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  #21  
Old 02-08-2007, 10:27 AM
Dave Edgar Dave Edgar is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

For those who regularly work on long-form 2 hour + videos, and need to output multiple scratch tracks of different combinations for use by others (transcriptionists, scorers, dialogue and sound effects editors) then the real time bounce is a major pain. And with the computer processing power that we have today, to say that we can only get quality in real time is crap. I can bounce files all day in other programs, and continue to use the computer while it is doing it. I only work in Protools because I am at a commercial studio and we have to have it for compatibility. But paying an extra $1k for things like a SMPTE timeline that is included for free in other programs really ticks me off, and as soon as I can get away from Digidesign I will. They are shooting themselves in the foot with some of their practices and I am seeing more and more professional studios getting tired of it. We actually have studios in St. Louis now advertising "Pro-Tools Free environment" and they are doing quite well.
  #22  
Old 02-08-2007, 11:09 AM
Mr.BossPlaya Mr.BossPlaya is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

Quote:
For those who regularly work on long-form 2 hour + videos, and need to output multiple scratch tracks of different combinations for use by others (transcriptionists, scorers, dialogue and sound effects editors) then the real time bounce is a major pain. And with the computer processing power that we have today, to say that we can only get quality in real time is crap. I can bounce files all day in other programs, and continue to use the computer while it is doing it. I only work in Protools because I am at a commercial studio and we have to have it for compatibility. But paying an extra $1k for things like a SMPTE timeline that is included for free in other programs really ticks me off, and as soon as I can get away from Digidesign I will. They are shooting themselves in the foot with some of their practices and I am seeing more and more professional studios getting tired of it. We actually have studios in St. Louis now advertising "Pro-Tools Free environment" and they are doing quite well.
YES, BUT NON REAL TIME BOUNCING GIVES YOU THE COMPUTER'S BEST ESTIMATE ON HOW MATERIAL SHOULD SOUND. LIKE I HAVE BEEN SAYING BEFORE, NOT A TRUE TRANSLATION. YES IT WOULD BE GREAT TO HAVE THAT OPTION FOR A QUICK BOUNCE, BUT AGAIN WHY WOULD YOU COMPROMISE YOUR MATERIAL, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE AT A COMMERCIAL STUDIO? WHY WOULD YOU SPEND HOURS MIXING TO ONLY GET 99% OF THE TRUE MIX? I KNOW THAT ALL THE COMERCIAL STUDIOS THAT I WORK AT, WE NEED ERROR FREE SOUNDS, I GUESS IT IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT IN ST. LOUIS.
  #23  
Old 02-08-2007, 11:42 AM
Dave Edgar Dave Edgar is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

I KNOW THAT ALL THE COMERCIAL STUDIOS THAT I WORK AT, WE NEED ERROR FREE SOUNDS, I GUESS IT IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT IN ST. LOUIS.

[/QUOTE]

yes, it must be different here, we know how to read. What part of "and need to output multiple SCRATCH tracks of different combinations for use by others" didn't you get? These tracks are used as reference only.

We also know what a caps lock key is. And how to use it. And how to spell "commercial"
  #24  
Old 02-08-2007, 11:58 AM
Mr.BossPlaya Mr.BossPlaya is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

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I KNOW THAT ALL THE COMERCIAL STUDIOS THAT I WORK AT, WE NEED ERROR FREE SOUNDS, I GUESS IT IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT IN ST. LOUIS.
yes, it must be different here, we know how to read. What part of "and need to output multiple SCRATCH tracks of different combinations for use by others" didn't you get? These tracks are used as reference only.

We also know what a caps lock key is. And how to use it. And how to spell "commercial"

[/QUOTE]

looks like i struck a nerve, so here you go...MAYBE YOU CAN COME DOWN HERE AND SHOW ME HOW TO WORK MY CAPS AND HOW TO SPELL. I GUESS THAT I DID NOT UNDERSTAND YOU. HOW WOULD YOU PRINT THEM ANYWAYS? SEND TO A TAPE...THAT YOU NEED IN REAL TIME ANYWAYS, WHICH REAL "COMMERCIAL" STUDIOS USE ANYWAYS. I HAVE NEVER WENT TO A REAL STUDIO THAT USED CAKEWALK BECAUSE THEY CAN BOUNCE FASTER. IF YOU DONT LIKE PT THEN STOP COMPLAINING AND USE CALKWALK/SONAR/CUBASE/OR EVEN FRUITY LOOPS TO TRACK AND BOUNCE YOUR MATERIAL. BUT I GUESS IN ST LOUIS YOU ARE SO NELLY'ED OUT, THAT YOU OVER LOOK YOUR QUALITY IN YOUR MATERIAL.

