How to run EuCon over Ethernet while accessingInternet over Wifi?

[opiante]

Hi Everyone,

I'm setting up a brand new iMac (just a few days old and free of any collected software junk) as the new core of my small home studio.

I decided to start with EuCon, since I've never quite mastered it on my older computers, and have thus always had connection glitches with my control surfaces. So I figured on this new machine I wanted to get it sorted out first before setting up anything else.

I'm trying to run a pretty simple setup. Just a single Artist Mix and a single Artist Transport. I thought I should set up a dedicated Ethernet network for EuCon, so I have a NETGEAR WNR2000v5 router with just the MC Mix, MC Transport and my iMac connected. Its set up as a DHCP server and assigns IP addresses to all 3 connected devices. When this is the only networking I'm doing, things seem to work well. I have EuCon set up properly in System Preferences, EuControl runs just fine and everything seems to talk to each other just great. Things appear pretty solid and stable.

Then I tried opening Safari and realized that it wasn't connecting to the Internet. I had my WiFi connected to my regular home WiFi network and figured that the MacOS would just sort things out, run the Ethernet on the side and use the WiFi for regular Internet access. But obviously thats not the case, which is why I'm here writing this now. I tried changing the preferred order of networks (System Preferences -> Network -> Gear Icon), but everytime I'd put WiFi above Ethernet I would get Internet access but lose the EuCon connections.

Obviously I'm missing something. My IT and COmputer Science days are pretty far behind me, and lets be honest even back then it was trial and error half the time. The initial instinct was to improvise and compromise, to get everything on the same network, and that does seem to work. But it also doesn't seem right. I don't need the control surfaces to be on the same network as the 50 or so gadgets I have talking to each other all over the house.

So whats the right way to do this? How do I get the EuCon stuff to work smoothly over Ethernet, while talking to the outside world over WiFi? BTW, I did try setting up a manual static IP for the Ethernet and it doesn't change anything. It still works fine when WiFi is either turned Off or set lower on the priority order, and then collapses if WiFi is turned on or chosen as preferred. How do I make the Ethernet and WiFi coexist and mind their own business?

I'm also open to looking at things any other way. I can get a different router, or a switch if needed. I think I'm trying to run a very basic EuCon setup here and just want it to be rock solid, while still having Internet access. How would you do it?

BTW, just to make the troubleshooting easier I want to add that I'm running the latest version of everything. As I said the iMac is fresh out of the box running 10.13.2, I've installed the latest available EuCon and updated the firmware in the control surfaces..

Thanks a lot in advance,
Ian

[tonepad]

You could try what I do: I have an ethernet Bridge setup (A Buffalo AC1900) I run a PC, MAcPro, Artist Control and Artist Mix. All 4 devices are hardwired to the Bridge which has 4 ethernet sockets and effectively works as a switch. The Bridge is connected wirelessly to my Buffalo Router (a twin of the Bridge) There's a spec handshake (AOSS) that these devices do which is why I chose them. There are other makes that will bridge but basically this would solve your problem. The Mac and Artists will always "see" the wire but the bridge does the wireless part. What you're trying to do will never work since it's an either/or situation. The Artist boxes don't care about the wireless part, as they're just talking over the switch part of the Bridge which is always on. Hope this helps, take your time to research this as it's a common solution.

[opiante]

Thank You so very much for your advice.

In principle that was the 'workaround' which I thought of myself, but felt that perhaps there was a more elegant solution. Of course, if this is the method that seems to work fine for most other people, then I have no reason not to run it this way as well.
I think I have an extra Airport Extreme sitting around somewhere, and that should have the same wireless bridge / switch functionality. I'll dig it up and give it a shot.

Thanks once again
Ian

[albee1952]

My main network feed comes into the CR on cat5e and connects to the input(the yellow jack) of a separate dual-band wifi router(office already has a wifi router). From this dedicated wifi router, cat5e cables go to Artist Mix, Artist Transport and network port of my PT computer. All works great and the separate router also handles my iPad running the CONTROL app

[EddieJones]

Originally Posted by opiante

Hi Everyone,

I'm setting up a brand new iMac (just a few days old and free of any collected software junk) as the new core of my small home studio.

I decided to start with EuCon, since I've never quite mastered it on my older computers, and have thus always had connection glitches with my control surfaces. So I figured on this new machine I wanted to get it sorted out first before setting up anything else.

I'm trying to run a pretty simple setup. Just a single Artist Mix and a single Artist Transport. I thought I should set up a dedicated Ethernet network for EuCon, so I have a NETGEAR WNR2000v5 router with just the MC Mix, MC Transport and my iMac connected. Its set up as a DHCP server and assigns IP addresses to all 3 connected devices. When this is the only networking I'm doing, things seem to work well. I have EuCon set up properly in System Preferences, EuControl runs just fine and everything seems to talk to each other just great. Things appear pretty solid and stable.

Then I tried opening Safari and realized that it wasn't connecting to the Internet. I had my WiFi connected to my regular home WiFi network and figured that the MacOS would just sort things out, run the Ethernet on the side and use the WiFi for regular Internet access. But obviously thats not the case, which is why I'm here writing this now. I tried changing the preferred order of networks (System Preferences -> Network -> Gear Icon), but everytime I'd put WiFi above Ethernet I would get Internet access but lose the EuCon connections.

