Please Avid We All Really Want You to Be Successful

[lexaudio]

Originally Posted by Bill Denton

There was a paper mill in a town I once lived in...

Among many other employees, there was a group of five welders...one was always on duty when the paper mill was running.

These welders worked in an office...a very nice office with a TV, a small refrigerator, a small stove, and a nice sofa for them to nap on.

Usually, the only work these guys did in an entire year was a welding "test" to insure their skills were sharp.

But these welders knew how to do one particular type of weld on one particular machine.

This machine only went down every couple of years or so. But if these welders weren't on-site, it would take about six hours to bring someone in from outside to fix it.

But, if that machine were down for six hours, the company would lose far more money than it cost to keep those welders on site for a couple of years. A lot more money.

Just as a point of reference, this was a huge paper mill. And one very small mill I was aware of would lose $35,000 per hour they were down.

I'm sure most of you guys are quite skilled at running small-to-medium sized businesses.

But when you are running a large-to-huge business, the economics are totally different. And in our game, the need for a service plan is totally different.

I often use the phrase, "Everybody who lives in Naperville thinks everybody else lives in Naperville."

Unfortunately, a lot of you guys are stuck in your own "Naperville". You tend to see things only from the perspective of your own business. And you want Avid to respond to your business' needs.

But there is a whole huge "business world" outside of your "Naperville", with a whole range of "business needs", often quite different from your business needs.

And while you may not need to look outside of your "Naperville" to run your business successfully, Avid doesn't have that liberty...they have to look at everybody's "Naperville". And it is in your best interest to understand that...

I've tried to bite my tongue in responding, but considering you said I was spreading misinformation, now its my turn.

First, your analogies are so far from the reality they are actually funny.

When was the last time you were at Fox, Sony, Paramount? OH never.

The client doesn't dictate what console the project is mixed on, or what it is edited on.
They hire the talent operating it, not the software they are operating.

There wouldn't ever be anyone "Bringing" a studio one project to Fox in the first place.
Like some kid in his bedroom is going to edited something and bring it on the the lot.

Clients bring projects that need sound, and final mixed. If it was Studio One or Logic, they wouldn't care. They have a deadline and x amount of money for Post sound.
It needs to get done, with x amount of budget, in this timeframe.

2nd, your analogies about why big places "need a support" plan is laughable, and you are making it sound like you are "so knowledgable" about what happens here in LA on the Sony, FOX, WB lots.
Clearly, you don't have they slightest clue or even 3rd hand knowledge.

Your trying to justify AVID's support plan and why the "big studios" use it because it seems like you are trying to get some "brownie point" here on the forum.

The reality is completely opposite of your analogy.

On the lots, when there is a technical problem you don't call AVID. You call engineering.
The lots have trained engineers in all the hardware and software. If there is a software issue, like a bug that causes downtime, they will down rev the software and test/repo the bug can let AVID know.

They most certainly DO NOT sit there on the phone with AVID support.

The same is for hardware. These facilities buy extra pieces of hardware. So if the HDX card is acting up, or something hardware wise is being problematic, they swap out the system and figure it out later.
The engineers are all trained in Pro Tools, the hardware, the operating systems, and console operations as well.

When Technicolor bought 8 S5's for their new rooms, they also bought spare buckets, faders, TFT screens, encoder knobs, power supplies, DSP cards, computers, ect.
Calling AVID in the event something goes wrong "for support", would cost the lots more than the support is worth.
Not to mention the client being overly pissed off.
If the client is paying $1500 dollars an hour and it takes an hour to swap out parts, then $1500 isn't as bad a lose.

Waiting for an AVID rep to come to the sight, figure it out ect ect, could be a day. Which would mean, the client loses and day, the deadline can't change so now to make up that day, the crew is working on Saturday which is time and a half, so the lot has to pay for that.

Paying 200k plus or more a year for support, makes no financial sense. Especially if use at all, might get used once or twice at best if at all. So why would they buy 200, 300 support plans?
Why not buy 1, for one license on a test system?

So regardless of what you "think" you know about this business, you don't know anything.

And the music industry. They make even less money, much less, so its one more expense they don't need, won't pay for and won't use.

AVID is trying to convince users that they "need" a support plan and it will be great to have.
Unfortunately for the users who really use the software, we all know how much of a crock it is. It is snake oil they are selling.

Beside the obvious "cash grab", I think AVID needs to find out more about what bugs are in their software, in order to keep up with their "plan" of regular bug updates fixes, and they don't have a smart system in place to report bugs.

And how many individuals in the middle of a project are going to , stop, get on the phone and call AVID to report a bug? Very few.

If I need support, I have a network of peers I can call. I've never needed to call AVID other than authorization issues.

So stop telling people how things are here in LA and how this industry is run, and why the support system AVID says they need is needed by them. Because it isn't and won't be used.

And while we are in this. I found this very interesting here. It seems like Media Composer was moved to this "support extortion scheme" before Pro Tools. While reading in the Post section here about PT 11 video engine still not working, a user commented how he was getting more Premiere exported videos now.

That's says a lot. And I'm sure the shift will continue. AS will the shift in audio as well.

[paul007]

Originally Posted by lexaudio

AVID is trying to convince users that they "need" a support plan and it will be great to have.
Unfortunately for the users who really use the software, we all know how much of a crock it is. It is snake oil they are selling.

Maybe they should turn around their spindoctorism of "Support Plans" 180 degrees.
(Crowdfunding is very 21st century)

"We, Avid, need a company Support Plan, and we need all of YOU passionate customers to finance it."

