Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Legacy Products > Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 10-23-2016, 12:31 PM
esppse esppse is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: New Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 40
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

Quote:
Originally Posted by albee1952 View Post
I'm voting for 48K over 44.1. The performance hit is immeasurable(essentially), Video wants 48K, SRC has gotten good enough that its really a non-issue, and it pushes the upper end(and the nyquist filter) high enough to avoid phase issues(for most of us humans)

Back to your original list of tracks used; I never felt the need for 4 mics on a cab(ribbon and dynamic cover my needs). The more guitar tracks I use, the fewer mics I use for each. I had a client send a session with 5 tracks per "part" and about 8-9 guitar parts and it was a total mess. Simplify and pan yielded a very happy client(a very good guitarist that engineered the recording, and over-thought the entire process) Please don't get me wrong. I am a guitarist and have spent days with a dozen mics, trying to get "that sound". In the end, I actually got it by using a lot less, but in better ways

Last thought re TDM/HD; it takes at least HD3(3 cards) to handle what a native system can do these days
Yeah I know the amount of mics is overkill, I've been chasing a 3D sound for so long. It's a combination of proper compression, air/slight ambience, pick nuance, finger sound, and have not too much or too little gain. I usually spend 4-5 hrs on finding the sound, and end up taking 1 hour to get the perfect take on a small segment
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-23-2016, 01:50 PM
JFreak's Avatar
JFreak JFreak is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Tampere, Finland
Posts: 16,811
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arche3 View Post
Sounded great.
Whatever works :)
__________________
Janne
What we do in life, echoes in eternity.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-23-2016, 01:59 PM
Matt Hepworth's Avatar
Matt Hepworth Matt Hepworth is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Utah
Posts: 423
Default How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

Welcome home.

These days a lot of native users are going 96k so they can get latency closer to what TDM has a 44.1.

TDM is a great, stable, powerful system.

Most studios are running 44.1 for audio and 48 for video.

In the past two years I've only had one project come through at 96k and only one other client even ask about higher sample rates.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-24-2016, 08:49 AM
Barry Johns Barry Johns is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,567
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

Quote:
Originally Posted by albee1952 View Post
Last thought re TDM/HD; it takes at least HD3(3 cards) to handle what a native system can do these days
I got by for a very long time with just an HD2. Depends on how a person works. If you rely solely on TDM Plugins, then maybe.

When I was on an HD2, I tended to only use TDM plugins when recording through them or on Aux's. You can stretch an HD2 a long way with that workflow.

Today however, Accel Cards are so cheap, no need to do that, just buy the third card.
__________________
HD Native Pcie, PTHD 11, PT12 Vanilla, Omni, Lynx Aurora 16, 192 I/O (16 in/8 out), 24 Fader D-Command, lots of preamps and compressors.

MacPro 5.1 (12) Core (2009 MacPro 8 Core Upgraded to a 12 Core MacPro), 56 Gig Ram, SSD System & 3 - 2TB Drives, OSX 10.9.5, Windows 10 Via Bootcamp
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-24-2016, 09:37 AM
EGS's Avatar
EGS EGS is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 2,620
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

I track & bounce @ 24/48, and life is good. If needed, I use iTunes to convert the bounce to MP3 @ 320kbps - i.e. no need to re-bounce as MP3. To burn a CD (rarely anymore) I simply pull the bounce into Sony CD Architect and use Sony Dither (or similar) to convert to 16/44.1 during the burn process - i.e. no need to re-bounce at 16/44.1. Audio-for-video projects always favor 48. I have for the most part stopped switching sample rates. I rarely need to work @ 96, and don't think I've ever once worked @ 88.2.

My 2 cents!!!
__________________
Desktop: PT 2019.6 / Win 10 / GIGABYTE GA-X58A-UD3R / i7-980X hex @ 3.9GHz / 32GB / Focusrite LS56
Laptop: PT 10 / Win 7 / HP ProBook 4730s / i7-2630 / 8GB / U-PHORIA UMC1820
Info/Services link
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-24-2016, 09:48 AM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: nashville
Posts: 34,801
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EGS View Post
I track & bounce @ 24/48, and life is good. If needed, I use iTunes to convert the bounce to MP3 @ 320kbps - i.e. no need to re-bounce as MP3. To burn a CD (rarely anymore) I simply pull the bounce into Sony CD Architect and use Sony Dither (or similar) to convert to 16/44.1 during the burn process - i.e. no need to re-bounce at 16/44.1. Audio-for-video projects always favor 48. I have for the most part stopped switching sample rates. I rarely need to work @ 96, and don't think I've ever once worked @ 88.2.

