What percentage of total film budget is post pro?

[privateIQ]

While projects certainly vary, does anyone have a rule of thumb for what percentage of a film's total budget is usually assigned for audio post?

[dr sound]

In the past the standard was around 3% so on a $1 Million picture you had a $30,000 Post Sound Budget. This has now shrunk to even 1 and a half percent. Typically it is between 2 and 3%. Whatever the budget, the old saying is "by the time they get to Post Sound, they're out of time and over budget".

[douglas roberts]

The first time I meet the director/producer I get them to empty their pockets and wallet, that's the budget

[georgia]

SO much for Sound being half the experience....


cheers
georgia

[froyo]

By privateIQ

While projects certainly vary, does anyone have a rule of thumb for what percentage of a film's total budget is usually assigned for audio post?

Hello. I think that's kind of like asking if anyone has a rule of thumb for falling in love. Sure you can make some very broad general deductions, but it tends to be an individual experience, different from one another. All that said, I agree with what has been said so far. So as a good Libra, I have just talked out of both sides of my mouth.

This however brings up a fascinating related topic, Audio= Film/video production/post production's bastard stepchild. Anyone who has ever had even a small task in production or post production for picture based projects knows audio gets relegated to the the back of the bus, sometimes to the moped trailing the bus!

Here is an interesting exercise to do yourself and to have others try. Specially for the decision makers who make audio such a low priority. Think of the top 50 grossing films of all time, think of the top 50 most critically acclaimed films of all time, think of favorite smaller, story driven films (Howard's End, Laurel Canyon, etc), think of film's most memorable moments or scenes. Now think of your favorite moments on TV, even your favorite Looney Tunes cartoons. With all that fresh on your mind do this...turn the mute button on.

What would all those 500 jillion dollar earners (Star Wars series, Indiana Jones, etc.) be as silent films? Who would want to see Gone With The Wind or Casablanca and not HEAR classic lines like "Frankly my dear I don't give a damn!" or "Here's looking at you kid". What would Bugs Bunny be without Mel Blanc and the SFX?

So for something that gets so little priority and money, percentage wise, it seems like you could make the argument that audio is at least 50 percent (if not more) of the visual experience. Go figure.

[ricren]

Abut 10 years agos, when I started doing Post for TV shows, the producers did not even have a place in their budget for audio post.
One of then once told me: "Audio what?-while he was scratching his head-I do not even have it in my spreadsheet".
Go figure.

Ten years later this situation has changed. The place in the budget spreadsheet exists, but at least here I feel is underpaid.
In a recent meeting with a producer, when I was asking for two aditional audio editors in order to cope with the project, I had to specify a monthly price for each. When he saw the quantity he insisted that it was "too high, audio editors always earn less that video editors" And the difference he proposed was something like 25-30% less.
When I asked why, he said that the market dictatet it.
So I walked away from that meeting. I have no more patience for morons. But that somewhat shows a generalized view of our field of work by some people.

cheers

Ric

[douglas roberts]

Ah the joys of the film business! I can't count the times when I've been in the position to have to explain to a director that we don't have the money to ADR this scene, or we don't have the money to foley everything, or we don't have the money to get the rights for song X that they cut the whole scene around. Or that the production sound is bad because they got the cheapest location guy possible, or that we only have a week to mix and and and every step of the way becomes a compromise to the lowest possible denominator. I can't count the times the producer has come to me and asked me to work extra days for free to do those little extra things that the director wants, because they know I like the film and the director and I are getting along really well. So the budgets go down but does the level of our work and the heart and the hours we put into it go down as well? No probably not, because we care about how the sound sounds, we want the audience to hear a great sounding film and we don't want to put our names onto something bad and cheap sounding, so we are screwed because we're professionals!? I feel like I have to learn not to care, well if "they" don't why should I be in front of the PTools at 3 in the morning on a saturday fitting foley or making sure ADR is in the tightest sync possible, or coming up with some great new sounds for the flashback sequence?
So you either care or you don't right?, you cut corners and hope none of your friends goes to see the film or you take in the slack and resign youreself to overtime and underpay! I've lost jobs because of being too expensive (oh sure!), but more than once I've been called back to finish the job when they found that JoeBlow didn't know his non drop from his ***hole, the price has gone up everytime
Just my 2euros,
Doug

[dr sound]

Great Post Doug!! One can tell YOU DO CARE!!

[Chris Coleman]

Great Post Doug!! One can tell YOU DO CARE!!

Ha, great "post" - get it? Heh.

[Mario C]

On a related note - I've noticed from a couple friends who do some incredible folley and FX: they are constantly being told their rates are too high and the work will go somewhere else.

But, invariably, the producer will come back and say, "the cheap guy is no good, can you fix it?"

Never money to do it right, but always money to fix it....