions. IF your monitors won't accept two inputs you will need a switching box ....

FWIW the one thing I've really discovered is how bad the 002R's D/A convertors are ... the difference between the two is pretty obvious. Then again considering that I paid nearly 2X as much for the Rosetta 200 and all it does is conversion it makes perfect sense.

One last thing .... if you decide to use this method ... you can select both Analog1/2 and SPDIF 1/2 as outputs on all of your tracks and set up two master faders .... On earlier systems (001) you could "mirror analog outs to the digital outs" .. with the 002 you can't ! You HAVE to assign multiple outputs ... not the biggest deal in the world since there are quick key commands to do so.


If anyone has found a better method I'd love to know about it.

Good luck,

Gtrplyr1

I'm ok with monitoring my tracking sessions through the 002 outputs if I have to. My "optical" outputs are pretty much only used to get audio to my external summing mixer, but it would be nice to be able to monitor through them at all times.

In your post above you mentioned that "low latency" mode "kills" the digital outputs. If that is the case, then how am I able to still here a delayed signal through my digital converters? I can tell a difference in the delay time when I adjust the h/w buffer settings, but there is no change whatsoever when I flip low latency mode on or off. I've been working on LE systems for about 8 years now, so I'm a seasoned veteran when it comes to manipulating low latency mode and hardware buffer settings!!

What is the key command to assign a large group of faders to multiple outputs? I know I can control-click an individual fader, but it would be nice to assign multiple faders at once.

Thanks again for all of the help!

jon

[gtrplyr1]

"Basically there is NO way to use Low Latency Monitoring through external convertors because when you check the "Low Latency Mode" you kill the digital outs when in record mode"


The key to the statement is "When in record mode" .... arm a track and see if you can hear the input of that track going to the digital outs ... my guess is no ..... from what I remember .... like I said I went through this a while back and haven't tried it again recently ... so I hope I'm wrong because I'd love to monitor from the Apogee while tracking in the Low Latency Mode ....

As far as the quick key commands .... you hold option when selecting one track's output and it affects all track outputs ... well all the tracks showing .. if you have them hidden they will not be affected. There is also a quick key command so that you can select multiple outputs .. ie ( 1/2 Analog AND SPDIF ) .... can't remember offhand but I'm sure it would just require a quick search of the online manual.

Good luck,

Gtrplyr1

[jrick79]

Thanks for the key command info.

I do hear the delayed signal of the track I am recording through my digital converters. The amount of delay changes when I adjust the buffer settings, even when I am in "Low Latency Mode."

[ManFriday]

Hmmm.
I use low-latency monitoring with the ADAT I/O all the time, and it seems to work fine, even when I have the buffers set to 512 or 1024..
I havent tried it via SPDIF

[bzldzl]

Are you set up anything like I am?

002 is connected in/out with rosetta 200 via spdif. All outputs for tracks are set to spdif unless an internal mix bus.

The rosetta sends analog stereo signal to my presonus central station which has outputs for my monitoring system and headphones.

When I arm a track for recording there is no latency at all, I can through reverbs or whatever on the track if the client prefers to record with some effects.


One thing that has thrown me for a loop a couple times is if I have any plugins on the master fader that introduce latency. Like Waves mastering plugins, I use these to get rough mixes down, generly just the limiter for dithering. If I don't totally deactivate them, not just mute, they cause latency in monitoring.

[gtrplyr1]

OK .... I decided to try it out again after reading the above posts and ..... here is what I've figured out.

You CAN hear the digital outs in "Low Latency Mode" BUT .... you are not really hearing the Low latency mode ... in other words you are still relying on the Hardware Buffer Size to minimize latency. I just upgraded to 7.4 two weeks ago and would bet dollars to donuts that this is a feature they added to the new version, previously I was on 7.1 and you COULD NOT hear a track in record mode through the digital outs when in "Low Latency Mode" ... I tried when I first got the Rosetta 200 and went through it with Digi customer support. In any case they seem to have addressed it in the new version .. but I repeat you are not really hearing the "Low Latency Mode". I also noticed that in 7.4 the buffer size can go to 32 ... I don't remember it going that low in previous versions ... with the Hardware Buffer set to 32 the latency is really minimized ... I feel very comfortable tracking !!!! YEAH !

So it really does pay to browse these forums ..... thanks to the others that chimed in ....... I'd love it if someone could confirm my suspicions about the earlier versions .....

All the best,

Gtrplyr1