Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Pro Tools Software > macOS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #91  
Old 10-11-2012, 12:48 PM
musicman691 musicman691 is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Soprano State (NJ)
Posts: 16,158
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by propower View Post
As far as where PT is headed I think AVID completely missed one of the biggest opportunities....

What the OMNI should have been was a $4K box that was true 8in 8out with built in HDX lite that allowed had just enough dsp to offload the mix engine (like HDN) plus have onboard Revibe, Digi EQ3 and Digi Comp 3 (or verb + channel strip) to put on the 8 record tracks (or even just 4). nAll controllable from the same PT plug in window. With expansion ports just like the current Omni (for more I/O) and TB + FW (or usb3) ports. Even $6K would not have been unreasonable! Maybe even make dsp resources available for mix time and have a way to sell more AAX dsp plug ins.

I would have cross graded my HD2 in a heartbeat for such a system. When they came out with Eleven box we all thought this was their direction. I think they would have trumped (or at least stolen much thunder) from Apollo if only...
Essentially all the things that make a UAD Apollo what it is you want in an Avid box right? Would be cool but Avid would have WAY over charged for it.
__________________
Jack
See profile for system details
iMac dead & retired as of 11/4/17

QAPLA!
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 10-11-2012, 01:15 PM
propower propower is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 2,201
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Essentially all the things that make a UAD Apollo what it is you want in an Avid box right? Would be cool but Avid would have WAY over charged for it.
Yes! UR824, UFX, Apollo, ULN8 etc... This is the right trend. Single box, sub 2ms latency monitoring + FX with minimal built in dsp. Even the lowly Mbox3 has a bit of this thinking. Then we get all manner of confusion about HDN - with PCIe cards and separate TB boxes that do nothing but allow other boxes to be plugged in. A mess for NO reason. Integrate HDN into the Omni and it is a winner for the great majority! Seemed so obvious I still am amazed AVID chose their particular path!

But still... love PT10.
__________________
2017 27" iMac 3.8GHz i5, 1TB SSD
Logic ProX, Studio One V4, PT2019.x Orion Studio 2017, Apogee Ensemble TB
Musician: http://www.ivanlee.net/
Design Engineer: http://www.propowerinc.com/resume.html
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 10-11-2012, 03:20 PM
CME CME is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ardmore OK
Posts: 3,205
Default

I would say the Metric Halo boxes have minimal DSP. You can do quite a bit with it. Especially with a +DSP license (which doesn't add more power, just more plug-ins). You can do some pretty heavy lifting IMO. Anywho back to the topic.

I also agree. I was surely hoping for an 004 with built-in DSP when they announced the end of the 003s. Then they released omni and I thought it was killer until I realized its I/O limitations. Then I found MH and haven't looked back.

At this point I don't know where it would fit in their product line-up, but a 32 channel box. Configurable with different I/O cards ala apogee symphony, with a thunderbolt and/or FireWire connectors, and some built in DSP would make me consider selling my MH boxes. Anything short of that and I'm not even considering it.
__________________
2009 Mac Pro - Dual X5650 Xeon 6-core 2.66Ghz procs, 48GB of Ram, SATA 3 and USB 3.0 PCIe cards. R9 280X video card. macOS Sierra. Harrison Mixbus 32C, Studio One 3, Reaper, and pro tools 12 when I have to.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 10-11-2012, 09:20 PM
Electrox Electrox is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: New York
Posts: 323
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dism View Post
Parts that are glued together and can't be replaced by the user.

The reason why people like towers is because you can open them up to swap out drives, memory, video cards, DSP cards, etc etc, and why there will always be a market for them in studios. It's not about "going down with the ship" it's about having the option to do it yourself, which is completely absent from a product like the Retina Macbook.

