S3L or Allen Heath DLive? No iOS app for S3L?

[jacko]

2,5 years ago I almost purchased an S3L for the purpose of touring with a couple of bands. I decided to pull out from touring and I focused on studio mixing and family. Now the kids are becoming bigger I could get back to touring with bands.

In 2014 I spent 3 months with about 30 shows done on S3L. I enjoyed virtual sound check, very easy to use snapshot system for songs or even parts of songs. But today I think of going different route. S3L is still missing iPad application for individual control of monitor mixes. Therefore I've been thinking of Allen&Heath DLive which is in similar price range but offers more remote control capabilities.

Unless Avid are planning to finally release some amazing iOS solutions for S3L...

Are they?

[vikingthor]

Originally Posted by jacko

2,5 years ago I almost purchased an S3L for the purpose of touring with a couple of bands. I decided to pull out from touring and I focused on studio mixing and family. Now the kids are becoming bigger I could get back to touring with bands.

In 2014 I spent 3 months with about 30 shows done on S3L. I enjoyed virtual sound check, very easy to use snapshot system for songs or even parts of songs. But today I think of going different route. S3L is still missing iPad application for individual control of monitor mixes. Therefore I've been thinking of Allen&Heath DLive which is in similar price range but offers more remote control capabilities.

Unless Avid are planning to finally release some amazing iOS solutions for S3L...


Are they?

interesting topic, as the Allen Heath consoles seem to offer a lot. Been thinking about this as well, not just for me but also when giving advice..
because at this price point of the S3L-X, A&H Dlive/ S-Class seem to offer a lot more...... Inputs en buss structure.

just a couple of questions, you might know?

• one of the nice things of venue is the Preview within the snapshots structure, does it exist in A&H Dlive or S-class?
• How do they handle aux sends to monitors, is it possible to have different pick offs per channel per aux?
  (For example) Like Ch 1, Aux 1 Post EQ Pre Comp. and Ch 2 Aux 1 Pre EQ, Pre Comp?
• Is there a way to build an events like in venue:
  
  Trigger:
  Ch 1, Fader Below, -90.0 dB
  Actions:
  Mute Ch 1, on, While Active
  Mute Ch 49, on, While Active
• Is there a way for matrix pick-offs points for groups and auxes per to be individual per matrix or are they like in venue global ?
• When a snapshot is stored, and the scope of the snapshot is altered, should you store it again to confirm the change of the scope Like on Midas Pro consoles ?
• Drag and drop scenes to it's place?
• VCA Virtual faders visible in software overview?
• Are Channel hardware safes stored in show file, or global, console wide.
  Like the Midas Pro ....)
  
  As you see I did make a mistake of choosing A Midas Pro console over a Venue Console because the 'rave' about these consoles. but it turn out not to be the best choose

[jacko]

Originally Posted by vikingthor

interesting topic, as the Allen Heath consoles seem to offer a lot. Been thinking about this as well, not just for me but also when giving advice..
because at this price point of the S3L-X, A&H Dlive/ S-Class seem to offer a lot more...... Inputs en buss structure.

just a couple of questions, you might know?

• one of the nice things of venue is the Preview within the snapshots structure, does it exist in A&H Dlive or S-class?
• How do they handle aux sends to monitors, is it possible to have different pick offs per channel per aux?
  (For example) Like Ch 1, Aux 1 Post EQ Pre Comp. and Ch 2 Aux 1 Pre EQ, Pre Comp?
• Is there a way to build an events like in venue:
  
  Trigger:
  Ch 1, Fader Below, -90.0 dB
  Actions:
  Mute Ch 1, on, While Active
  Mute Ch 49, on, While Active
• Is there a way for matrix pick-offs points for groups and auxes per to be individual per matrix or are they like in venue global ?
• When a snapshot is stored, and the scope of the snapshot is altered, should you store it again to confirm the change of the scope Like on Midas Pro consoles ?
• Drag and drop scenes to it's place?
• VCA Virtual faders visible in software overview?
• Are Channel hardware safes stored in show file, or global, console wide.
  Like the Midas Pro ....)
  
  As you see I did make a mistake of choosing A Midas Pro console over a Venue Console because the 'rave' about these consoles. but it turn out not to be the best choose

I played a bit with dLive Director software.

