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  #11  
Old 01-07-2020, 11:19 AM
SFXgeek SFXgeek is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

So it's not just 1 session with us, it's happening with multiple sessions in different rooms from different sources, been doing damage control all night and all morning, finally switched all rooms back to 2019.10.

Here's our situation:

We are currently working on 4 weekly series.
We have 4 edit rooms (PT 2019), 2 mix rooms (PT 2019 Ultimate), 1 record/ foley room (PT 2019 Ultimate), SFX sessions coming from external editors (PT 10), Music sessions from external composers (PT 2019.12).

All those sessions (SFX, DIAL, MUS, FOL) get imported into a Mix Room session in the Mix room via (Import Session Data).

Our problems arouse when we still had all systems running 2019.10 and we went to import the MUSIC session from the composer who was running 2019.12, on import we received the message that all the audio files were missing which we've never had from the Music session before. Went into the Relink window to locate the audio files, chose to manually find the missing files, used the "Find by Name and File ID", "Match Duration", and "Match Format" options, navigated to the exact folder the audio was in, could see the audio was there and that all the UIDs matched exactly, clicked the "find Link" button and it said that there were no matches. Tried again using the "Find by File ID" option with the same result, tried again with "Find by Name" option and it found all the audio. I have never trusted the "Find by Name" option because there is room for error on this option, opposed to matching the UID.

So because of this problem arising I decided to upgrade all our systems to 2019.12 to match the Composers sessions and not run into this problem anymore.

Some of our shows were in the middle of production when I upgraded all the systems, so some shows had their session created in 2019.10 but after the upgrade to 2019.12 those sessions had more work done in them.

On Sunday a show was imported (using Import Session Data from our internal server) into our Mix Room 1 and it worked no problem and was used most of the day, later that day I upgraded that room to 2019.12 . Monday morning the mixer came in to continue working and on launch of the session received the message "Some clips had invalid bounds and were adjusted or deleted" , it gave the option to save a detailed report which we did. We opened the report and checked out the spots it mentioned and those cues were all playing random audio from the session.

I also had to import Session data into our Mix Room 2 for another show, this time the system had already been upgraded to 2019.12 before creating the mix session, also this time I imported the session data directly from the networked computer it was created on, went to import and immediately received the same message "Some clips had invalid bounds and were adjusted or deleted", after the import finished a large amount (7 printed pages) of cues were playing the wrong audio. So I went back into the Edit room it was imported from and opened the session and received the same message "Some clips had invalid bounds and were adjusted or deleted" and those same cues were now all messed up, even though I had just been working on that session all day with no problems it now after trying to import it into another room was completely F**KED.

The other problem we had yesterday was while working on a session created in 2019.12 went to "Import Clip Group", something we do thousands of times daily (the Clip Group would have been created in 201910 or earlier) I received the message "Could not complete the Drag from Browser command because out_of_range: Cmn_PolyVectorImpl::At" .

I have now changed all our systems back to 2019.10, but am very afraid of what has taken place.
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  #12  
Old 01-07-2020, 02:48 PM
MikeReganNoise MikeReganNoise is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

Wow, that's an absolute nightmare. I hope Avid is paying attention to this. Based on what I experienced myself earlier this year and today, it's a trouble error with no fast remedy. It was a loss of hours of work in my case. It seems Avid is aware of a serious but rare bug that is baked into the 2018-2019 builds of PT Ultimate. The only consistency in my case is using a template that I know originated in the UK. All of the other work I did in 2019 did not have this issue. It's maybe a coincidence.
I have a support ticket with Avid and they told me this at the time. I have the tracer if you want to try it, but for what it's worth, it did not save me yesterday.


Good day! Just got an update from our Engineering.

We don't yet know exactly why this can happen, but the theory is that at some point something causes the clip list of the open session to become corrupted and from that point on all session file backups are also affected by the same problem (but without any indication of a problem until the session is closed and reopened, at which point it's realized that the clip list has become truncated and assertion errors/invalid fade errors are posted).

So, for customers who have experienced this, we are asking them to enable some extra tracing to try and "catch" the problem if it should happen again. To add the tracing, you need to ask the customer to unzip the attached file and drop the included config.digitrace and DigiOptionsFile.txt files into their /Applications folder (or wherever the Pro Tools application runs from). Then, launch Pro Tools and work as normal.

If the problem occurs, as soon as the clip list becomes mangled (i.e. the start of the problem which the user would not normally see) an error message will immediately be posted that states "After <name-of-command> Pro Tools cannot resolve the session's clip list...".

If this message is seen, it's ABSOLUTELY IMPERATIVE that the following is then done immediately:

(1) Note down the date/time.

(2) Without doing anything in Pro Tools, immediately gather the last modified Pro Tools logfile from /Users/<username>/Library/Logs/Avid (and the previous one or two for good measure).