You can record on an iPad these days. Doesn't mean I want to.
No, there will be a time when towers will seem outdated. We are in the process of the start of that transition. I wouldn't want to record on my iPad, but I am responding to you on one! Yes, different tools for the public is a GOOD thing. However, those who use laptops are at a disadvantage when they are told they need to purchase cards for their towers to use Avid dsp plug ins. And while you are mucking around swapping out drives, memory, video cards, etc etc, I would rather be on the beach recording my band with my laptop - which I do, but not with Avid hardware.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 10-11-2012, 09:36 PM
Dism Dism is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,154
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrox View Post
No, there will be a time when towers will seem outdated. We are in the process of the start of that transition. I wouldn't want to record on my iPad, but I am responding to you on one! Yes, different tools for the public is a GOOD thing. However, those who use laptops are at a disadvantage when they are told they need to purchase cards for their towers to use Avid dsp plug ins. And while you are mucking around swapping out drives, memory, video cards, etc etc, I would rather be on the beach recording my band with my laptop - which I do, but not with Avid hardware.
What's wrong with Avid hardware for mobile recording? I used the hell out of my Mbox 2 with my Macbook, as well as my 003. Don't get me wrong, I've done a lot of mobile recording, and I'm thankful for my trusty Macbook Pro for allowing me to do so. But it's 5 years old. As far as mobile recording goes, there's nothing a modern laptop can do that an old one couldn't. Hell, a brand new Apollo would work just fine on my 5 year old laptop through FW. You could still put an HD Native card in an ExpressCard34 expansion box and have the same results as Thunderbolt. People are talking about the new Macbooks like they're some sort of divine gift because they can run a few more tracks and plugins. I have 6 drives running at any given time. I need a tower. A laptop doesn't suddenly make the whole studio portable. I can't fold up my 4 screens, and 2 pairs of monitors, and my keyboards, and reverbs, and LS56, etc, etc.

I can record on a beach, but I don't need a new laptop to do it. Hell, you could track with a tablet. You could spend less than $500 on something for tracking on the beach, $1500 for mixing at home, and still have close to $1000 left over after what you pay for a Retina Macbook, and you could do it all with an 003 or an MBox.
__________________

D
a n t h e I n c r e d i b l e S o u n d M a n

"Svetlana" v1 - 4.2GHz i7, 16GB RAM, OSX 10.7.4
Liquid Saffire 56 - PT10.2 - BFD2, VCC, Duende Native, Play 3.0

_C U R R E N T-D V E R B-S C O R E:515
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 10-12-2012, 03:52 AM
musicman691 musicman691 is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Soprano State (NJ)
Posts: 16,158
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dism View Post
A laptop doesn't suddenly make the whole studio portable. I can't fold up my 4 screens, and 2 pairs of monitors, and my keyboards, and reverbs, and LS56, etc, etc.
And therein lies the rub with laptops - even though you CAN record just about anywheres with one you still need external boxes - mic pres, an interface, at least an external drive, and associated power supplies (unless everything is bus powered and then your battery life goes in the toilet).
__________________
Jack
See profile for system details
iMac dead & retired as of 11/4/17

QAPLA!
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 10-12-2012, 07:35 AM
CME CME is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ardmore OK
Posts: 3,205
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
And therein lies the rub with laptops - even though you CAN record just about anywheres with one you still need external boxes - mic pres, an interface, at least an external drive, and associated power supplies (unless everything is bus powered and then your battery life goes in the toilet).
But a second HD, esp with a SSD as your main drive, makes it much simpler. But if you need a lot of tracks (ie mics and pres) you're gonna be lugging a pretty big load anyways. But a couple of channels and your good. However if its only a couple channels, why not a portable recorder. There's just a lot of ways to skin a cat.
__________________
2009 Mac Pro - Dual X5650 Xeon 6-core 2.66Ghz procs, 48GB of Ram, SATA 3 and USB 3.0 PCIe cards. R9 280X video card. macOS Sierra. Harrison Mixbus 32C, Studio One 3, Reaper, and pro tools 12 when I have to.
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 10-12-2012, 09:41 AM
propower propower is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 2,201
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

First off, to make quality recordings EVERY computer based system needs external boxes, preamps, multiple hard drives, monitors, etc...

