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  #71  
Old 01-11-2017, 04:18 AM
Bushpig Bushpig is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Hi all,

Sorry, I totally forgot to reply to these replies (I blame bloody Christmas).

MM,

Quote:
VEPro and Reason use the same dongle.
Now, that's what I thought I'd figured out a while back when I took a look at VEP for the first time, but this time around when I tried to confirm or dismiss this, I couldn't work it out easily at first glance. TBH I didn't have much time to dig a lot deeper or email the support peeps of either company, so this is very helpful info. Thanks for that.

Simon,

Quote:
However, I'm pretty sure it costs the devs, probably too much, which may be why they seem to be finding their own solution.
Sorry, I think I must have misread/misunderstood your comment. Mike Scuffham was saying that in his opinion, using iLok was a much cheaper way to go for a smaller developer like himself. Basically the gist of what he was implying is that, having first set-up his own authorisation system which he maintains himself, then making the effort to offer iLok auths as an option, he felt he would prefer to have been able to just go with iLok from the get go, but of course now he's knee deep in CS'ing all the non iLok licences, to the detriment of his productivity (90% - 10% in terms of no hassles with iLok licences)

Cheers guys.

Steve B.
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  #72  
Old 01-16-2017, 07:31 PM
simon.a.billington simon.a.billington is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bushpig View Post
Hi all,

Sorry, I totally forgot to reply to these replies (I blame bloody Christmas).

MM,

Now, that's what I thought I'd figured out a while back when I took a look at VEP for the first time, but this time around when I tried to confirm or dismiss this, I couldn't work it out easily at first glance. TBH I didn't have much time to dig a lot deeper or email the support peeps of either company, so this is very helpful info. Thanks for that.

Simon,

Sorry, I think I must have misread/misunderstood your comment. Mike Scuffham was saying that in his opinion, using iLok was a much cheaper way to go for a smaller developer like himself. Basically the gist of what he was implying is that, having first set-up his own authorisation system which he maintains himself, then making the effort to offer iLok auths as an option, he felt he would prefer to have been able to just go with iLok from the get go, but of course now he's knee deep in CS'ing all the non iLok licences, to the detriment of his productivity (90% - 10% in terms of no hassles with iLok licences)

Cheers guys.

Steve B.
Ah yes i get that now.

It would bench for just one consistent authorisation system, I totally agree. Much easier for the end user and the developer...

But with only one security standard to defeat wouldn't it make it so much easier crackers?? Manage to beat it and the whole world of audio becomes a virtual candy store. Anything and everything.
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  #73  
Old 01-17-2017, 09:43 AM
Bushpig Bushpig is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Simon,
Quote:
But with only one security standard to defeat wouldn't it make it so much easier crackers?? Manage to beat it and the whole world of audio becomes a virtual candy store. Anything and everything.
I suspect you're probably right there actually. Mike did say he didn't think any system he had looked at was much better or worse than any other from a security standpoint, but what you say is probably correct, a "distributed difficulty" for anyone trying to crack every bit of audio software out there would slow them up a bit. TBH, it's mainly the authorisation systems that are linked directly to a specific machine that drive me potty. I move around a lot, and at least the licences that can be put on a stick are easier to work with.

Cheers.

Steve
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  #74  
Old 01-20-2017, 12:10 AM
simon.a.billington simon.a.billington is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

I can understand that being an issue, moving around so much.

Unfortunately there is no ideal solution. Perhaps in the world with Apple Watches and Fingerprint Scanners we may start to see other options that will allow machines to automatically recognise us and grant permission without the need for dongles.
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  #75  
Old 01-20-2017, 06:59 AM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.a.billington View Post
I can understand that being an issue, moving around so much.

Unfortunately there is no ideal solution. Perhaps in the world with Apple Watches and Fingerprint Scanners we may start to see other options that will allow machines to automatically recognise us and grant permission without the need for dongles.
Finger print scanners are fairly easy to fool. All you need is to get a picture of a person's fingerprint and use that to open whatever device or program that uses it. Capturing a person's print is easy if you know what to do - a lot easier than hacking the code for an iLok or other authorization system.
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  #76  
Old 01-20-2017, 07:57 AM
simon.a.billington simon.a.billington is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

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Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Finger print scanners are fairly easy to fool. All you need is to get a picture of a person's fingerprint and use that to open whatever device or program that uses it. Capturing a person's print is easy if you know what to do - a lot easier than hacking the code for an iLok or other authorization system.
It will improve, but you're also forgetting context. Someone will have to hack your fingerprint to steal your hypothetical licensing information. Not only would it have to be a personal attack, but they will also have to know what you use your fingerprints for. In this case audio plugins. On top of that they will want to have an invested interest in audio plugins to want to go to the trouble of stealing your prints. To do that they will also have to know you to some degree. Finally they will have to possess the skills to beat the scanner.

