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  #11  
Old 03-11-2008, 08:01 PM
bilco bilco is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

The Mbox is optimized for a -10 input. The Summit is almost certainly outputting +4. I ran into this issue trying to run my RNP into the Mbox1 inserts. Really, really hard to get the gain staging setup and not overload the insert line inputs. I finally decided it amounted to dropping a V8 into a VW Beetle.... it can be done, but it still doesn't make it a race car. I just use the Mbox mic preamps for everything when I am recording into it and use the RNP when recording into my Digi 002 Rack.

bilco
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  #12  
Old 03-12-2008, 10:15 AM
sw rec sw rec is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

So again, look at the back of the Summit pre and see if there's an operating level switch that you can set to -10. I'd certainly opt for a Summit mic pre over an onboard M-box mic pre, even if you have to jump thru a few hoops to make it work. BTW Bilco, you said you used the "insert inputs." Inserts and inputs are two totally different things. It WILL work if you plug your preamp output into the inserts,
but if it overloaded things that's probably why. Those are -10 INSERT levels, but according to the Digi documents, the Mbox SHOULD handle up to +24 on the LINE inputs. I'm sending a +4 from a Mackie 1202 to my M-box without any problems at all.
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  #13  
Old 03-14-2008, 02:28 PM
aramayo_jc aramayo_jc is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?


There is no switch at the back of the Summit preamp, but it has two outputs:
+4 balanced XRL
-10 TRS (plugin)
Accordingly to what you are advising I should not use the +4 balanced XRL and use the other output instead, righ? I was using the +4 XRL.

As soon as I get a new cable and make a test I'll let you know how did it go.

Thank you all for your comments.

Aramayo
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  #14  
Old 03-15-2008, 04:51 PM
sw rec sw rec is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

The TRS is probably an INSERT, typically tip=send, ring=return. Check your owners' manual to be sure, but I don't think you want to use it as an output.
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  #15  
Old 03-16-2008, 02:31 AM
andrewSF andrewSF is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

Given the level of equipment we're talking about here I'm going to hazard a guess that the "Summit preamp" we're talking about it the 2BA-221. This unit has a +4 XLR output, a -10 TRS output from the tube stage, and another -10 TRS output from the solid-state stage (which precedes the tube stage although the layout of the front of the device suggests otherwise). There's also a separate insert jack with a TRS jack in the usual send-return configuration.

If the line input on the Mbox is overloading with the output from the +4 output from the Summit I'd suspect that the Summit is overloading as well. The line inputs on the Mbox have pretty decent headroom (better than the Mbox 2 Pro, I can tell you!). You'd have to compare the specs but I'd be surprised if that particular Summit has more than +24db of headroom. Switching to the -10 output might stop the inputs from peaking on the Mbox, but it won't stop the preamp from overloading--it'll just make it harder to tell when it is because the metering will be referencing a different nominal level than the output from the preamp. On the other hand, maybe you like the sound of this preamp when it's pushed a bit (the tube stage will deal with this differently than a solid-state pre will), so using the -10 will allow you to push the gain on the pre without overloading the Mbox.

To be honest I think one answer for the OP who wrote that the pre's "volume control has to be very low or it starts clipping" might just be: if it's too loud to turn it up, you should turn it down. Gain knobs can sit at the bottom of their range, that's why they go down that far! If you have it all the way down and it's still clipping the input of the Mbox, then you might need to use the pad, but if you're just using the bottom of the range of available gain, there's nothing wrong with that.
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  #16  
Old 03-16-2008, 09:32 AM
sw rec sw rec is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

Let's go to the very START of the signal chain. Is this a MIC that's clipping, and if so, does IT have a pad? Maybe that's what needs padded......
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  #17  
Old 03-16-2008, 02:51 PM
andrewSF andrewSF is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

Agreed, it's always best to start troubleshooting from the beginning of the chain. On the other hand, if we're talking about the TLM 103 which the OP lists in his signature, it's spec'd to handle SPL up to 138 dB without distortion. Is Sr. Aramayo recording hand grenades or canon or something incredibly loud? If it's anything that's not painful to be next to, that mic should be handling it fine.
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  #18  
Old 04-14-2008, 03:48 PM
aramayo_jc aramayo_jc is offline
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Default Re: When to use the preamp or MBox Pad ?

[/list]
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  #19  
Old 04-22-2009, 04:01 AM
Delso Delso is offline
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Question sw rec - MAckie 1202 question, please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sw rec View Post
I'm sending a +4 from a Mackie 1202 to my M-box without any problems at all.
I'm getting real problems with my Mackie 1202>MBox 2 setup. It seems to be the whole 'pre-amping a pre-amped signal' issue. If I balance the various Gains on the Mackie, the Input Gains on the MBox and then juggle with the Monitor and Mix pots on the MBox, it's OK (just), but if I then boost the Master gain on the Mackie for playback - BOOM! (Not in a good way!)

I want to use the Mackie, partly for the greater number of inputs, but also for its pre-amps. It seems a waste just to use it as a volume control for my powered monitors.
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