LtRt louder than 5.1???

[JeromeOD]

Well, it's not really as simple as that - your LtRt should not sound louder than the 5.1, which is why you adjust the downmix parameters in the encoder to ensure it is not the case. Remember that in the cinema, the ltrt is a fall-back for when the AC3 fails, and thus must not differ in perceived level. This doesn't apply to TV in the same way, but you should surely try to achieve the same thing. You don't want the automatic fold-down done by the set-top HD box to sound different from the LtRt you make yourself - this will be confusing in split-standard HD/SD transmission situations.

[Postman]

Would someone please just run some tones! All of this back and forth without a single qualitative measurement is getting under my skin!

[JeromeOD]

I don't own the minnetonka stuff myself, or I would have done so a long time ago. It's worrying a bit that no-one's done it on stuff they own!

[garret]

It works as expected

[emilano]

haven't been into the studio yet to try out the sine wave test.

What works as expected garret?

[garret]

The Sine wave test. -20 into left channel gives you -20 on the encode on the left. -20 into the centre gives you -23 on both channels on the encode. I think its possible that a previous version of the plugin had the problem

[Postman]

It works as expected, that is good to hear. Only the decoder was (supposed) to be broken so that makes sense.

If the LtRt sounds "Definitely Much Louder than the 5.1", I would first check the playback setup. You should be able to switch between them with little or no apparent change in volume. Having said that, there may be a subjective change in the center channel when switching from a single center speaker to two speakers. Two speakers close to each other in a room will add together acoustically, and the bass frequencies can add together more than the others (real world experience) but it should only be a small change. Really, on my system when I'm sitting perfectly centered and not too close, the change to dialog from stereo to 5.1 is extremely subtle.

Another difference, for films but not broadcast, is with sounds in the surrounds. For film mixing, the surround channel playback is reduced 3db. So, the front-to-rear balance WILL be different between the LtRt and 5.1 (Surround audio will be 3db louder in the LtRt), but that is probably more about the ambi's and reverbs. The dialog and other front sounds should be the same.

OR, this is all subjective because your idea of "Much Louder" is different than mine!

[emilano]

hmm. strange. No, this is not a subjective or subtle thing, the stereo is noticeably louder than the decode or the 5.1 and as I remember it (im not in studio now) it is quite consistent wherever I checked. I'll check more carefully to see if it holds true even for sections where there's nothing in the surrounds. Maybe there's something wrong in my setup. No phasing is heard so I doubt anything is double bussed.
This is being done in a big, well designed quiet studio in NYC so its not about small speakers being close together.... hmmm