(3) Perform a Save As of the session, and send this .ptx (along with the last few session file backups) and the logs collected in step (2) to us for analysis.

(4) If the problem is identified quickly enough, the previous session file backup (i.e. before the "event" occurred) should open correctly and work can be resumed from that.


Note: tracing will only work with PT 2018.10 and higher
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  #13  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:08 PM
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gwhatley gwhatley is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

I am curious: when you (anyone in this thread) receive a session to import, do you

(a) import it directly into your session without opening it first; or

(b) separately open it first in your version, and save it as a ".2", and THEN import that newly-saved version into your master session?

(c) go a step further and take the received session you are to import and "Save Copy In...", creating an entirely new session and new audio files prior to importing.

I typically do "(b)" and have not had this issue - but the one time I did NOT - and imported a 2019.10 session into a 2019.12 - two files were referencing the wrong source files.

I'm wondering if one particular method makes a difference.

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  #14  
Old 01-07-2020, 08:19 PM
SFXgeek SFXgeek is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

We have always done “a” with zero problems. 1000s of sessions.
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  #15  
Old 01-07-2020, 08:23 PM
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gwhatley gwhatley is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

And that is definitely how it SHOULD work!

It could be this simple extra step may be helpful for the near term - and I'm curious if it makes a difference for anyone else.

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  #16  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:08 AM
MikeReganNoise MikeReganNoise is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

I am in the same boat as SFX Geek. I've used (a) in almost every situation for years without any issues. The issue I've experienced is slightly different but some of the symptoms are the same.

That said, I have taken steps to avoid this situation, namely a clean session template, separate from the one I've had trouble with. Containment seems like a good solution, but I would love more help from Avid. I've started a new ticket with them and will also refer them to this thread. These clip bin bugs are catastrophic and potentially damaging to client relationships and businesses in a way that I've not encountered before with Pro Tools bugs. There is no fast solution to recovering the work, it's literally gone and it happens without warning.

In terms of protecting sessions that have already been worked on, I have been "saving as" and time stamping each .ptx file with a date/time at regular intervals. Then, I .zip the .ptx files as an extra measure. No idea if this would help, but I'm hoping it saves me when I find that he session file back ups become corrupted at the same time and with no warning.
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  #17  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:10 PM
SFXgeek SFXgeek is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

Here's what I've done to get things back to some normality, all our systems have been switched back to 2019.10. Any sessions that we did create in 2019.12 and any sessions being delivered to us that were created in 2019.12, we are copying the entire folder (instead of simply Import session Data) to our computer (Which is now running 2019.10) opening that session and then doing a "Save as" and calling it " .....Ver2" , also we are dong a "Save copy in" and saving a copy to our server. Then we will Import Session Data from that copy that lives on our server, so far so good.
AVID please fix this!!! ASAP!!
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  #18  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:43 PM
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gwhatley gwhatley is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

Quote:
Originally Posted by SFXgeek View Post
Here's what I've done to get things back to some normality, all our systems have been switched back to 2019.10. Any sessions that we did create in 2019.12 and any sessions being delivered to us that were created in 2019.12, we are copying the entire folder (instead of simply Import session Data) to our computer (Which is now running 2019.10) opening that session and then doing a "Save as" and calling it " .....Ver2" , also we are dong a "Save copy in" and saving a copy to our server. Then we will Import Session Data from that copy that lives on our server, so far so good.

AVID please fix this!!! ASAP!!
Yeah, that is a ton of hoops to jump through, considering the volume of work and outside source material you referenced earlier. But I get it: this problem can be an absolute show-stopping client-relationship-killer. Better safe than sorry -- but beyond that, better for Avid to find a solution FAST.

I'm staying on 2019.12 for now, and will stick with "b" above as the guideline as it has worked for me so far.

Reading this and another thread, I've decided to also open and re-version all my internal templates.

If I encounter the specific issue (clips in the session referencing the wrong audio) again, I'll update here and consider moving to what you're doing (essentially "c" above AFTER re-versioning the import session) - but I'm going to hold off since it seems like quite a potential time-killer!

Best of luck

G.

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  #19  
Old 01-14-2020, 07:19 AM
Tim R. Tim R. is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

Any update from people who experienced this bug? Word from AVID? I thankfully haven't had it crop up again. I'm being diligent about opening old sessions and "saving as".
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System 2: Pro Tools 2019.12 (no Hardware), Mac OS 10.14.6, MBP (Retina 13in, Early 2015, 3.1Ghz i7, 16Gig RAM)
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  #20  
Old 01-16-2020, 07:18 AM
simonchase simonchase is offline
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Default Re: Clips suddenly referencing wrong audio

Just adding a plus one. We've had this issue with one of our sessions today.

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