All these elements would have to fall in place.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but incredibly unlikely!! If it does happen, it will be someone you know.
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  #77  
Old 01-20-2017, 12:43 PM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.a.billington View Post
It will improve, but you're also forgetting context. Someone will have to hack your fingerprint to steal your hypothetical licensing information. Not only would it have to be a personal attack, but they will also have to know what you use your fingerprints for. In this case audio plugins. On top of that they will want to have an invested interest in audio plugins to want to go to the trouble of stealing your prints. To do that they will also have to know you to some degree. Finally they will have to possess the skills to beat the scanner.

All these elements would have to fall in place.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but incredibly unlikely!! If it does happen, it will be someone you know.
No skills needed to beat the scanner. All you need to do is to steal someone's device that uses fingerprint ID, dust it like police agencies do and lift the print. Print it out on a good laser printer and you're good to go. There's no need to know what someone uses their fingerprint for. This kind of thing has already happened on so-called smartphones and tablets that use fingerprint ID.

The thing is any kind of single point ID system is doomed to failure or hack. You need what safety engineers call the old belt and suspender system.
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  #78  
Old 01-21-2017, 09:56 AM
simon.a.billington simon.a.billington is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

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Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
No skills needed to beat the scanner. All you need to do is to steal someone's device that uses fingerprint ID, dust it like police agencies do and lift the print. Print it out on a good laser printer and you're good to go. There's no need to know what someone uses their fingerprint for. This kind of thing has already happened on so-called smartphones and tablets that use fingerprint ID.

The thing is any kind of single point ID system is doomed to failure or hack. You need what safety engineers call the old belt and suspender system.
Perhaps, but you are forgetting all the other conditions that have to fall into place.

If people are going to steal your prints it's not going to be for plugin authorisation. That's the last thing on their mind. Because now you are just a random person and not specifically targeted at all for your audio licenses.

Which is why it would still work, but be a bad way to protect your banking information as an example
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  #79  
Old 01-21-2017, 10:23 AM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.a.billington View Post
Perhaps, but you are forgetting all the other conditions that have to fall into place.

If people are going to steal your prints it's not going to be for plugin authorisation. That's the last thing on their mind. Because now you are just a random person and not specifically targeted at all for your audio licenses.

Which is why it would still work, but be a bad way to protect your banking information as an example
Not even a good way to protect banking info for the reason I wrote above - any single authorization system is what in aerospace parlance called a 'single point failure' possibility. That's why the fingerprint ID system should/must be backed up with a second system for better security.

Even retina scan systems can be broken. Been to an eye doctor in the last few years? Chances are they have a picture/scan of your retina on file in their database. And we all know most databases can be hacked by a 14 year old kid (or younger).
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  #80  
Old 01-22-2017, 09:15 AM
simon.a.billington simon.a.billington is offline
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Default Re: November/Black Friday Sales 2016!

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
No skills needed to beat the scanner. All you need to do is to steal someone's device that uses fingerprint ID, dust it like police agencies do and lift the print. Print it out on a good laser printer and you're good to go. There's no need to know what someone uses their fingerprint for. This kind of thing has already happened on so-called smartphones and tablets that use fingerprint ID.

The thing is any kind of single point ID system is doomed to failure or hack. You need what safety engineers call the old belt and suspender system.
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Not even a good way to protect banking info for the reason I wrote above - any single authorization system is what in aerospace parlance called a 'single point failure' possibility. That's why the fingerprint ID system should/must be backed up with a second system for better security.

Even retina scan systems can be broken. Been to an eye doctor in the last few years? Chances are they have a picture/scan of your retina on file in their database. And we all know most databases can be hacked by a 14 year old kid (or younger).
Still missing the point. Re-read what I wrote.

For a start as I never said it was a good way to protect banking information. The second point is it would be used for something very, very specific that 99.999% of thrives would have no interest in, nor would they be looking for the connection.

It's like stealing a key from s random persons keyring, with no idea of what it unlocks. A key without something to unlock is pretty useless.
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