Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Pro Tools Software > macOS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #51  
Old 11-18-2020, 04:55 AM
Ru_C Ru_C is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: London + Bedford, UK
Posts: 940
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Righty27 View Post
... on Gearslutz, this is the first user I've seen running Pro Tools on an M1 Mac -

https://www.facebook.com/504959982/p...094034983/?d=n

Here's the thread -

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/new-...20-11-a-6.html
Holy Moly. That’s amazing it’s all working under Rosetta 2 !
__________________
A Rig: OSX 10.15.6, PT Ultimate2020.11.1, Native PCI-e Card, AVID I/O16 Analog i/o x2, 40 fader D-Command ES

B Rig: OSX 10.9.5, PT HD 10.3.10, HD3 Accel, AVID192D+ 2xPresonus FS8 for I/o, 32 fader Pro Control

C Rig: (Home/Office). OSX 10.14.6, PT Ultimate2020.11.0, Focusrite 2i2 (2nd Gen), Faderport
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 11-18-2020, 07:59 AM
Righty27 Righty27 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 1,046
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Keen to see how Darryl sees this - it would be great if that tester was a DUC member also though! Does sound pretty amazing - I'm also tracking the Final Cut reviews and even these low-end models appear also to be flying with GPU performance with the native Apple apps.

So, if these Air, MacBook Pro and Mini models are reliable (with an unoptimised DAW) via Rosetta 2 and constrained RAM, many users could probably swap now and take the $$$ saving vs. Intel ... but let's face it, we'll be waiting for the next batch of releases to see what these processors can do when less focused on energy saving and portability.

FWIW, my guess is that the 'M' in 'M1' stands for 'mobile', so we might see 'D' for 'desktop' or 'W' for 'workstation' coming? :)
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 11-18-2020, 02:51 PM
Southsidemusic's Avatar
Southsidemusic Southsidemusic is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Stockholm - Sweden
Posts: 13,361
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by unkJE View Post
Direct quote:

“Apple M1 MacBook Pro Benchmarks Are In And They Are Crazy!”

https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/productio expert-1/apple-m1-macbook-pro-benchmarks-are-in-and-they-are-crazy?mc_cid=82820c612c&mc_eid=070aa82ed2
Link no workey
__________________
Best Regards
Christopher

#thestruggleisreal
—————————————
South Side Music Group
WEBHOME
—————————————
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 11-19-2020, 01:01 AM
Richard901 Richard901 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 469
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southsidemusic View Post
Link no workey
https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/pro...they-are-crazy
__________________
Catalina 10.15.7
Pro Tools 2020.12
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 11-19-2020, 04:45 PM
paul_g paul_g is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South West
Posts: 631
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard901 View Post



That's a great tool.



If something isn't on the list, make sure to check the vendors website In looking at all the various products I have, none are compatible with either Big Sur or M1:

UA Luna, UAD, UA Apollo - not compatible
Waves - not compatible
ProTools - Not Compatible
Toontrack - EZ Drummer/Superior Drummer



Do not upgrade to Big Sur... or buy a new Mx chipped Apple just yet.
__________________
5K Retina 27" (2020) iMac OS 10.15.7 Catalina
3.3 GHz 6-Core intel Core i5
AMD Radeon Pro 5300 4 GB
64 GB 2667 MHz DDR 4
Internal 2TiB SSD
Pro Tools 2020.12
UA Luna 1.1.2.1866
UAD 1.13.0 build 67340
UA Apollo Twin X
Avid S1 / Fire10

PreSonus DigiMax FS 8-input ADAT
Dynaudio Monitors
PreSonus Temblor 10 Sub
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 11-19-2020, 05:58 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 14,861
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Righty27 View Post
Keen to see how Darryl sees this - it would be great if that tester was a DUC member also though! Does sound pretty amazing - I'm also tracking the Final Cut reviews and even these low-end models appear also to be flying with GPU performance with the native Apple apps.

So, if these Air, MacBook Pro and Mini models are reliable (with an unoptimised DAW) via Rosetta 2 and constrained RAM, many users could probably swap now and take the $$$ saving vs. Intel ... but let's face it, we'll be waiting for the next batch of releases to see what these processors can do when less focused on energy saving and portability.

FWIW, my guess is that the 'M' in 'M1' stands for 'mobile', so we might see 'D' for 'desktop' or 'W' for 'workstation' coming? :)
You rang?

No money to be "saved" by users upgrading stuff, that cost is already sunk.

