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#51
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
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As you know he uses standardised testing of particular plugins, therefore i recreated similar but with my own plugins that have native aax versions. This is the scenario, on playback, where pro tools beat all other DAWs dramatically. On record, it was different, pro tools got throttled by absolutely everything, 128 buffer helped even things out compared to others. Cubase is amazing at 128.. even at 32 buffer, as I had made a mistake before in my previous tests and had a whole bunch of hidden tracks activated I forgot about lol, i can run 8 VI tracks all armed in Cubase and playing simultaneously, VS zero in pro tools at 32 or 64 buffer. Windows seems a lot more stable for Pro tools and Vi's at 64 buffer. 8700K is an excellent machine. Pro tools spreads load like nothing I have ever seen on it's playback buffer.. I have said it so many times but I don't think some people get how huge this figure is.. i can get pro tools to 700% cpu usage on it's playback buffer, and it plays back without a hitch...Maximum possible is 800% and no DAW would ever get that close (100% per thread, in my case 8 logical cores). All other DAWs like reaper, S1, Cubase, Logic.. have problems at 500% and above real cpu and 75% ish real core usage. Pro tools meter showed 90% per core, and real cpu meter istat showed 90% per core. Closest correlation to real meter i have ever seen from any daw. But it just can't do it at low buffers. Even on windows it will struggle cause i have done comparison tests on my windows 7 laptop with S1 and Cubase at 64 buffer and they absolutely demolish PT. (only a quad core ivu bridge laptop but tests on the same machine are all relative between DAWs). So 8700k will allow a lot of power BUT you will still run into roadblocks, say if you have the buffer at 64, and have created a busy project, and somewhere down the line you need to record a new track, audio or VI, but the project is already quite heavy on playback usage with each core. Windows will have the same overload problems as Mac in that scenario, even on a 4.5GHZ steady 8700K. My friend has a 5GHZ liquid overclock, stable, turbo disabled just 5ghz flat clock rate, and with a moderately heavy project, he could only record a new track (just one track) at 128 buffer, no lower. With RME top shelf hardware.
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- Intel 14900K/NzXt Kraken Elite/64GB Kingston DDR5 6000 mhz (32x2)/ Asus Pro Art Z790/Asus 4090/Win 11 Pro 23H2/UAD Apollo 8 x2 w TBolt 3 card u/g/UAD Twin X. |
#52
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
Thanks for posting, TNM. It takes a while to A/B the two links as they're all entirely different processors, but interesting stuff.
The other time when real time / single core performance is important is when using thirsty VIs (at any buffer). I isolated a bug in Omnisphere at the moment where Granular performance on a PC was massively worse than a Mac - even the best processors can't get more than 7 or so notes of polyphony out of it in Windows, whereas a Mac takes it all in its stride. Spectrasonics say they're working on that for a fix, but in the meantime it highlights that some VIs are extremely demanding CPU-wise (synths in particular). For that, a better single core score will always be helpful. One other thing that is pertinent to some DAWs such Cubase is that they have modes that reduce the CPU hit on non-live tracks considerably. In short, here's my takeaway from it all. Strong single core score: Better performance on active tracks with demanding plugins Better performance when using Cubase's AG2 Better performance at very low buffer settings Strong multi core score: Better performance on big projects with lots of plugins For me, I need both and a relatively cool CPU, so the 7820X was my sweet spot. Others may well prioritise one more than another. Purely for audio post, for example, I'd say multicore is much more important than single core. For the 8700K, it has a much improved multicore performance over the 7700K while keeping a great single core score, so its a good choice and runs very cool. As I say, I nearly went for it, it was the limitations of the Z370 chipset that were the main strike against for me.