My 2 cents!!!
Nice trick^^^^ I'l have to try that As for Accel cards, at this point, a used chassis and few more cards is a pretty cheap way to get a boost
__________________
Gigabyte X79/intel i7 3930K, 32GB RAM, DIGI003 Rack
https://www.facebook.com/search/top/...0sound%20works


The better I drink...the more I mix.....

BTW, my name is Dave, but most people call me.........................Dave
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-31-2019, 02:25 PM
Jeezer Jeezer is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: GB
Posts: 65
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

While recording at 88.2/96 offers little benefit, plug-ins running at higher sample rates can often work (sound) a LOT better, esp if you have mix bus heavy plug usage.

Dan Lavry theorised the ideal sample rate is around 60k, and that 88.2 is the closest common one we have to that so recommended to work in it, so that all plugs sounded better, all processing (not 'recording') sounded better, and the final push on the mix/master bus (+ any further manipulation) sounded better. It was all about the processing rather than the recorded tracks.

If you work at 44.1 a lot of plugs will oversample, within their own engines/methods (some good some bad) and are up sampling/downsampling all the time internally. Running at high sample rates if your cpu/drive/voice count is ok with it, avoids this completely (or to less extent) and once again returns better PLUG IN results (less aliasing, less dodgy cheap oversampling).

So don't dismiss working in higher rates, esp 88.2 near the 'ideal'. And yeah latency gets lower with higher sample rates too, a nice bonus. I wouldn't go above 96k personally, but I wouldn't want to work at 44.1 unless I knew all the plugs I use were made with high quality algos/oversampling.

Softsynths can also sound better at higher rates, though I don't use them.
__________________
Windows 10 | i7 8700k Coffee Lake 6c/12t @ 5GHZ all cores | 3333mhz 32GB CL14 GSkill RJ Ram | 970 Evo SSD | PT12 HD @ 88.2k | ICON D-Command | Prism Titan Converters
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 02-03-2019, 07:23 AM
Sugarnutz Sugarnutz is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Great State of Mississippi
Posts: 736
Default Re: How do people survive with 96 voices at 88.2k?

I’m kinda old school, started with a tube Ampex 8 track and a 12 x 8 console. You had to commit as you went. Saying that, today I have an HD6 Accel in a Magma Chasis on a 2008 8-core Mac Pro. With the exception of my Pro Tools licenses and interfaces (listed in my sig) I’ve got right at $1K in that rig and it’s tough to beat. My mix rig is Thunderbolt Native & Pro Tools Ultimate.
__________________
HD Native Thunderbolt
HD6 Accel in Magma PE6R4 Expansion Chassis
PT HD 10, 11, 12, Ultimate 2018, 2019
Cubase 9.5 Pro
Vienna Ensemble Pro 7
Icon D-Command

HD Omni
192 Analog I/O 8 in/8 out/Digtal I/O
192 Analog I/O 8 in/Digital I/O
Two 192 Digital I/O
Apogee Rosetta 800, AD16X & DA16X (All wth X-HD cards)
Antelope Zen Studio+ Thunderbolt

15" Mid-2015 MBP 2.2 GHz i7 16 Gb RAM
512 Gb Flash Drive - OS X 10.14.3

Gigabyte z390 Designare
I9 990K 4.7 GHz
64 Gb of DDR4 3200
Gigabyte RX580 8 Gb
MacOS 10.14.5 Mojave

GIGABYTE GA-Z97X-UD7 TH
Intel Core i7-4790K 4.4 GHz
32 GB of DDR3 1600
EVGA GTX 760 Video Card
OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra & Win 7 Pro 64 bit

Dynaudio BM5 Mk III
B&W 604 s2
800W 15" Ported Subs
McIntosh MC-7106 Bridged ~ B&W
Hafler P7000 "Diablo" ~ Subs
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Superior Drummer Auths survive HD erase? Tim R. macOS 8 06-23-2013 12:56 PM
How do you guys survive!!! :D Hotcrazyfruit General Discussion 17 08-13-2010 05:45 PM
Had to Sell my HD Rig, Will I be able to Survive on a 003R Barry Johns 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 9 12-17-2007 03:37 PM
I Had to Sell My HD Rig - Will I Be Able to Survive on 003R Barry Johns Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac) 3 12-16-2007 04:08 PM
Voices,Voices,Voices..How to do it!? 002?MBox?HD? TheMadStudent 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 4 03-07-2005 09:16 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:12 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com