Chances are I might even sympathize with that concept, and sign up ;-)

[bcwiz]

Originally Posted by lexaudio

AVID is trying to convince users that they "need" a support plan and it will be great to have.
Unfortunately for the users who really use the software, we all know how much of a crock it is. It is snake oil they are selling.

Pretty much sums it up.

[Park Seward]

Originally Posted by lexaudio

Waiting for an AVID rep to come to the sight, figure it out ect ect, could be a day.

I got to know the Ampex service reps very well when I owned a video post house. One told me how he acts when going on a service call to fix an Ampex 2" Quad VTR, a very complicated beast.

He first went in and had coffee with the chief and talked about the problems they were having. After looking at the machine, the field service guy knew what the problem was and how to fix it. Except he didn't fix it right away. That would embarrass the engineering staff if the repair was quick. After all, they just paid to fly this guy in and pay his day rate. They wanted the repair to take time.

So he took out his tools, set-up a waveform monitor and picture monitor and proceeded to check out the VTR. Took a little while until he "found" the problem.

BTW, there was never any charge to call engineering support. You could (and I did) talk to them for hours, even after the office was closed for the night. And about any television topic, even competitors products. These guys knew their product in and out and also know all the "secrets" that were not in the manuals.

They could do this because of the cost and margin on their gear. A Quad VTR was close to $100,000. They welcomed your calls.

I once had a VTR with loose contacts on the circuit boards. Ampex flew in a service engineer to tighten the pressure to a new specification. Took about 10 minutes. Then we went to lunch. No charge for the repair or any expenses. But there was enough margin to afford servicing clients like that. Ampex didn't have anything that cost less than $30,000 at the time.

Those days are gone forever.

[lexaudio]

That was a very, very long time ago.

The big facilities here in town would have spares to swap out and if they couldn't fix it themselves, they would have a tech there within the day to service it.

And now, service calls are rare. The Neve DFC's are all repaired on sight by engineering.

The cost of having an onsite engineer that can cover engineering across multiple devices is far more financially smart than having service contracts for every device and manufacturer on the site.

It is also better financially to pay per service than an on going service contract especially for Pro Tools. Because if used once or even twice within a year, it will still be cheaper and a much bigger savings in the long run.

Paul really put it best. AVID is crowd funding the business and there isn't much in return to the users.

I noticed Bruce talking about "certain users" posting "a lot". Yet, the concerns and contradictions mentioned by AVID from multiple sources in AVID have yet to be addressed by anyone at AVID.

The very "you will still get updates" contradicts the FAQ. Its unfair to the users because a lot of people are believing that even if they don't buy the support plan they will still get updates for bug fixes.
Except, that isn't want the FAQ says. It says, updates until dec 31, 2015.
And when purchasing a "support plan" you get 12 months of updates/upgrades.

Sly. So when people miss the dead line or let it lapse, there is going to be people saying, David and Bruce said we would always get upgrades for bug fixes.
Then, well we meant until dec 31, 2015. The FAQ says this.

Kind of reminds me of Obama and the "you like your plan you can keep your plan" he said for years. Then when it wasn't turn it was "well, I didn't say that really because what I meant was this" kind of spin.

[Justin1524]

Originally Posted by Bill Denton

Now...just take a Studio One session over to Fox or Sony...but make sure there's an EMT standing buy...people have died from laughing that hard...

I'll just tell them S1 has the quality, features, reliability and support I need without all the hassles of Pro Tools. Here's a guy who uses Studio One all day long and recommends it dare I say over Pro Tools...

https://www.youtube.com/user/VisionRecordingCt/videos

...trust me, I ain't laughin' at him, I'm listening to him.

[JCBigler]

That's a great story Bill....but I think you are stating to piss some people off.

Your continued harping on the accounting issues doesn't make any sense. Sarbanes-Oaxley has been in effect for 13 years now. You haven't been able to explain why now, all of a sudden Avid has to change their accounting system to come into compliance with Sarbanes-Oaxley 12 or 13 years after everyone else had to do it. And SOX doesn't say anything about product updates, release timelines, or subscriptions. It's all about reporting to investors and the SEC, and some IT security issues.

The new licensing, support plans, and subscriptions are about one thing and one thing only: generating cash flow, without having to release any new products.

The only thing that the accounting issues have to do with the new licensing and subscriptions is that they are both products of ineffectual and incompetent management.

And the only way that both of these things makes sense together, is if Avid is trying to increase their liquid capital, in an effort to make a stock buy back and take the company private.

[noiseboyuk]

Though I don't know anything about the insides of the big US studios, what Lex describes is exactly how TV works in the UK. Big facilities have their engineering departments who fix / swap out / sort the hardware and IT issues. At more leisure they'll liaise with the companies involved.

[coolbass]

Originally Posted by Bill Denton

Do you really think the things Avid is doing actually have anything to do with support?

Avid is doing what they are doing in order to comply with some accounting requirements...period.

You really need to educate yourself so you'll understand this stuff...

Bill, please, you are really starting to embarass yourself.

[deanrichard]

Bill, you really need to calm down.

I asked a question, a simple one, and a reasonable one.

Many companies that charge for support consider it a cash cow. I wondered why Avid wouldn't feel the same, given that they charge for support. I don't know the answer, or else I wouldn't have asked it in the form of a question.

I don't see anything in my post mentioning the current changes. I don't know anything about Avid's accounting, nor do I care to. You seemed very concerned about it, but I'm not.

Your posting style is way over the top.

Dean

Originally Posted by Bill Denton

Do you really think the things Avid is doing actually have anything to do with support?

Avid is doing what they are doing in order to comply with some accounting requirements...period.

You really need to educate yourself so you'll understand this stuff...