As far as comparing the capability of a modern laptop with a desktop the differences are not that big and getting smaller every day. To slag a machine as non-upgradeable is not on point because in most of its configurations (rMBP) it is also a completely capable system for small to medium recording setups (64 track or less) that performs as well or better than stock a 2010 stock MP. Of course everyone needs a comprehensive backup system so that is not its flaw. And expandability is through TB and usb3 now. Just another evolution and I for one am happy about it!

Cost... Lets say $3000 for a well set up rMBP. MAybe one can save a whole $1K or $1.5K building, hacking, whatever. Considering the price of mics/preamps/monitor speakers/instruments/acoustic treatment etc... chicken feed! My first protools 24 system used a Mac 9600 in 1998 -- $5K+ for the machine and 9.1G SCSI hard drives were $900 each. Todays computer equipment is cheap!!!!! I enjoy updating and replacing mine every 3 years. And by buying higher end Mac products I even get 25% to 50% back on the resale end (try that with your hack 3 years from now!).

So... back to the topic, where are we headed... Towers in 5 years will ONLY be for very high end very specific users. Even today I think 95% of the people who buy them are nuts. A MAc mini will be 90% of what any tower can do (and a refresh is coming). For the very high end video or large scale music production sure... but most recording people, no.

AVID HD|N, TB box, OMNI and HD interfaces are all great stuff. My only objection is that for the sound quality they give there are sonically comparable and far cheaper real alternatives. That said nothing replaces the simplicity of just running pro tools without some separate console program for monitoring recording tracks. A slightly redesigned OMNI along the lines of Apollo priced at $4K would totally put AVID in the drivers seat again for project type studios. But sadly I think AVID is more headed towards supporting the very high end HDX crowd and charging big $$ for PT software.
__________________
2017 27" iMac 3.8GHz i5, 1TB SSD
Logic ProX, Studio One V4, PT2019.x Orion Studio 2017, Apogee Ensemble TB
Musician: http://www.ivanlee.net/
Design Engineer: http://www.propowerinc.com/resume.html
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 10-12-2012, 10:08 AM
spearson8 spearson8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New York, NY - USA
Posts: 78
Wink Re: Where is ProTools heading?

Wow...

I started this thread some time ago and just WOW! It's like an emotional roller coaster up in this biotch! Lol...

Anyways, regardless of where you stand with your current gear or what your views are on the future products and applications. Isn't it interesting and amazing that processing power that only existed in million dollar studios is now accessible to anyone with even a moderately new laptop?

Mind you, I still firmly believe that the 'magic' can't happen without talent, great engineers, producers, rooms, gear etc, etc...But still, with a current laptop and PTHD setup, you can score/mix/master a symphony from a laptop...insane!

I am going to make the jump someday to HD Native or HDX setup...but until then, I'll let my MacPro do the DSP until it shoots smoke out its ears like a Bugs Bunny cartoon. And as I can’t take advantage of 64bit cause I’m MacPro 1,1…I assume it won’t be long
__________________
ProTools 10 / Digi003 Control Surface / MacPro 8-Core (2, 3GHz Quad Intel Xeon) / 13GB RAM / Snow Leopard / Reason 5 & Record / Superior Drummer
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Old 10-17-2012, 12:03 PM
popeof2nd popeof2nd is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nashville
Posts: 6
Default Re: Where is ProTools heading?

I received my rMBP about 3 weeks ago and have'nt looked back.My HD3 rig is now retired and I am trying to sell the cards.This laptop takes sessions that would choke the HD3 and doesn't bat an eye.I understand that its not for everyone but for my workflow its the best.....
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Question about where Avid is heading sw0mgt 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 1 08-16-2012 01:01 PM
SELFLESS PROMOTION---heading to China for the WORLD CHOIR GAMES! BradLyons General Discussion 0 05-02-2010 06:00 AM
Heading back to PC from the Mac... not quite sure yet. silversunpro 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 7 05-02-2007 05:40 AM
What are the parentheses under replies heading? klwilbur 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 1 04-19-2004 04:52 PM
Am I heading in the right direction ? Steve Nelson Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac) 4 10-27-2003 06:40 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:59 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com