I think Apple is killing it so far with their Arm migration. The amount of impressive stuff they were already doing on iPhone and iPad set a great foundation. And the product points they have started this migration in make a lot of sense. Apple is on fire. And Intel has been and is just struggling in so many places and ways.

Some of the low-level details in this review are very impressive. https://www.anandtech.com/show/16252...pple-m1-tested

I do wish Avid would act more like a leader not a laggard and get out _any_ roadmap/commitment/guidance. But as I said elsewhere the 16GB limit helps dampen demand right now, which is give Avid more time to sort stuff out and I hope they do try to get ahead of the communications curve here.

But as for the hardware memory is memory and 16GB is just not interesting for many of our workloads where we want to run memory hungry VIs, large disk cache etc. And no being Arm based is not going to make a huge difference here --and if anything the unified graphics memory and Rosetta 2 may increase memory demands, and pixie dust like memory compression... current Macs already do that, and do it very impressively, that's not the answer to more memory either.

And you don't know how well Pro Tools will run for you until you load it up with your sessions and your plugins. The plugins are going to be interesting, lots of smaller companies that will need to port stuff to Arm... to run in an eventual arm version of Pro Tools.. and I do have questions about legacy compatibility issues like ongoing reliance on OpenGL in Pro Tools. And more of a hard barrier initially than plugins is going to be interface drivers.. they do need to be ported to Arm to run at all, for many Pro Tool users that many be the first thing to worry about.

While this *is* all impressive, remember you can run Pro Tools today on a 8GB Intel Mac if you are careful... and things often seem great/"fast" until the CPU errors start, so it would be great to see more folks playing with the M1 based Macs now with real world workloads... it might well be they run really quite well.. and especially do well compared to the real performance/reliability of the broad spectrum of Macs running Pro Tools today, ranging all over the place with slow SATA HDD. Slow older Intel CPUs, old GPUs or slow (older) Intel on board graphics, installed systems with sloppy software upgrades, etc.

I have lots of geek things I'd be curious about in playing with these systems like looking at overhead of Rosetta 2. But maybe I'm glad I don't have one or I'd waste time doing that. As for just running Pro Tools on it as a user... well I'd be curious how it runs but again limited memory would make it less interesting.

For now I'm not getting an Arm box to play with, I've tested out Pro Tools 2020.11 enough on Big Sur to flip my daily driver MBP to Big Sur. I wanted to play with other stuff there, and the old Mojave disk image on that MBP was having bad problems. That 2020.11 runs at all on the M2 based Macs is great. I could see myself upgrading my 2019 MBP no sooner than around the end of 2021. Just no reason to do anything sooner. (the 32GB on that MBP will likely be its undoing, but not for Pro Tools).

Lots of thoughts, can/will Apple respin the M1 packaging with more memory or not? The M1 is impressive but as you say it's designed at a lower TDP to meet laptop like needs (including a passive cooled one!). Would they do an interim solution where they jam more memory onto the M1 package and with more aggressive cooling be able to crank up multithreaded/sustained performance in a different systems packaging? When will they have SOC at a higher TDP? With external DIMM support? With external GPU support? Would they ever do a version with no onboard GPU? (would discrete GPU and external DIMM/lack of UMA come hand in hand?). With more PCIe connectivity (for GPU and NVMe SSD).. will it have PCIe3 or 4. And on and on... I'm just hoping for now to see more detailed tear down and de capping looks inside the M1.

As for "M1". I'm going to guess that's M for Mac. And I'm expecting "M2" is going to cause lots of confusion with M.2 SSDs.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 11-19-2020, 06:59 PM
TimothyJohn TimothyJohn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Baltimore, United States
Posts: 237
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
You rang?

No money to be "saved" by users upgrading stuff, that cost is already sunk.

I think Apple is killing it so far with their Arm migration. The amount of impressive stuff they were already doing on iPhone and iPad set a great foundation. And the product points they have started this migration in make a lot of sense. Apple is on fire. And Intel has been and is just struggling in so many places and ways.

...

I do wish Avid would act more like a leader not a laggard and get out _any_ roadmap/commitment/guidance. But as I said elsewhere the 16GB limit helps dampen demand right now, which is give Avid more time to sort stuff out and I hope they do try to get ahead of the communications curve here.

But as for the hardware memory is memory and 16GB is just not interesting for many of our workloads where we want to run memory hungry VIs, large disk cache etc. And no being Arm based is not going to make a huge difference here --and if anything the unified graphics memory and Rosetta 2 may increase memory demands, and pixie dust like memory compression... current Macs already do that, and do it very impressively, that's not the answer to more memory either.

