Using Pro Tools 10 with another program

[AP84]

Hi

I am trying to get around latency issues by using PT10 with another program. My interface would allow me to monitor, for example, guitar rig or amplitude directly thus helping with latency. I could then send the signal into Pro Tools from the interface. The question is, is it possible to use Pro Tools with another program through the one interface? Every time I've tried this (or done it coincidentally), Pro Tools has stopped working and needs a restart.

Thanks!

AP

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by AP84

Hi

I am trying to get around latency issues by using PT10 with another program. My interface would allow me to monitor, for example, guitar rig or amplitude directly thus helping with latency. I could then send the signal into Pro Tools from the interface. The question is, is it possible to use Pro Tools with another program through the one interface? Every time I've tried this (or done it coincidentally), Pro Tools has stopped working and needs a restart.

Thanks!

AP

The answer is you likely don't want to be doing what you are even trying, even if you could. And here is almost no useful info there. Why don't you say what exact interface (make and exact model) you have and what latency problem?

Lets start at the beginning...

What are you tryign to record? (dry guitar? wet guitar-- from a guitar amp? or also vocals etc.) And how bad is the latency?

Are you tryign to track a dry guitar and monitor it live though guitar amp plugins? If so what exact ones? e.g. are you also running guitar rig plugs in Pro Tools? Are those plugins the latest version (and AAX-32 or RTAS?).

Many interfaces support analog monitoring? If your does why are you not using that (e.g. for vocals or amped/wet guitar)?

What is the Pro Tools playback engine IO buffer set to? That dominates latency -- so can you set it lower? Have you tried? What exact error do you run into when you try? What are all the playback engine settings (post a screenshot).

Does the interface support Low Latency Monitoring? Have you tried that?

What sample rate are you working at?

What plugins are you trying to record through if any? What other things like VIs are you running that prevents you setting the IO buffer size low.

Describe your computer. Post a Sandra report if Windows.

If a Mac what date/model code and what exact CPU does it have.

And importantly make/model disk drive are you using for the dedicated audio/session drive?

Start at the "Help us Help You - READ THIS Before Posting!" link above for info on Sandra reports and the usual information expected here.

[AP84]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

The answer is you likely don't want to be doing what you are even trying, even if you could. And here is almost no useful info there. Why don't you say what exact interface (make and exact model) you have and what latency problem?

Lets start at the beginning...

What are you tryign to record? (dry guitar? wet guitar-- from a guitar amp? or also vocals etc.) And how bad is the latency?

Are you tryign to track a dry guitar and monitor it live though guitar amp plugins? If so what exact ones? e.g. are you also running guitar rig plugs in Pro Tools? Are those plugins the latest version (and AAX-32 or RTAS?).

Many interfaces support analog monitoring? If your does why are you not using that (e.g. for vocals or amped/wet guitar)?

What is the Pro Tools playback engine IO buffer set to? That dominates latency -- so can you set it lower? Have you tried? What exact error do you run into when you try? What are all the playback engine settings (post a screenshot).

Does the interface support Low Latency Monitoring? Have you tried that?

What sample rate are you working at?

What plugins are you trying to record through if any? What other things like VIs are you running that prevents you setting the IO buffer size low.

Describe your computer. Post a Sandra report if Windows.

If a Mac what date/model code and what exact CPU does it have.

And importantly make/model disk drive are you using for the dedicated audio/session drive?

Start at the "Help us Help You - READ THIS Before Posting!" link above for info on Sandra reports and the usual information expected here.

-I'm recording dry guitar and using a plug-in amp/effects simulator (I've tried Guitar Rig 4 and Amplitube 3). I want to monitor that sound. Sorry - I thought that was pretty clear in my initial post.

-The "errors" I get when I set the buffer to 64 are the usual pops and clicks. At 128, latency still annoys me, and makes it very difficult to play dynamically.

-sample rate is 88.2

I'll check the Sandra thing. Thanks.

As for your initial comment, it's exactly what I want to do, actually, because it would defeat the issue entirely without stuffing around. I could answer most of your questions fairly quickly - but it's not going to lead to an answer to my simple question =) The one simple question remains - can Pro Tools + another program eg. standalone Guitar Rig be ran at the same time? If not, cool. If so, how?

