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  #1  
Old 03-07-2008, 02:57 PM
nayrbnoswal nayrbnoswal is offline
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Default Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Digidesign,

I know you don't like to listen to your extremely loyal user base... much like our good friend at microsoft.. Myself and many of my pro colleagues are getting just a little wee bit irritated with the promises your software suggests in the literature that don't work in practice.

For all the hobbyist using protools it is their choice for us in the "pro market" we get stuck with your product. I for one am now deciding if nuendo might be a better option. For the price of my two HD3 Accels, Various interfaces, Sync I/0's, TDM plugins, Digitranslators (which by the way cost's more than apple's logic studio pro), mp3 export option (comes with freakin' itunes for free). Enough ranting... You get my drift.

Nuendo system costs -same mac as protools/ RME madi card / Euphonic MC with Eucon support... I think you can do the simple math here.


SUPPORT THE LOYAL USER BASE YOU TAKE MONEY FROM... GIVE US WHAT WE NEED... Otherwise the otherside is looking sweeter than ever.

give us the following:

01. RTAS instrument support that actually works.... not like what you think works now... like really really works!!!
02. AU support.. because i have no faith in RTAS... if you want composers/songwriters on protools they have to have instruments.
03. EUCON support... Admit when you have been beaten by Euphonix (or)
04. ICONS should be able to control more than one rig from the surface at a time. otherwise you start to piss guys like me who off..who have to sometimes work in budget icon rooms and have my workflow suffer due to the stupidity of your design.
05. MIDI- Fix the edit page or add a new window for a view similar to logic/cubase/nuendo/dp/ etc who give you a matrix window with all the notes in view.
06. Allow for network and raid drives to be used in playback and record.
07. Support for multiple sessions at the same time...
08. Multiple Bar ones in the same session
09. Nuendo like update session mode for guys who do editing on dub stages
10. More tracks at 96k and 192k... cmon...
11. LISTEN TO YOUR LOYAL USERS WHO HAVE SPENT A LOT OF $$$$ ON YOUR SOFTWARE.
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  #2  
Old 03-07-2008, 03:37 PM
SamZ SamZ is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

I whole heartedly agree!!!!!
It seems digi has been making my life harder instead of easier lately. Seems like they break more then they fix with every release. RTAS is like a bad joke compared to other plug in formats. I know of a lot of people in the post production industry here in Los angeles that are seriously taking a look at nuendo, especially after seeing the new euphonix control surfaces. Because digi is the industry standard there is no way for us to completely abandon the products, but if digi would like to keep that industry standard alive they better start addressing our needs more seriously.
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  #3  
Old 03-07-2008, 03:49 PM
Drew Mazurek's Avatar
Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Quote:
Digidesign,

I know you don't like to listen to your extremely loyal user base... much like our good friend at microsoft.. Myself and many of my pro colleagues are getting just a little wee bit irritated with the promises your software suggests in the literature that don't work in practice.

For all the hobbyist using protools it is their choice for us in the "pro market" we get stuck with your product. I for one am now deciding if nuendo might be a better option. For the price of my two HD3 Accels, Various interfaces, Sync I/0's, TDM plugins, Digitranslators (which by the way cost's more than apple's logic studio pro), mp3 export option (comes with freakin' itunes for free). Enough ranting... You get my drift.

Nuendo system costs -same mac as protools/ RME madi card / Euphonic MC with Eucon support... I think you can do the simple math here.


SUPPORT THE LOYAL USER BASE YOU TAKE MONEY FROM... GIVE US WHAT WE NEED... Otherwise the otherside is looking sweeter than ever.

give us the following:

01. RTAS instrument support that actually works.... not like what you think works now... like really really works!!!
02. AU support.. because i have no faith in RTAS... if you want composers/songwriters on protools they have to have instruments.
03. EUCON support... Admit when you have been beaten by Euphonix (or)
04. ICONS should be able to control more than one rig from the surface at a time. otherwise you start to piss guys like me who off..who have to sometimes work in budget icon rooms and have my workflow suffer due to the stupidity of your design.
05. MIDI- Fix the edit page or add a new window for a view similar to logic/cubase/nuendo/dp/ etc who give you a matrix window with all the notes in view.
06. Allow for network and raid drives to be used in playback and record.
07. Support for multiple sessions at the same time...
08. Multiple Bar ones in the same session
09. Nuendo like update session mode for guys who do editing on dub stages
10. More tracks at 96k and 192k... cmon...
11. LISTEN TO YOUR LOYAL USERS WHO HAVE SPENT A LOT OF $$$$ ON YOUR SOFTWARE.

Yeah, that'll work.

Compare them to MS?
Getting stuck with their products? I don't feel stuck. In fact, whenever I try to use Cubase (which I own) or Logic or DP, I come running back to PT.
Telling them their designs are stupid?
Beaten by Eucon? Explain that one.