JUST MY 2 CENTS BIG BOI....OOPS MY BAD..."BOY"

PS...I DID SPELL COMMERCIAL RIGHT THE FIRST TIME, I GUESS I WAS SO OVERWHELMED WITH YOUR POST THAT I MISSED A "M"....COME TEACH ME YODA
  #25  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:06 PM
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JFreak JFreak is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

Quote:
For those who regularly work on long-form 2 hour + videos, and need to output multiple scratch tracks of different combinations for use by others (transcriptionists, scorers, dialogue and sound effects editors) then the real time bounce is a major pain.
That kind of project involves so many people and so huge budget that it is absolutely no problem buying basic HD system for everyone that needs one. Those work-in-progress versions are transferred as Protools sessions. Only final versions are bounced.
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  #26  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:11 PM
audiogeek1 audiogeek1 is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

Quote:
I KNOW THAT ALL THE COMERCIAL STUDIOS THAT I WORK AT, WE NEED ERROR FREE SOUNDS, I GUESS IT IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT IN ST. LOUIS.
yes, it must be different here, we know how to read. What part of "and need to output multiple SCRATCH tracks of different combinations for use by others" didn't you get? These tracks are used as reference only.

We also know what a caps lock key is. And how to use it. And how to spell "commercial"

[/QUOTE]

Ever thought of bussing. That is what it is there for. Ability to send things to many different places. Instead of bouncing to disk just record to another track. Works like a champ. Makes things easy.

Just a thought. Also the real time bounce can be a pain but then again razor blade editing was a pain also. But you could get good results with it. I do not trust a non real time bounce. Maybe I am just old. Also I mix on a console so I have to mix in real time.

Mike
  #27  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:24 PM
Dave Edgar Dave Edgar is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

Yes, you did strike a nerve, because you jumped onto my post, impugning not only myself but a whole geographic area, without understanding what you were talking about. Your use for Protools may be perfect for you, but I was referring to my use for Protools, and how it is not perfect for me. But, like some Microsoft products, I am forced to use them because of economic reality. You make statements about how computers work, how digital files work, how real time must be better, well, send us some references on the web proving what you say is true. Send me some links where audio and computer engineers have gotten together, empirically studied and tested, and determined that real time bounces are more accurate than non real time. Which, as I stated before, doesn't apply to my usage of Protools anyway. One documentary film that we made had over 1200 hours of footage. Do you, Mr Perfect Mix all the time, spend countless hours mixing and tweaking the tracks, most of which will never be used, then spend 1200 hours outputting it in real time, just so you can send it to a transcriptionist to get a written transcript? Of course not. Your use of Protools and mine are different. I did not jump in and attack you or you methods, until you jumped on me first. I would not presume to tell you what you need, don't you be so presumptuous to assume that you know what my needs are, or whether your mixes are better than anyone elses because of the methods you employ. I stated what is occurring here, and you used it as the basis for a slam against me and a whole region. If you don't like what I said, then take issue with it honestly and logically, not like you did, calling people "boy" and referring to Nelly and what not. Those responses are totally off topic, unproductive and should have been left in grade school. You say that you are a professional, but how you communicate in public seems to refute that.
  #28  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:34 PM
Dave Edgar Dave Edgar is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

[quoteThat kind of project involves so many people and so huge budget that it is absolutely no problem buying basic HD system for everyone that needs one. Those work-in-progress versions are transferred as Protools sessions. Only final versions are bounced.

[/QUOTE]

This is not correct. For the final mixdown we usually can afford to do to an HD system, but for all the interim mixes and scratch tracks until picture lock we use one of our LE stations. And like a said in another post, my transcriptionist doesn't have a Protools station, she wants a wav with time code stamp. We don't need HD until the final mix, and I can't afford an HD station for inhouse. Especially with the cost of HD cameras now : ) I wish that I could, I'd love to have a Protools HD setup.
  #29  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:53 PM
Dave Edgar Dave Edgar is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

Hey Mike. Is it possible to set up separate bus paths so that one bouce session can output multiple files made up of different track combinations? If so, that would be really helpful at times.
  #30  
Old 02-08-2007, 01:13 PM
chris110000100101001 chris110000100101001 is offline
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Default Re: Real-Time Bounce to Disk...REAL PAIN

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YES, BUT NON REAL TIME BOUNCING GIVES YOU THE COMPUTER'S BEST ESTIMATE ON HOW MATERIAL SHOULD SOUND. LIKE I HAVE BEEN SAYING BEFORE, NOT A TRUE TRANSLATION
Not true. It is just a mathematical calculation, real-time or not. The only reason it is real time (as posted previously by JFreak) is the TDM process is real-time. There is NO DIFFERENCE IN QUALITY. Video is not rendered real-time.
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