Thanks.

[Darryl Ramm]

Well the answer is practically no as I tried to say.

I asked you what the interface is. You decided not to answer. It may or may not support multi-client ASIO or CoreAudio at all. If not it's a non-starter. It may or may not support clients with different IO buffer sizes even if it intends to, if not its a non-starter. And even if you have a multi-client support and it works for separate client IO buffer sizes these things rarely work reliably, and the additional CPU load on your system often means that Pro Tools and other app end up needing larger IO buffer sizes than they would running along, and the overall system just becomes unstable. All in all a bad idea.

Then I moved on to trying to help you get sorted out just on how to minimize latency, if you want to do that the relevant questions are still there.

You may be able to back off more if you work at 44.1 or 48 kHz, try it and see.

Since I don't know what interface you are using or details of your computer I can't guess what a good case minimum buffer size you should be able to get is.

You can try monitor yourself dry (yuk) though a analog monitor in the interface if it has one, but since I don't know what interface you have I can't help you there. Or maybe it has a LLM mode, yep don't know that either do we. Or you can also monitor yourself through a real guitar amp, split the input (with one of these http://www.radialeng.com/jdi.php) or maybe you amp has a pass though or recording output. If you have some real amps tell us the exact models. Or there are several really good choices out there for low latency DSP based guitar processors, including the very nice Avid Eleven Rack--which also acts and an interface and comes bundled with Pro Tools and may be all you need as an interface. The Fractal Audio Axe-FX II is also very nice, more sim capabilities, less interface capabilities than the Eleven Rack and more expensive (and has better features for live use). Both of those boxes offer amp sims that are better than Guitar Rig or Amplitude, (YMMV depending on what type of amp you like) plus you get all the hardware and low latency guitar monitoring goodness.

[AP84]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

Well the answer is practically no as I tried to say.

I asked you what the interface is. You decided not to answer. It may or may not support multi-client ASIO or CoreAudio at all. If not it's a non-starter. It may or may not support clients with different IO buffer sizes even if it intends to, if not its a non-starter. And even if you have a multi-client support and it works for separate client IO buffer sizes these things rarely work reliably, and the additional CPU load on your system often means that Pro Tools and other app end up needing larger IO buffer sizes than they would running along, and the overall system just becomes unstable. All in all a bad idea.

Then I moved on to trying to help you get sorted out just on how to minimize latency, if you want to do that the relevant questions are still there.

You may be able to back off more if you work at 44.1 or 48 kHz, try it and see.

Since I don't know what interface you are using or details of your computer I can't guess what a good case minimum buffer size you should be able to get is.

You can try monitor yourself dry (yuk) though a analog monitor in the interface if it has one, but since I don't know what interface you have I can't help you there. Or maybe it has a LLM mode, yep don't know that either do we. Or you can also monitor yourself through a real guitar amp, split the input (with one of these http://www.radialeng.com/jdi.php) or maybe you amp has a pass though or recording output. If you have some real amps tell us the exact models. Or there are several really good choices out there for low latency DSP based guitar processors, including the very nice Avid Eleven Rack--which also acts and an interface and comes bundled with Pro Tools and may be all you need as an interface. The Fractal Audio Axe-FX II is also very nice, more sim capabilities, less interface capabilities than the Eleven Rack and more expensive (and has better features for live use). Both of those boxes offer amp sims that are better than Guitar Rig or Amplitude, (YMMV depending on what type of amp you like) plus you get all the hardware and low latency guitar monitoring goodness.

Awesome. My interface - Mackie Onyx 1220i.

I know about Eleven Rack & Axe FX - wasn't born in a tent =) I was just seeing if I could get cheaper/free software options to work, to avoid the costs of hardware. I know there are plenty of free awesome sounding simulators - was just using the two I mentioned as examples.

My playing on this particular project needs to be dynamic. Monitoring a dry signal etc. does not work when you're playing stuff like Hendrix (or anything dynamic for that matter). It could work fine playing metal, when touch dynamics, the use of a volume knob etc. are almost non-existent.

I appreciate your advice on guitar sounds, options etc. but all I really need is a solution to the latency issue. I'll come back shortly and answer all your other questions along with the Sandra thing. Thanks for your advice.