I'm not saying you don't have a lot of valid points, and I agree with some of what you're saying. But if you think this will do any good, you're sadly mistaken. I'd try joining the beta team to gain better access to the people working hard day in and day out to add these features you need. Just a suggestion. Or you could stick with this method.
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  #4  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:07 PM
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DigiTechSupt DigiTechSupt is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Quote:

01. RTAS instrument support that actually works.... not like what you think works now... like really really works!!!
02. AU support.. because i have no faith in RTAS... if you want composers/songwriters on protools they have to have instruments.
03. EUCON support... Admit when you have been beaten by Euphonix (or)
04. ICONS should be able to control more than one rig from the surface at a time. otherwise you start to piss guys like me who off..who have to sometimes work in budget icon rooms and have my workflow suffer due to the stupidity of your design.
05. MIDI- Fix the edit page or add a new window for a view similar to logic/cubase/nuendo/dp/ etc who give you a matrix window with all the notes in view.
06. Allow for network and raid drives to be used in playback and record.
07. Support for multiple sessions at the same time...
08. Multiple Bar ones in the same session
09. Nuendo like update session mode for guys who do editing on dub stages
10. More tracks at 96k and 192k... cmon...
11. LISTEN TO YOUR LOYAL USERS WHO HAVE SPENT A LOT OF $$$$ ON YOUR SOFTWARE.
I can address a few of these:

1. We're working on it.
2. Can't be done with the current audio engine for Pro Tools, as it's a real-time engine, while AU is buffered. Hopefully #1 will get to the point that you have confidence in RTAS instruments.
3. I have no internal info on this, so - no comment.
4. You can - 7.4cs2 supports control of multiple Pro Tools systems from a single ICON system.
5. We are working on this.
6. There are technical reasons this hasn't been implented, except in certain configurations (Unity, ISIS, etc.).
8. Request has been noted more than once. I'm not sure of the current state of any implementation, however.
9. Noted as well.
10. How many tracks do you need/want?
11. We try!
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  #5  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:10 PM
Drew Mazurek's Avatar
Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Cool. Do you think you'd get a response like that from Fredo? I think not!!!
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  #6  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:15 PM
schism schism is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

frankly, if he weren't making valid points for professionals,
for songwriters, for composers,
this might have come off as rant-y, but.....
but.....
but.....
it doesn't, imo.

aren't all of the points being made actually valid
for a professional accustomed to working under intense pressure?

my best guess would be that nayr is working (in multiple capacities)
in highly-pressurised music-for-picture environments, where
timely results are gonna be heard & seen by tremendous amounts of peoples.

schism

ah.
now validated by a response from Digi.
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  #7  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:28 PM
nayrbnoswal nayrbnoswal is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?



1.killer i know a few big time composers who want to use protools but can't due to this limitation

2.bummer about AU's but yes if you fix rtas all will be better

3. fair enough... could be a huge benefit to users who have to use logic, dp, gigastudio, forte etc in addition to protools... or figure out a way to do this with dcommand icon and control 24

4.so i can actually have vca groups from multiple rigs on the surface of the icon visually at the same time next to each other... or is it a ethernet switching thing. because the later is not all that helpful.

5.excellent news

6.fair enough.. but if you run high track count 96k or 192k the drive management becomes insane.. so it would be nice to figure out a solution.

8.cool cool

9.great

10. as many as my poor little harddrives can handle... seems that going from 48k surround mixes into 96k really limits my options.
11. well thanks!

oh and another one... make it number 12.

have the ability to have complete access to individual channels in 5.1 tracks... so you don't have to split to mono make the fix then throw it back into a 5.1 track... is this possible?

thanks for the reply!
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  #8  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:31 PM
SamZ SamZ is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

EXACTLY
thank you
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  #9  
Old 03-07-2008, 04:53 PM
Andre Knecht Andre Knecht is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Quote:
4.so i can actually have vca groups from multiple rigs on the surface of the icon visually at the same time next to each other... or is it a ethernet switching thing. because the later is not all that helpful.
From the “D-Control Addendum 74” document, page 7:

ProTools HD 7.4cs1 adds the ability to enter D-Control
Multi-mode, which lets you use a single D-Control console to
access up to four ProTools|HD systems on a network.
Multi-mode lets you quickly switch worksurface control from
one ProTools system to another by pressing a single switch on
the D-Control console
.”

There’s quite a bit more in the doc (which is included along all v7.4 docs when installing this version of the software).

IHTH.
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  #10  
Old 03-07-2008, 05:34 PM
Chief Technician Chief Technician is offline
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Default Re: Pro\'s-why does a 30k app not make life easier?

Quote:

06. Allow for network and raid drives to be used in playback and record.
Quote:
6. There are technical reasons this hasn't been implented, except in certain configurations (Unity, ISIS, etc.).
When you do overcome those technical reasons, please support Xsan, or drop the price on Unity ISIS by a factor of 10 and have it fully support OS X, because simple push-pull on ISIS is not the answer.

Please fix the bugs before adding that network drive stuff. I know I want something more stable, not just what I have now with fiber channel (network) drive support.
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