SSD (Solid State Drives) Alleviating The Need For Two Hard Drives For PT?

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by guitar131

Albee- what do you use for your system drive cloning? Also, what UPS did you buy, and how long does it give you until you power down(given the main power still being out)...thanks. Matt

I use Acronis TrueImage for drive cloning but I bet you can find a freebie out there somewhere. For UPS, I run an APC 800VA. I know there are several much better units out there but this was $120(replaced by the 900VA for 10 bucks more) and it will run my entire system(without the speakers) for at least 10 minutes, which is plenty of time to finish a bounce, save and shut down. I do not use the software for monitoring or auto shut down(I figure the software might create problems and I am never too far away from the machine when its working anyway). BTW, while Acronis does disk images too, I prefer to clone as it makes a restore as fast as it takes to swap 2 drives. I did an image of my home machine(non-critical system) and am having trouble getting it to restore after a virus problem forced me to reformat. Sure wish I cloned THAT drive too.

[TOM@METRO]

I think eventually most of us get to the point where we realize; if its worth spinning up… its worth cloning.

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by epu

With speeds reaching 200MB/Sec Read AND Write, I was just wondering what the possibilities were. On the other hand, Western Digital has just released a 20,000 RPM drive. While there aren't exactly consumer affordable items yet, they will VERY soon! What is your take on this?

I'm looking at this from the laptop end. My IBM/Lenovo X61 can run 32 tracks with auxes and plug ins using MBox Micro using its 7200 rpm Hitachi drive w/o breaking a sweat. I DO carry around a small external just in case. I wonder what these new drives will allow!

the last time i looked at the SSD specs it showed that write times were actually slower than writes on the mechanical hdd's. that and cost have slowed any rush to change. the read times are better with the SSD's so one could 'possibly' look at replacin' one's OS drive. but then that would affect the page file performance (possibly). i think as specs and costs improve we'll see more lean that way...ie some of the DELL netbooks are already shippin' with SSD's. so it's evolving

[JPS]

Well, I picked up a OCZ 32g Vertex SSD to take a look at and play with a bit. So far, I can say that it certainly works fine with PTLE 7.1 on my system. Looks to be stable and records fine.

The Vertex is fast. On the ATTO HD test the drive shows 220 mb/s reads and 160 mb/s writes. I did the same test on an old 32gb Raptor and it could barely write 50 mb/s, which really shocked me. But then again, it had quite a bit of music on it. Plus the Raptor makes quite a bit of noise. I think I paid $130 for that drive when it was new.

My initial impression of the Vertex is that it was dead silent. If you are in a recording space with your computer, this will help lower noise. In fact, now I find my regular drives noisy. Plus, the applications load quite a bit quicker. That's not critical, but it is nice.

On the down side, if you plan to use a Vertex for the OS, then use a SATA drive for recording, you still get the noise from the SATA drive. So, you lose the "quiet" advantage, which I think is big. Also, the Vertex is not cheap. I got mine for about $85, but that was with rebates, and special deals.

But I have another concern...I'm not sure an MLC SSD will make a good audio recording drive...as MLC SSDs (like the Vertex) are good for only about 10,000 writes. Audio files tend to be large, and anything that makes new files is wearing out the drive. In my case, it would probably take a couple of years for me to fill up a 32gb drive 10,000 times. But that not be the case for others. An SLC SSD would be better for a recording drive because they can get about 100,000 writes. That would be better, but they are also more expensive. Although, I see that Newegg is selling a 64gb Samsung SLC SSD for $175, but it is slower than the Vertex, yet still faster than most SATA mechanical drives. So, there are still a lot of factors to consider in getting an SSD.

As far as audio performance, I did a D-Verb test using just my single Vertex and disconnecting my regular SATA audio drive (recorded to the OS drive), and the results were very similar to a non-SSD drive. So, I don't think you will get better track or plugin performance in PTLE. But if you can get a positive D-Verb result of 220 on a single drive, that can't be all bad! At least I know it works fine. I haven't looked into the VIs yet. I do think the OCZ Vertex could have some advantages there.

All-in-all, I use my computer for various different things, and I like the Vertex. I love the "quiet" and the extra speed in booting and loading apps.

I would agree with MykhalC... I don't think we are quite there yet with SSDs... but we are getting closer. Prices are dropping. I think I'll just keep reading reviews and watching for the right performance specs..

