snare mic bleed question.

[barters81]

Originally Posted by danander11

I use a hybrid of Albees suggestion.. I make my own samples of each kit I record just before tracking, then manually edit them in.. takes a bit more time than using a replacer, but I always seem happier with the results.

And this works ok??

I would be concerned about keeping the original dynamic of the drum recording. Or is your replacement going off of some sort of midi information? I'm not a fan of using electronic drumkits, yet they have dynamics built in through the midi coding.

I can understand using drum replacement on something like a kick or a tom, but snare? Is this why you mix in the replacement with the original track?

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by barters81

And this works ok??

I would be concerned about keeping the original dynamic of the drum recording. Or is your replacement going off of some sort of midi information? I'm not a fan of using electronic drumkits, yet they have dynamics built in through the midi coding.

I can understand using drum replacement on something like a kick or a tom, but snare? Is this why you mix in the replacement with the original track?

Maybe review my original reply. Then check out Drumagog and/or the other drum replacement plugins. I think all of them will follow the dynamics of the original track quite well. And, as I said, you can use the sound of the same snare drum you used on the original track as Drumagog(the plugin I use and know) allows you to import your own samples. I happen to have made mine from the several kits I have in SD2, but you can make samples from any clean recording of any sound you can get your hands on.

[barters81]

Cool...I'll check it out.

UPDATE:- So I ended up doing a bit of research on drum replacement software and was quite suprised by what I found. You're correct Albee in saying that the natural dynamic of the drums are preserved through the fancy pants algorythms used to basically turn a visual (wave file) into something akin to a midi file. So the different velocities the drummer hits the skin at in the recording translates into the drum replacement.

I ended up getting the Steven Slate Trigger software due to favourable reviews etc. I must say that when used sparingly this is a great tool for cleaning up drum recordings.

Don't get me wrong I still think a 100% genuine recording sounds better, but the thing is that genuine recording needs to be done in a high end studio on a great kit with a great drummer to sound better. For the rest of us there are programs such as these.

[jnewry]

Originally Posted by danander11

I use a hybrid of Albees suggestion.. I make my own samples of each kit I record just before tracking, then manually edit them in.. takes a bit more time than using a replacer, but I always seem happier with the results.

Doesn't this take forever?! I can't imagine sitting there replacing all the hits in the song... I mean I know about tab to transient but GEEZ!

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by barters81

Cool...I'll check it out.


Don't get me wrong I still think a 100% genuine recording sounds better, but the thing is that genuine recording needs to be done in a high end studio on a great kit with a great drummer to sound better. For the rest of us there are programs such as these.

This is one of those gray areas in recording. If its done right, the listener can't tell, they simply hear a great mix(the same is true of vocal tuning; if its done right, you don't hear tuning, you just hear a great vocal...unless its being used as an effect like Cher or T-Pain).

[barters81]

Hey Albee.....is there any trick to making up the samples for your own kit? Do you need to record a number of different hits per drum for different velocities etc? I'm a complete novice for this stuff obvisouly...

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by barters81

Hey Albee.....is there any trick to making up the samples for your own kit? Do you need to record a number of different hits per drum for different velocities etc? I'm a complete novice for this stuff obvisouly...

Since most of my stuff is pop/rock/country, I get away with single samples. I made a whole batch of them by recording my favorite sounds from SD2 and ezdrummer. I even did some stereo(with ambience) samples too. I'm not really much farther along than you are. I know that some of the replacement plugins allow for multiple samples, but I haven't really worked that part out yet(not sure if my Ver. 4 Drumagog does it). It looks like the new Ver. 5 does so I may have to upgrade

[barters81]

Cool, thanks for that.

Slate trigger is able to trigger multiple samples at once....I think up to six. What I might do is put the Zeppelin snare sample in (nice sharp crack with lots of rattle), mix in a larger snare sound for extra bottom end, then mix in a room mic sample for a more natural reverb. This enables me to produce many different snare sounds from the same sample packs etc.

By reading this forum, and learning about things like drum replacement (I always thought it was something very dodgy with average results) I'm now producing a drum sound that is drawing in clients. I strongly believe sample enhancement is something to make a good recording better though, not to be relied upon, which is what gave me original perception in this area.