- There seems to be no Preview feature in dLive scenes
- Individual channels have pre/post fader choice for aux sends. Post fader will obviously be always the same. PRE pick off points are set globally for each Aux bus: post preamp, post insert A, post PEQ, post delay.
- There is no Venue-like system for events and triggers
- Matrixes can mix signals from Groups, Auxes and Main LR. Within each matrix you can individually choose PRE/POST state for each source.
- No scene drag and drop in Director software.
- No DCA fader shadow
- There is a "global safe" section as well as individual recall filter for each scene. Recall filter can be adjusted for each scene without the need of recalling (unlike in Midas Pro).


What's insteresting about dLive is that the mix engine is inside the stage rack. You can mix without control surface with an iPad. Or an iPad can serve as a monitor console on stage. Or multiple iPads can serve as individual mixers for artists. Options are many.

[vikingthor]

Originally Posted by jacko

I played a bit with dLive Director software.

- There seems to be no Preview feature in dLive scenes
- Individual channels have pre/post fader choice for aux sends. Post fader will obviously be always the same. PRE pick off points are set globally for each Aux bus: post preamp, post insert A, post PEQ, post delay.
- There is no Venue-like system for events and triggers
- Matrixes can mix signals from Groups, Auxes and Main LR. Within each matrix you can individually choose PRE/POST state for each source.
- No scene drag and drop in Director software.
- No DCA fader shadow
- There is a "global safe" section as well as individual recall filter for each scene. Recall filter can be adjusted for each scene without the need of recalling (unlike in Midas Pro).


What's insteresting about dLive is that the mix engine is inside the stage rack. You can mix without control surface with an iPad. Or an iPad can serve as a monitor console on stage. Or multiple iPads can serve as individual mixers for artists. Options are many.

Thanks Jacko,

i understand the Ipad app. It is a shame for a company like Avid is not capable of making an app.

As for me it's not so big issue, as for now. The lack for busses, Channels, Hardware control, Pick off for auxes and Matrix in S3L-X is a reason not to choose for an Avid console. Of course one might suggest an S6L......

but every one know that a console at this price point lack's to much comparing too competitors. one of them is an Ipad, for shure!

[Valentyn]

Originally Posted by jacko

S3L is still missing iPad application for individual control of monitor mixes

<a positive hint here>

[jacko]

Originally Posted by Valentyn

<a positive hint here>

May I take it as a suggestion that a solution for personal iPad app is being developed for S3L?

[Karel Noon]

There where positive hints years ago, I would go with the D-Live for now, the rave is on and even if Avid starts to take the S3L serious again or give us a S4L with o good buy back option of the S3L, the D-Live seems the better and more developed option.
A&H is pretty good at responding, maybe just ask them about the main features you want, sometimes it only takes months to get them included.

And in the end you can probably sell the dlive for a good price when Avid does something interesting.

I really would love to tell something else, there actually is an iPad app, but it is still VNC based so only one user at the same time is working ( I am aware that multiple users can be logged in, but is just not a good workflow).

I went down the Mackie DL32/DC16 route as a replacement/addition to the avid for exact that reason, no iPad app on Avid .....

It all takes way to long!

[jacko]

DLive C1500 + IP8 gives me 20 faders total with two independent banks. Similar mobility to an S3L - I can still load it by myself inside a passenger car without the need of folding down rear seats. Recording and virtual soundcheck over Dante. Independent control via multiple iPads and laptops if needed.

[HLD]

I have an S3L that I like, and use, a lot. When I got it, it was the only option I found that I really liked. If I was in the market for a new console today, the S3L would not be on my list - it´s simply developing to slow, it is to limited in many regards, and Avids policy of not communicating with their users do not feel reassuring when I consider the future with my console.

[jacko]

Originally Posted by HLD

I have an S3L that I like, and use, a lot. When I got it, it was the only option I found that I really liked. If I was in the market for a new console today, the S3L would not be on my list - it´s simply developing to slow, it is to limited in many regards, and Avids policy of not communicating with their users do not feel reassuring when I consider the future with my console.

I thought I’d update this thread. I ended up using rented Yamaha QL and CL desks over past year almost exclusively. Dante is fantastic and I bring a laptop with Waves Tracks software to record shows and to do virtual soundchecks.

I’m still thinking about purchasing a console for myself but increasingly less so.