Interesting...I kinda like PT 10...

[Chingy]

As a Logic user here, I've been quite skeptical of PT. I got PT 8 LE with my Mbox Pro 3 and when I tried it, it almost made me punch my computer. Could barely run 5 tracks on my 8-core Mac Pro before it freaked out. No delay compensation. Crippled input monitoring. Etc. etc. etc. Basically the least robust program I've ever come across.

Well, I've been trying out PT 10 for a bit now and I have to say I really quite like it. Releasing a trial was probably one of the best moves AVID could've made. Now I HAVE to use Vienna Ensemble Pro to even get by and RTAS performance is still HORRENDOUS (especially with like Eleven Free or Softube TSAR-1 - the CPU meter jumps like 10-12% when I add those plugins). The workflow however is really nice - and I LIKE Logic's workflow (in some cases I still like Logic more). The performance issues make me even more frustrated with AVID though - please please please fix those. They are holding PT back.

A few initial questions I had:
- Is there a way to bounce in place / create a new audio file with the inserts included? Some plugins don't show up in the Audiosuite menu.
- How long should delay compensation be set to usually? Does PT indicate if the setting is too low?
- Is there any way to rename all of the clips on a track based on the track name?
- Is there a way to move a clip and retain its relative position to the grid? For example, if it is just before the beat, when I try to move it in grid mode it snaps to the beat. I want to move it but maintain that relative position.

Is PT 10 worth $800 ($500 for the upgrade + $300 for VEP)? It is hard to justify to be honest, but on the other hand, the DAW is the primary tool - instead of buying another $500 plugin or $1000 hardware EQ, this would seem like a better investment. However, Logic is great for a large majority of people - lots are getting by fine with it and I'm not sure what I'd "miss" from PT (although still early days). Time will tell whether I buy it, but so far it has been quite nice.

[filosofem]

Originally Posted by Chingy

- Is there a way to bounce in place / create a new audio file with the inserts included? Some plugins don't show up in the Audiosuite menu.

Pro Tools currently does not support Freeze Track or faster than real-time bounce. To Record Plug-Ins you need to Bus Record.

Originally Posted by Chingy

- How long should delay compensation be set to usually? Does PT indicate if the setting is too low?

Pro Tools 10 support ADC length of over 16,000 samples. ADC Indicator turns green, orange or red depending on the initial ADC setting.

Originally Posted by Chingy

- Is there any way to rename all of the clips on a track based on the track name?

Consolidate the track.

Originally Posted by Chingy

- Is there a way to move a clip and retain its relative position to the grid?

Use Relative Grid Edit Mode.

Originally Posted by Chingy

Is PT 10 worth $800 ($500 for the upgrade + $300 for VEP)?

Only you can answer that question but $499 USD is the Crossgrade price. $299 USD for Upgrade from Pro Tools 9.

[AxeDye]

I think its worth it just continue to test the workflow because my sessions are 16-24 tracks using maybe 30 RTAS tops and no VI's so for me pro tools 10 by itself is enough horsepower. Personally I I prefer the pro tools environemt but its what I started with and have been investing in since pro tools 6 so I am very comfortable with it. Also in my opinion the new channel strip is amazing, finally a plug in that is stock and sounds great. However I do believe Logics stock plug ins are pretty nice as we'll. But my rig is more portable and local studio like so I am not running any crazy expensive converters or anything so a cheap and good sounding stock plug in is right up my ally. Anyways good luck.

[WernerF]

If you are familiar with the way an analoug console in an analoug studio works then Pro Tools will make total sense to you. It is based on all of the workflow and techniques that apply in this scenario. Logic is more computer first, basic recording techniques last. Of course there is lots of overlap but the concept of the basic designs differ.

[Cliffy_Boy]

The way to bounce a track with all the plug-ins is to use an Aux track. You bus the output of the track you want bounce with effects to, say, Aux In 1-2, set the Aux out, say 1-2. Set the input of the Audio track to the output 1-2 of the aux track, hit rec and wait until the track plays in real time.

[john5193]

My average session is 85 audio tracks 2 VI's, 7 Amp Sims, and around 140 RTAS plugs. I've tried this on multiple systems and still come back to PT handling my session better than Sonar, Cubase, and (when I still had a mac) Logic. I come from the old school analogue method so PT just looks and feels more intuitive which does help lead to better mixes (at least for me).

[Chingy]

Thanks guys. One more quick question - is there a way to set the "anchor" point of a clip? For example, for a reverse cymbal, I could set it to the end of the swell so when I drag the file, that anchor snaps to where I want it to.

John5193 - what are your computer specs? What sort of RTAS plugs are you running with those sessions? Any help is confirming my system is optimized appropriately would be greatly appreciated.

[daeron80]

Originally Posted by filosofem

Consolidate the track.

...after duplicating the playlist so you can get back to individual clips if you need them.

Originally Posted by Chingy

is there a way to set the "anchor" point of a clip? For example, for a reverse cymbal, I could set it to the end of the swell so when I drag the file, that anchor snaps to where I want it to.

Yes, PT calls this a Sync Point. Ctrl+, on Windows. That's the control key with the comma key.

[mbourque]

Originally Posted by Chingy

- Is there a way to bounce in place / create a new audio file with the inserts included? Some plugins don't show up in the Audiosuite menu.

Read answers above. Just want to add that it's all in real time, there's no offline process.

Originally Posted by Chingy

- Is there any way to rename all of the clips on a track based on the track name?

Consolidate works fine, but creates new audio files. You can select all the regions (now named clips) of the track and use the "Auto Rename" function in the clip menu of the clip window.

About the use of Vienna Ensemble Pro, the big advantage of it is that you could use the same VIs for a Logic session than a PT one (except for RTAS ones, like Eleven or Xpand). You could begin your work in Logic and then continue in PT simply by importing your MIDI tracks in the PT session. All the VIs will be in VEP.

[Chingy]

Great - thank you!! These answers have really helped me out. PT's workflow is really growing on me. So flexible and powerful, but at the same time easy and intuitive. Also, strangely, even given the poor CPU efficiency, PT "feels" more robust and stable to me. Maybe a placebo effect? Who knows.

For those running VEP 5, have you tried parameter automation? I'm trying to automate Omnisphere, but VEP is really confusing in this regard. I'm guessing MIDI Learn doesn't work either when using VEP?

Also, I did a quick "performance" test - playing back a simple audio loop with Softube's TSAR-1 plugin on it duplicated as many times as possible.

Computer: Mac Pro 8-core 2.26 GHz Nehalem 8GB RAM w/ Mbox 3 Pro running at 128 buffer setting.

Logic Pro 9.1.6 64-bit: 85 tracks (AU)
Pro Tools 10 Native: 51 tracks (AAX)

Now, I believe Logic switches the buffer setting in the background to 1024, but whatever it is doing, it is getting more than 1.5x the tracks. I've also heard that for some reason the MBox 3 Pro causes more CPU issues than other FW interfaces? This performance discrepancy is the biggest worry for me right now. Wish there was a demo session I could try out that was more of a "real-world" test.