Ableton Live / MackieControl

[amuntner]

I have been experimenting with the Artist Mix and Ableton Live via the supported MackieControl emulation.

What I learned:
- The faders/mutes all work with recording and motorized playback
- Only Channel 1 shows any VU-Meter. I believe the level shown reflects the Master meter: If I have audio on channel 2,3,4, etc, only, the Channel 1 vu-meter displays level, but no others.
- There doesn't appear to be any MIDI Learn mode
- I can't browse configured plugins, use the knobs to control Live rack macro knobs, control channel sends, etc. from Chan and Insert modes.
- There is no way to Solo multiple channels at once, even using the computer keyboard. If I hit shift and use the mouse to set up Solo, I can solo more than one channel at once.

Since Live's MackieControl implementation works well with other devices that emulate it, it appears that the limited functionality is a result of the Artist Mix only supporting a subset of the MackieControl protocol.

Until I had already bought and started using the device, there was no way to tell from the documentation or marketing materials that Live support is essentially limited to faders, mutes, pan, and banking, so it's a little frustrating. I have an Ableton Push I can use for these duties, but I'd prefer for workflow reasons to do it on the Artist Mix and it's scribble strip. That's what it's made for and part of the reason I bought it.

In an upcoming update, could Avid please consider improving their support
for MackieControl Emulation? Otherwise, I love the controller. It would be even better with metering and sends!

Thank you,
Adam

[amuntner]

Avid,
Could you please respond, explaining the level of MackieControl protocol support we should be expecting in the current software?
Without such documentation, there's no way to be sure if what we're experiencing as users is 'expected' or buggy behavior.

[amuntner]

Dear Avid,

Could you please respond regarding MackieControl protocol support?

[Herbieoz]

Avid officially told me three years ago (approx) that Mackie / HUI etc is not supported and will not ever be, that the only thing they support is Eucon (except unfortunately they don't actually support that either for any one with real problems). Using a support ticket with Avid on anything to do with Eucon / Mackie etc just wastes your support ticket. You will have to search deeper into the darker parts of the web for assistance if a 3rd party here cannot help you.

[amuntner]

They officially do support MackieControl emulation, it's just relatively undocumented and buggy.

[Herbieoz]

Amuntner - they provide the features of Mackie / HUI, however they do not support the protocol as in provide support to end users. Avid was very clear about that in writing and personal conversation - they are not able to offer any support assistance for any Mackie / HUI problems that end users experience.

[amuntner]

Completely right. Also, to avoid confusion, "MackieControl" and "HUI" are both different protocols.

Avid says they support this communications protocol, but I didn't have any idea that this protocol support was far south of 100% until I actually got a unit and tried it. Unfortunately, my initial post in this thread provided more information about what functions work via MackieControl than the documentation does. If the problem is that I'm doing something wrong and there is more functionality than I found, the lack of docs prevents this from becoming known outside direct interaction with Avid.

Originally Posted by kdarbyshirebryant

I wonder if we're getting hung up on the word 'support'. Let's say implemented instead. I do not think it at all unreasonable for Avid to state which bits of the Mackie/HUI protocol they have implemented on the Artist series and to provide information as to how that implementation maps to the various controls on the Artist series controllers.

I can think of no obvious proprietary/disclosure issues, in fact this is informing the present/future customer.

Or perhaps it would be better to remove Mackie/HUI from EUCon completely if it really is in the unsupported category? It would certainly help clarify to customers where they stand.

[amuntner]

Could someone from Avid please comment on the questions in this thread?

[DaveDaveDave]

I hope that page 1 from the manual adds a little clarity and cuts through some noise:

"The Artist Mix supports two types of applications:
• EUCON-aware applications (such as Pro ToolsTM 9.0 and higher, Media ComposerTM, Cubase, Logic Pro, and Nuendo) di-
rectly support the EUCON protocol. They provide the highest level of integration, high-resolution controls, and high-speed
connectivity.
• Non-EUCON-aware applications that support Mackie Control or HUI (such as Pro Tools 8.x and lower, Live, and Reason) can
use many functions but are less integrated than EUCON-aware applications."

There's also the whol Eucon preferences app where %80 of the screen is to set up applications using either Mackie Control or HUI.

There is obviously official support for both protocols from AVID - albeit limited, as most other non-Mackie branded control surfaces.

[amuntner]

"Non-EUCON-aware applications that support Mackie Control or HUI (such as Pro Tools 8.x and lower, Live, and Reason) can use many functions but are less integrated than EUCON-aware applications."

Dave,

Yes, I've seen that. It's quite vague for a manual as there is no description of which specific functions are actually supported.

Avid?