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#11
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
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In the case of singers in the style of Key Sweat and other 90s guys it has to be done more carefully so that it won't sound robotic which was probably originally done with a mix of vocoder, pitch and formant shifters and careful tracking to capture the performance right from the beginning (you won't get a vocal to sound like that if it wasn't recorded with that intention). In my opinion Waves Tune does the best job at hiding artifacts etc for those styles but like Christopher said, you just don't simply repeat a formula someone wrote for you, you need to learn to work with your singers and create a formula for each one of them, and being in a good space that you know well and lets you hear what's really going on helps a lot. Also remember that BoyzII are some of the most badass RnB singers out there, no processing in the world can replace that
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Dell XPS 8700. Intel Core i7-4770 CPU @ 3.40GHz. RAM: 16GB. Windows 10 Home x64. NVIDIA GeForce GTX 645. NI Komplete Audio 6. Pro Tools Software 2019 amagrasmusic.com Last edited by amagras; 12-06-2018 at 01:58 AM. |
#12
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
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ok got you that was really helpful thanks for the info,defiantly going to invest in some treatment.i guess sometimes i set my mixing standards way to high i always try the best to get my mixes to sound like high quality productions then i get frustrated because i cant get it up to that standard i set. i always find myself going back and trying different things thinking ill find a magic one way solution that will get me there smh. it takes me so long just to finish a mix because i keep messing with it always thinking i can make it sound better.then i start to lose the excitement i had with the mix from when i first started creating, by the time im done i dont even care about the song anymore,i dont know if thats a good thing or a bad thing.but thanks for the help well appreciated |
#13
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
It's part your gear and part your lack of experience.
I worked as a tracking and mix engineer in NYC for many years. I'm a producer and composer now but I still cut vocals with the writers I work with. I really enjoy this. Always have. RnB/pop artists that I have recorded their vocals . Whitney Houston Beyonce Knowles Maria Carey Boys 2 Men 112 Christina Aguellera Justin Timberlake Tons more that were not as big. Imo cutting vocals is when the magic happens. When you get the hairs on your neck to rise and you just know the song is a smash hit. Technically I had a preference for certain microphones. And gear. Simply because I knew how to work it and I knew it would sound good so I almost never deviated. A lot of the nuance of that sound is gear given a top level talent. I'm not saying cheap gear would sound bad. But I sort of am. Rather I can get a sound faster and at times i don't even need a singer to do a mic check if I use specific gear. I've used it so many years I can set it in the general setting that I like and it will work and I can adjust as they cut the 1st few vocal lines. For RnB vocalists I always wanted a very detailed mic. I always asked for a specific U47 from a specific rental company If that was not available I asked for a telefunken 250 or a 251. or as a last resort a U67. A neve 1073 mic pre and a LA2A compressor. Sometimes 2 of the same compressor. this is everytime I cut vocals with top artists. Over the years I gravitated to a Sony C800g and Avalon 737sp mic pre. Because it had a built in opto compressor and eq. And I can use this same setup for rappers. This is what I still use for just about every vocalist in my own studio. For tracking. For your situation. Get a good clean microphone. You don't want any distortion in your signal chain. And you need a large diaphragm TUBE mic. TUBE. The mic pre needs transformers. And tubes as well if possible. But transformers more important. You need to have a low cut filter in an eq. Preferable it's on the mic pre. And you need an optical compressor. If the gain structure is setup properly in this type setup you can hit so much compression. And it will not sound like it is compressing even with extreme amount of compression. So you get that bigger than life sound. Some people used to lift the high end with a shelf going in. But I never did as I preferred to add it later in the mix. If I was doing a budget vocal chain these days I would just get a used avalon 737 mic pre and a u47 clone. You will nail that classic RnB vocal sound with it. I know I would be able to with it. Well it might not be budget but imo this is minimum level of gear for that vocal sound. Otherwise it's too hard to get it to my standard fast enough. If you used a u87 and a SSL console mic pre and compressor it just will not sound the same as a c800g and avalon imo. It will lack some girth and air. I've tried tons of gear. But I always went back to my go to setups because to me it sounds the best with minimal fuss. To Clif note this. Tubes Transformers And optical compressor. That's the sound for tracking. (Mixing is another different thing. ) This is rather gear focused but imo that specific vocal sound is part what gear we chose to be used when recording these top artists. Last edited by arche3; 12-06-2018 at 08:58 PM. |
#14
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
That "budget option" with a Avalon and U47 clone will cost the OP over 5000 dollars or more second hand depending on which Tube mic U47 clone he choses so I think that is out of the question but great advice and I agree 100% with the Avalon being a great Channelstrip and allrounder for someone who wanna setup a rec studio with the right basic quality gear.
We use our two Avalons often enough to let them stay in the studios here and it os an easy quest to get a great sounding vocal in seconds with our Sony 800G or the U47 FET. I am a slave to Manley mics and we have all 3 condensors. Was extra impressed with the new silver Manley as our GOLD has a bit too much highs and our Ref-C has a great pop vocal sound but might be a bit too eager to colour the audio but the Silver is everything between so IMHO an awesome mic. Might be somewhat too close the the Brauner VMX we have but totally different vibes.
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Best Regards Christopher #thestruggleisreal ————————————— South Side Music Group WEBHOME ————————————— |
#15
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
Great advice from arche3 and Southsidemusic.
Just to add a low end alternative, I have had a bit of luck with smoothing out harsh vocals with the Soothe plugin. With Soothe you can boost some of the frequency bands where the harshness is most noticable to dampen these areas more. As a starting point try setting the sharpness to 2 and selectivity to 1 and the depth somewhere between 5 and 20. Be carefull with the sharpness and depth. Too much just sounds weird to my ears. Another thing you can do if you have a built in EQ on your preamp is to EQ down the 1k, 2k, 3k or 4k area a bit. That has helped with softening up things for me. |
#16
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
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#17
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
Have you had or tried the Voxbox?
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#18
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
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We also used Neumann KM-86s at Motown with great success. One thing I'd add is that a really great studio allows the singer to work much farther back without losing presence or the sound getting castrated by too much compression. It's ironic, I can get a great drum sound in a living room but vocals always benefit from a proper studio.
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#19
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
Yes. But usually the studios that had these in NYC usually were rentals that were left over. So I would use it at times. I always thought it was too many buttons and stuff. Since I'm a creature of habit I never pulled it in on a tracking session that mattered. And when I did a tons of tracking all the sessions mattered so I rarely used it.
It sounds good imo. But the other gear I was much more used to so i always went with other stuff. And why is there a desser on it ? I'm not going to deess going in... |
#20
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Re: r&b vocals mixing tips
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I actually learned a lot of nuance about recording assisting engineers such as yourself when I was coming up in this industry. Maybe this is why I have a fixation on tubes and transformers. What I love about this type of gear is it's very easy to get stuff to sound good. Not a lot of fiddling necessary. |
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