[JMS40]

Very interesting.
Thanks for the report.

[TOM@METRO]

Thanks, you have answered a couple of questions I've been too lazy to research.

[mykhal c]

just to add...i'm back to the SUPERVOLUME product that Shane and i and others have discussed. i think for session performance there is NOTHING that can touch it...not SSD's...nothin'!!! and the fact that one could, this very day, load up all the ram your system could physically handle, then define the ram above the 4gb mark as a SVOL, then load your workin' session in that area, then voila...SUPER ACCESS on reads and writes!! and one's volatility is covered by the fact you can dump the SVOL to disk as you choose. so...just throwin' that back out there as we all look to up our systems' performance. and DDR2 is super cheap...DDR3 not quite as much. AND lastly...the thru-put with ram especially on i7's is just plain stupid...off the freakin' charts!!! anyway...just sayin'...again

[JPS]

TOM and JMS40,

You guys both contribute a lot to the DUC and I enjoy reading your posts.

As far as advice for anybody considering an SSD, definately DO NOT get an SSD with a JMicron controller. They ALL have low random write problems and cause "studdering". The Intel SSD appear to be the best... and the most expensive. Next would be the Vertex line from OCZ, which uses the new Indilinks controller. The Vertex has a fairly good cost-to-price ratio. Also, as mentioned, the Samsung SLC SSD is good because it is SLC with a much large write potential of 100,000, just not a screamer with only 100 mb/s reads and 80 mb/s writes.

I'm trying to resist getting the Samsung SLC because it is slower than the Vertex, but probably adequate for recording, if the "quiet" of an SSD is desired. It's hard to believe that this drive cost $1000 just 6 months ago! Newegg's price is insanely low, so I think that Samsung must be clearing out excess inventory and responding to the newer and faster controllers in SSDs.

Anyway, for those with extra cash and a desire for an extremely quiet system, there are some possibilities. I guess I should say, "a lot of extra cash"

[JPS]

MykhalC, you're another favorite poster!

I've been watching the RAM drive also. The speed of reads and writes CANNOT be beat. But I am looking for quiet, and if you have a mechanical drive running as a backup, then you have a bit more noise. Of course, you could use an external firewire drive and put a pillow over it! Yeah, that would do it for me!

There is something else coming that is pretty exciting, which are the PCIe drives. They plug into a PCIe slot and get the advantages of the PCIe speed. But the price could be a problem... Time will tell.

MykhalC, I have not looked into the RAM drives really well, so I have a few questions. How much memory can be loaded into 4 slots? I think I have seen 8 and 16gb memory modules, but they are a bit pricey, aren't they? How much memory is enough for an adequate RAM drive?

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by JPS

MykhalC, you're another favorite poster!

I've been watching the RAM drive also. The speed of reads and writes CANNOT be beat. But I am looking for quiet, and if you have a mechanical drive running as a backup, then you have a bit more noise. Of course, you could use an external firewire drive and put a pillow over it! Yeah, that would do it for me!

There is something else coming that is pretty exciting, which are the PCIe drives. They plug into a PCIe slot and get the advantages of the PCIe speed. But the price could be a problem... Time will tell.

MykhalC, I have not looked into the RAM drives really well, so I have a few questions. How much memory can be loaded into 4 slots? I think I have seen 8 and 16gb memory modules, but they are a bit pricey, aren't they? How much memory is enough for an adequate RAM drive?

hey John!! i know we can load up 8gb of ram (2gb x4) in our P35 mobo. i'm not sure if the slots can take a 4gb dimm. would be worth lookin' into tho. so we would be limited a single session at a time but that ain't all bad IMHO gotta work on one at a time anyway right? so that might have a 4gb limit on our P35. but with the i7/X58 builds some of the mobo's can hold a max of 24gb of ram 4gb x6 in triple channel mode at that and i think a 12gb QPI transfer rate. imagine...an i7 build with 24gb of ram runnin' PTLE on W7 64bit with 12gb of the ram defined as a SUPERVOLUME!!! SMOKIN' IMHO and even if icome back down to earth...an i7 build with 12gb of ram runnin' PTLE on XP 32bit with 8gb of the ram defined as a SUPERVOLUME!!! i could live with that one too oh and to answer your question, i think an adequate ram drive would depend on your average session size. so i think we could get away with 4gb SVOL drives with our P35 and probably be very happy