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Guy Rowland www.guyrowland.co.uk www.sound-on-screen.com - Original audio clips of movies, TV shows and games, licensed as regular production music. PT 2024 Ultimate; W11 Pro; Ryzen 9 7900; 64gb RAM; RME Babyface; UAD Quad Satellite USB; GTX 1050i Macbook Air M2; 24gb RAM |
#53
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
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pro-tools-pc.com TRASHER Pro Tools Utility(updated 3-6-18) HD Native, Avid 16x16, Eleven Rack, Focusrite Clarett 8preX, UA Quad Apollo TB. Intel I7 9900k Win 10 |
#54
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
Ah ha, found it!
http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=238426 What a thread, would be lovely if there was a master google spreadsheet of results or something. Just checking if this is like-for-like... any efficiency gains when switching from RTAS to AAX or between versions of Pro Tools? Is that jump from 200-1000 all necessarily the pure horse power? Will do a test on my current 4930k rig and then another when I get the new 7820X. EDIT - FWIW. the 4930k at stock speed is 82 tracks, 410 instances.
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Guy Rowland www.guyrowland.co.uk www.sound-on-screen.com - Original audio clips of movies, TV shows and games, licensed as regular production music. PT 2024 Ultimate; W11 Pro; Ryzen 9 7900; 64gb RAM; RME Babyface; UAD Quad Satellite USB; GTX 1050i Macbook Air M2; 24gb RAM Last edited by noiseboyuk; 03-21-2018 at 09:38 AM. |
#55
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
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There are TONS of variables. There is actually 2 versions of Dverb. The newer version implements some chorusing and such that makes it more intensive. You would see references in that old I7 thread to "old" or "new" Dverb. Interface drivers is a BIGGIE. Version of Pro Tools can have some effect. Obviously bios/system configurations have a major effect. Like the poster above not catching the clocking issues / differences with the systems he is comparing. Other things running on your system can affect PT. People also make the mistake of comparing tests with 10 dverbs on a channel or 5 on a channel. This makes a HUGE difference. It has to be consistent. PT handles serial processing (more on a track) far better than parallel processing (more tracks, less dverbs). The Dverb test has been the standard for basically 20 years here on the DUC for benchmarking systems. I created a second test that is also in that link that I use for a bit more modern and taxing test since the track count is getting so high with Dverb test. So on the Performance test 2 for example, the 8700k (4.7Ghz) hits around 119 tracks and the 7820x (4Ghz) hits around 140 tracks. Just chose those 2 since we were talking about them a bit and the most recent Intel offerings. Also, just note the full turbo speed of the 7820x is 4.5Ghz.
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pro-tools-pc.com TRASHER Pro Tools Utility(updated 3-6-18) HD Native, Avid 16x16, Eleven Rack, Focusrite Clarett 8preX, UA Quad Apollo TB. Intel I7 9900k Win 10 |
#56
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
Cheers guitardom. Must be doing something wrong with that 2nd performance test - I get a big fat zero! At a 64 buffer on the 4930k, just that single track gets it into the red, not even record armed. I restarted and deleted every duplicate track, but its not playing ball. Yikes.
EDIT - FWIW seems to be about 45 on a 512 buffer.
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Guy Rowland www.guyrowland.co.uk www.sound-on-screen.com - Original audio clips of movies, TV shows and games, licensed as regular production music. PT 2024 Ultimate; W11 Pro; Ryzen 9 7900; 64gb RAM; RME Babyface; UAD Quad Satellite USB; GTX 1050i Macbook Air M2; 24gb RAM |
#57
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
Hello Can I ask why you change if the 8700K is a downgrade from the i75960x
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#58
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
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Ultimately these will be setup as hackintoshes, at least until Focusrite release full Win support for the Red interfaces. All my machines (one server and 3 workstations) will ultimately live in a AC controlled cabinet. I'm comparing these setups with 'stable OC', which for me is 5ghz on the 8700k and 4.5ghz on the 5960x...so far the OC'd 5960x is actually outperforming the 8700k, but I need to get everything working to really compare. Man the 8700k at 5 ghz is SNAPPY though. Also the AVX offset in the z370 bios seems to leave a little overhead for the GUI which is nice. One thing I'm doing in my benchmark is to put some revibes on some auxes, in my use, this is often the biggest issue with large sessions and low latency tracking... |
#59
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
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#60
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Re: Is the i7 8700K processor good enough for PT Native?
Well guys, I just created a monster! My new rig is up and running:
The weird thing is that latency is up at 44ms, about ten times higher than I expected! |
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