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  #1  
Old 05-13-2004, 09:52 PM
Snyderman Snyderman is offline
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Default Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

I'm looking at getting a matched pair of omni's for classical recording. What are the differences that I might hear in the TC30K's, the QTC 30's and the QTC1's?
I'll be using them with the Digi002 pre's.
Thanks for any info!
derek

Also thinking about the new C414's when they come out as they would be more versatile.
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  #2  
Old 05-14-2004, 02:21 AM
crowdog crowdog is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Snyderman,
For Classical I would definitely get the QTC1 or the QTC30 .......... they have a much lower noise floor than the TC30K's. The noise floor for the QTC's is 22dB spl, while the TC30K is 27dB spl. Recording classical will require a very quiet mic and preamp, the noise floor WILL BE revealed by the quiet movements. I guarantee the TC30K's wouldn't cut it the for the soft passages, instrument or ensembles.

I have a pair of QTC1's and they are barely quiet enough for some of recordings I've done, but I love the way sound on alot of different sources - definitely an excellent sounding and useful microphone. I've use them on ensembles, acoustic guitar, percussion and drums overheads and have been thrilled with their performance. They were a little noisy for a quiet vocal ensemble.

Another mic to check out for the same applications that has the "being there vibe" is T.H.E. Audio's TT-3M. It's another SD Omni that has a quieter noise floor (16dB) and is also an excellent sounding microphone. A little more money than the QTC1's, but a really nice microphone.

http://www.theaudio.com/tt-3m.html

Call Calistro Music for a great price : http://www.calistromusic.com/

also Fletcher sells both brands, backed by Mercenary's excellent customer service and return policy.

http://www.mercenary.com/ttttitemeomm.html

http://www.mercenary.com/earqtomdirmi.html

Good luck with it and happy recording,

Tony
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  #3  
Old 05-14-2004, 06:17 AM
Snyderman Snyderman is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Hey Tony,
I was wondering about the noise factor myself. I'll be using them mostly for string quartet and small ensembles and cello multitracking. Someone from the TDM forum said he has used the SRO's recording the St Paul Chamber Orch. live and loved them. I hadn't even thought of them.

I'm planning a lot a cello ensemble (multitracking) stuff this summer and was thinking of getting a Royer 121 or SF1 for and close micing with an Earthworks omni mixed in. Since I'm multitracking is the mic 'noise' going to be amplified by each track that I add?

Thanks!
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  #4  
Old 05-14-2004, 07:54 PM
crowdog crowdog is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Quote:
Hey Tony,
I was wondering about the noise factor myself. I'll be using them mostly for string quartet and small ensembles and cello multitracking. Someone from the TDM forum said he has used the SRO's recording the St Paul Chamber Orch. live and loved them. I hadn't even thought of them.

I'm planning a lot a cello ensemble (multitracking) stuff this summer and was thinking of getting a Royer 121 or SF1 for and close micing with an Earthworks omni mixed in. Since I'm multitracking is the mic 'noise' going to be amplified by each track that I add?

Thanks!
I think that's a pretty good plan to use a ribbon + an SD Omni. For cello I'd prefer the SF1 over the 121, that plus one of the QTC's would be a nice combo. Keep in mind that the preamp will be pretty critical ....... you'll want lot's of clean gain for the ribbon as their output is pretty low compared to condensers, the Earthworks has a very hot output so that shouldn't be as much of a concern (although the self noise of the mic will be) . I'm not sure if you have any $$ for a pre, but a GML or Millenia would be stellar for that type of use. I haven't used the 002r so I don't know what the pre's are like.

Probably one of the biggest factors that gets overlooked will be the room that you record in. If you have players with great tone in a nice sounding room, your job will be a thousand times easier.

If you are multitracking the same signal chain, then accumulative noise probably will be a factor. What level of quality are you shooting for?? Are you the cellist?

Peace,

Tony
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  #5  
Old 05-14-2004, 10:12 PM
Snyderman Snyderman is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Yup, I'm the cellist.
Quote:
If you are multitracking the same signal chain, then accumulative noise probably will be a factor. What level of quality are you shooting for??
I am looking to end up with a nice 'professional' product. I've done a lot of cello ensemble arranging for Dave Brubeck and want to create a nice demo recording of the arrangements for commercial release and as advertisement for the arrangements. I'm doing all the performing because it gives me the luxury of getting everything just right on my own budget.

What do you hear as the differences with the SF1 and 121 on cello?
As pre's go I was checking out the Sytek MPX-4Aii. It could be in my budget if I work the mics right. The Millennia HV-3B is a bit beyond me right now. The 002 pre's are supposed to be fairly clean but I have no reference. The recording side of music is a new game for me.

Quote:
If you are multitracking the same signal chain, then accumulative noise probably will be a factor.
What does this mean? I believe that I am.

Thanks for the thoughts.

derek
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  #6  
Old 05-15-2004, 11:01 AM
crowdog crowdog is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Derek,

Quote:
I am looking to end up with a nice 'professional' product. I've done a lot of cello ensemble arranging for Dave Brubeck and want to create a nice demo recording of the arrangements for commercial release and as advertisement for the arrangements. I'm doing all the performing because it gives me the luxury of getting everything just right on my own budget.
You keep good company, you must do great work .... congrats!

Quote:
What do you hear as the differences with the SF1 and 121 on cello?
IMO .... for strings the SF1 has a really nice balance and clarity that the 121 lacks, it's smoother on the top while retaining the ability for great detail. I think the 121 tends to sound a little harsher on strings. Especially in the what I call the "rosin range" of frequencies 6-8KHz.
Another possibility is the venerable Coles 4038, which is a darker, rounder sound or the new Coles 4040 which has a brighter top, a little less low-mid girth and higher output. So many choices.

Quote:
As pre's go I was checking out the Sytek MPX-4Aii. It could be in my budget if I work the mics right
I've never used it, but have heard many people say it's a nice clean pre. Pretty cost effective.

Quote:
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you are multitracking the same signal chain, then accumulative noise probably will be a factor.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


What does this mean? I believe that I am.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant that if you use the same mic and preamp for each overdub, then their respective noise will be on each track.

Quote:
The recording side of music is a new game for me.
It's a whole other universe! Welcome to the dark side.

BTW, where are you located? If you're in the Northeast I'd be willing to get together for a A/B session.

Best regards,

Tony
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  #7  
Old 05-16-2004, 04:51 PM
Snyderman Snyderman is offline
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Default Re: Earthworks TC30K, QTC30 or QTC1\'s?

Hey Tony,
Thanks for the A/B offer. I'm living in Cleveland but travel a fair amount and would love to meet up for some equipment testing. What is your background? Are you a performer? What sort of recording have you done? More about me can be found at The Phoenix Ensemble. I'm the Assistance Director/Principal cellist/graphic designer/water boy.

Thanks for the Royer thoughts. I'm very eager to hear them on my cello! I think that I will pick up a pair of the QTC30's for some live string quartet concerts that we have coming up. I don't think I'll regret having them but I'm am quite interested in the new generation C414's that are coming out. I called AKG and they said they would be available in June.

Where are you located? You can reach me directly at dsnyder@phoenixensemble.com

Take care,
derek
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