And you don't know how well Pro Tools will run for you until you load it up with your sessions and your plugins. The plugins are going to be interesting, lots of smaller companies that will need to port stuff to Arm... to run in an eventual arm version of Pro Tools.. and I do have questions about legacy compatibility issues like ongoing reliance on OpenGL in Pro Tools. And more of a hard barrier initially than plugins is going to be interface drivers.. they do need to be ported to Arm to run at all, for many Pro Tool users that many be the first thing to worry about.

...

I have lots of geek things I'd be curious about in playing with these systems like looking at overhead of Rosetta 2. But maybe I'm glad I don't have one or I'd waste time doing that. As for just running Pro Tools on it as a user... well I'd be curious how it runs but again limited memory would make it less interesting.

For now I'm not getting an Arm box to play with, I've tested out Pro Tools 2020.11 enough on Big Sur to flip my daily driver MBP to Big Sur. I wanted to play with other stuff there, and the old Mojave disk image on that MBP was having bad problems. That 2020.11 runs at all on the M2 based Macs is great. I could see myself upgrading my 2019 MBP no sooner than around the end of 2021. Just no reason to do anything sooner. (the 32GB on that MBP will likely be its undoing, but not for Pro Tools).

...

As for "M1". I'm going to guess that's M for Mac. And I'm expecting "M2" is going to cause lots of confusion with M.2 SSDs.
I found this gentleman on Gearslutz. He is using the M1 Air, 16gb RAM, 2TB Drive. He was running ProTools, and wanted to demonstrate a real session, and then added plugins. He is genuinely impressed. He also has more videos on his facebook page. He mentions that UAD isn't working at all. But his Waves plugins seem to be doing fine. Worth a look, just to see a grown man display childlike surprise and enthusiasm. This video has me considering the Air, as opposed to the Pro. Enjoy!! https://www.facebook.com/wisdomandpo...58072415354983
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 11-19-2020, 07:21 PM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Sopranos State (NJ)
Posts: 18,162
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimothyJohn View Post
I found this gentleman on Gearslutz. He is using the M1 Air, 16gb RAM, 2TB Drive. He was running ProTools, and wanted to demonstrate a real session, and then added plugins. He is genuinely impressed. He also has more videos on his facebook page. He mentions that UAD isn't working at all. But his Waves plugins seem to be doing fine. Worth a look, just to see a grown man display childlike surprise and enthusiasm. This video has me considering the Air, as opposed to the Pro. Enjoy!! https://www.facebook.com/wisdomandpo...58072415354983
Can you post a link for those of us that don't do Fakebook?
__________________
Jack
See profile for system details
iMac dead & retired as of 11/4/17

QAPLA!
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 11-19-2020, 07:48 PM
TimothyJohn TimothyJohn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Baltimore, United States
Posts: 237
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Can you post a link for those of us that don't do Fakebook?
It's from his FB page. But here's the Gearslutz page, his is post #157. Maybe you can check his profile? Send him a PM?

Also scroll down to post #163. There's a 15 sec clip of a running session. Check the comments too...

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/new-...20-11-a-6.html

Last edited by TimothyJohn; 11-19-2020 at 07:48 PM. Reason: sp.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 11-20-2020, 06:06 AM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Sopranos State (NJ)
Posts: 18,162
Default Re: 2020 Mac Mini or wait for ARM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimothyJohn View Post
It's from his FB page. But here's the Gearslutz page, his is post #157. Maybe you can check his profile? Send him a PM?

Also scroll down to post #163. There's a 15 sec clip of a running session. Check the comments too...

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/new-...20-11-a-6.html
Thanks for the GS link. For reasons not germane to this discussion I haven't done FB in years because I got tired of their malarkey.
__________________
Jack
See profile for system details
iMac dead & retired as of 11/4/17

QAPLA!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Will Pro Tools 2020 run on Mac Mini 6,2 Sadie Tango Pro Tools 2020 1 10-28-2020 08:59 PM
2020 Mac Mini for Film/TV Sound Post? Mosandi Post - Surround - Video 9 10-19-2020 10:13 AM
Mbox 2 Mini 2 on Win10 in 2020 GraphicJon 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 1 10-04-2020 08:16 PM
Pro Tools 2020.5 won't launch on Mac mini mac90501 Pro Tools 2020 27 09-12-2020 09:28 PM
New 2020 Macs. Mini or MBP?? Dale144 Pro Tools 2020 21 05-16-2020 02:22 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:09 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com