Obviously I'm missing something. My IT and COmputer Science days are pretty far behind me, and lets be honest even back then it was trial and error half the time. The initial instinct was to improvise and compromise, to get everything on the same network, and that does seem to work. But it also doesn't seem right. I don't need the control surfaces to be on the same network as the 50 or so gadgets I have talking to each other all over the house.

So whats the right way to do this? How do I get the EuCon stuff to work smoothly over Ethernet, while talking to the outside world over WiFi? BTW, I did try setting up a manual static IP for the Ethernet and it doesn't change anything. It still works fine when WiFi is either turned Off or set lower on the priority order, and then collapses if WiFi is turned on or chosen as preferred. How do I make the Ethernet and WiFi coexist and mind their own business?

I'm also open to looking at things any other way. I can get a different router, or a switch if needed. I think I'm trying to run a very basic EuCon setup here and just want it to be rock solid, while still having Internet access. How would you do it?

BTW, just to make the troubleshooting easier I want to add that I'm running the latest version of everything. As I said the iMac is fresh out of the box running 10.13.2, I've installed the latest available EuCon and updated the firmware in the control surfaces..

Thanks a lot in advance,
Ian

I suspect the issue is caused by having 2 x DHCP servers on the network...both handing out different default gateways. This is a no no in networking because your system doesn't know which one to use. A few options, ditch the Router for a Switch on the EUCON Network or go into the Routers settings and turn off the DHCP Server. The Artist Series doesn't need IP addresses handed out and will fall back to link local ones (169.x.x.x).
Also try switching the order of the networks in prefs.

[tonepad]

To everyone offering suggestions...I think you may be missing what the OP is trying to do. He wants to connect to the internet via wifi while still having the Eucon rig talking over ethernet. The problem is you can't have wifi and ethernet running at the same time on a Mac or a PC for that matter, it IS an either/or situation without some sort of Bridge or Switch config. The Bridge which is transmitting a Wifi address takes care of that job and the onboard switch does the LAN part. I was thinking a switch only could work but as soon as you turn on the Mac Wifi the ethernet goes to sleep along with the Eucon rig as far as I can tell unless the Eucons can talk over the connection without an active ethernet. I've never tried this since a Bridge/Switch has always done the trick. Certainly any Mac/PC connected will need to talk to the rig via the wire....I don't see away around this, so I stand by my proven suggestion. BTW I set my Control/Mix units to have dedicated IP addresses AND I never power them off...otherwise they reset. With constant power they don't lose their IP and I can easily switch them from Mac to PC...one or the other or both, as needed.

[EddieJones]

Originally Posted by tonepad

To everyone offering suggestions...I think you may be missing what the OP is trying to do. He wants to connect to the internet via wifi while still having the Eucon rig talking over ethernet. The problem is you can't have wifi and ethernet running at the same time on a Mac or a PC for that matter, it IS an either/or situation without some sort of Bridge or Switch config. The Bridge which is transmitting a Wifi address takes care of that job and the onboard switch does the LAN part. I was thinking a switch only could work but as soon as you turn on the Mac Wifi the ethernet goes to sleep along with the Eucon rig as far as I can tell unless the Eucons can talk over the connection without an active ethernet. I've never tried this since a Bridge/Switch has always done the trick. Certainly any Mac/PC connected will need to talk to the rig via the wire....I don't see away around this, so I stand by my proven suggestion. BTW I set my Control/Mix units to have dedicated IP addresses AND I never power them off...otherwise they reset. With constant power they don't lose their IP and I can easily switch them from Mac to PC...one or the other or both, as needed.

I'm sorry but this is not true, you can have many network ports active on a system including WiFi. Having EUCON on a separate network to the Internet is the recommended practice. The Mac connected to my S6 has Ethernet (cable) for EUCON and WiFi for Internet. Many systems even have a 3rd port for NAS.

[tonepad]

I stand corrected then. However on my rigs at our mixing stage it's an either/or deal which must be a security issue or ??? I just check my Server and sure enough even tho it's wired to a switch I did get a wifi connection. My Studio rigs don't have wifi onboard hence my use of a bridge/switch.
I'm not sure why it wasn't working for him as you suggest. Not sure how he was setting up his router but it should work as a switch for the Eucon it seems.

To the OP you should try to access your router directly to see if you have to set some parameters to make this work, but the switch part is usually automatic and Netgear has some easy setup how-tos if not.

[EddieJones]

Yes networking can be really complicated and what seems like something should work, only takes a wrong setting somewhere to throw the whole thing off.
You are correct his Router will act as a switch (but he would need to turn off the DHCP in it so it doesn't cause issues with his internet)

[opiante]

Hi Guys,

Thanks to everyone who took the time to post a reply and give me advice on this.
It all makes a lot of sense, in general networking terms it seems quite obvious that the computer can't assume multiple networking identities. But I thought that perhaps there was a trick or a way to set up the Mac as a bridge point between the two networks. Of course that is just overcomplicating everything and I'm just going to go with the initialadvice of using a switch with wireless bridge capabilities. I have an Airport Extreme as my main router and a couple of Airport Expresses around the house boosting coverage. I'll just place another Airport Extreme in the studio, set it to wireless bridge mode and have it run the Euconn network. Seems like the cleanest way to go.