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  #1  
Old 10-01-2019, 06:32 PM
sneakyimp sneakyimp is offline
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Default problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

I just bought a used Orange Two Stroke pedal advertised as "mint" condition and it appears to have a problem. I think it sounds pretty good when the EQ is engaged but when you click the pedal off, bypass mode sounds awful when you pluck the heavy strings pretty hard. The note sounds really farty like there's a short in the cable or like the power source has been overwhelmed or something and it can't produce the note. I'm wondering if the pedal might be a lemon or if other people have encountered this with the orange two-stroke?

Note that I've tried the pedal with a fresh battery only, with a 9v power supply, and with a 12v power supply and the pedal sounds pretty much the same regardless.

PLEASE ADVISE -- If I'm going to send this pedal back, it needs to be soon.
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  #2  
Old 10-01-2019, 06:34 PM
Sardi Sardi is online now
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Might get a better response on a guitar centric forum.


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  #3  
Old 10-01-2019, 06:44 PM
amagras amagras is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Make sure it's not a faulty cable that the effect is masking when engaged
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  #4  
Old 10-01-2019, 06:49 PM
sneakyimp sneakyimp is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardi View Post
Might get a better response on a guitar centric forum.
I've posted another forum as well. Looking for a quick answer so I thought I'd try here, too.


Quote:
Originally Posted by amagras View Post
Make sure it's not a faulty cable that the effect is masking when engaged
I've swapped out the cables with other cables, I've swapped out the pedal with other pedals, I've swapped out the power supplies with other power supplies. My question is whether this problem exists as a design flaw in all orange two-stroke pedals, or whether this particular pedal is just a lemon.
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  #5  
Old 10-01-2019, 09:56 PM
Sardi Sardi is online now
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

I don’t own the pedal, but IMHO it would be a pretty crap design if that was normal, so I’d be leaning towards a fault of some kind.

Hopefully you get a reply from someone who owns one.


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  #6  
Old 10-02-2019, 05:43 AM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardi View Post
I don’t own the pedal, but IMHO it would be a pretty crap design if that was normal, so I’d be leaning towards a fault of some kind.

Hopefully you get a reply from someone who owns one.


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The problem might well be with the design of the pedal. It's a buffered bypass and not 'true bypass'. The difference is in the latter you have a mechanical switch that completely removes the circuitry in the pedal so the guitar signal goes straight through the box. In a buffered bypass the signal is still going to the circuitry in some form and how that happens is up to the designer of said pedal. So the guitar signal is still getting loaded down by the circuitry even when the effect itself is bypassed.

I've had both kinds of pedals and the buffered bypass ones sucked big time. Where I could I modified those pedals to be true bypass and in some it wasn't easy but then again I love electronics (retired EE) and still build some of my own ham radio gear. If it was me I'd take the pedal back. Orange has a history of building neat stuff that doesn't always work like it should. Take their amps when they first came out - reliability was not a known concept to them. Actually saw one catch fire at a concert.
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  #7  
Old 10-02-2019, 05:52 AM
Sardi Sardi is online now
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

There ya go. A good explanation of why it might sound the way it does.

Whilst I’ve used the odd pedal here and there on synths, I don’t play guitar so they’re not something I use a lot of the time. I (incorrectly) assumed a bypass would be a total bypass.

In my mind, pedals are designed to be chained. If I click one off, there’d be a reason and I’d want it to be fully bypassed.

You learn something new every day.


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  #8  
Old 10-04-2019, 04:10 PM
sneakyimp sneakyimp is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
The problem might well be with the design of the pedal. It's a buffered bypass and not 'true bypass'. The difference is in the latter you have a mechanical switch that completely removes the circuitry in the pedal so the guitar signal goes straight through the box. In a buffered bypass the signal is still going to the circuitry in some form and how that happens is up to the designer of said pedal. So the guitar signal is still getting loaded down by the circuitry even when the effect itself is bypassed.
I'm aware of this distinction, but thank you for the nice explanation! I suspect -- but am not sure -- that this is the reason for the problem I'm having. I was wondering, and still don't know, if there's something wrong with my pedal or whether all Orange 2-Stroke pedals suffer from this same problem. I would add that the problem appears to be related to the very hot signal coming from the seymour duncan black winter pickups in the guitar. I tried my other guitar with seymour duncan sh-1 pickups in it and the problem seemed to go away (or at least was much less pronounced). I'll also add that the problem doesn't seem to be an issue with the EQ engaged.


Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
I've had both kinds of pedals and the buffered bypass ones sucked big time. Where I could I modified those pedals to be true bypass and in some it wasn't easy but then again I love electronics (retired EE) and still build some of my own ham radio gear. If it was me I'd take the pedal back. Orange has a history of building neat stuff that doesn't always work like it should. Take their amps when they first came out - reliability was not a known concept to them. Actually saw one catch fire at a concert.
I love it! I minored in EE (ages ago) but don't think I'm up to modding itmyself to get true bypass. I'll consider crossing that bridge should I try building a pedalboard or playing live with it.
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  #9  
Old 10-04-2019, 06:38 PM
musicman691 musicman691 is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Quote:
Originally Posted by sneakyimp View Post
I'm aware of this distinction, but thank you for the nice explanation! I suspect -- but am not sure -- that this is the reason for the problem I'm having. I was wondering, and still don't know, if there's something wrong with my pedal or whether all Orange 2-Stroke pedals suffer from this same problem. I would add that the problem appears to be related to the very hot signal coming from the seymour duncan black winter pickups in the guitar. I tried my other guitar with seymour duncan sh-1 pickups in it and the problem seemed to go away (or at least was much less pronounced). I'll also add that the problem doesn't seem to be an issue with the EQ engaged.



I love it! I minored in EE (ages ago) but don't think I'm up to modding itmyself to get true bypass. I'll consider crossing that bridge should I try building a pedalboard or playing live with it.
I would say the problem is endemic to all buffered bypass pedals irrespective of manufacturer or the way a pedal is used. Some have issues more than others, sadly.

As to the EE business my day job for 15 years was designing satellite command and control systems (the ground stations not flight hardware). The company started as RCA Astro in East Windsor NJ then we changed to being owned by GE and then Martin Marietta and finally Lockheed Martin. Also go to debug/test the systems as well. And travel the world on the company's dime for installations.
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  #10  
Old 10-04-2019, 10:37 PM
sneakyimp sneakyimp is offline
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Default Re: problem with orange two stroke eq pedal

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
I would say the problem is endemic to all buffered bypass pedals irrespective of manufacturer or the way a pedal is used. Some have issues more than others, sadly.
This is extremely disappointing. If I had to guess what the problem is based on the sound of it, I'd say that the sudden transient coming from the hot pickups of my guitar is slamming the circuit such that the power supply can't supply enough current momentarily. It doesn't sound so much like clipping of a loud signal (which would manifest as a loud, distorted signal) but rather more like a circuit momentarily starved for current. Maybe there's some kind of protection circuitry in there to starve the current in overload situations? I'm surprised that this problem would be common, but can't claim enough experience with circuit design to be any authority on the matter. Maybe there's an op-amp or IC in there that just doesn't degrade gracefully.

Generally, I like a good, clean true bypass circuit on my pedals. On the other hand, a signal buffer sounds like a good idea in a pedal board or long-cord situation -- lest you get a lot of treble loss or noise creeping in. Based on your comment, it sounds like I'm unlikely to find a good pedal to buffer my signal? I'm surprised that it seems so difficult to wire up a good buffer circuit. It's also quite disappointing that my Orange pedal might ruin my potent transients if I were to use it in a pedalboard. So lame to have a pedal destroying your loudest notes when it's supposed to be off.


Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
As to the EE business my day job for 15 years was designing satellite command and control systems (the ground stations not flight hardware). The company started as RCA Astro in East Windsor NJ then we changed to being owned by GE and then Martin Marietta and finally Lockheed Martin. Also go to debug/test the systems as well. And travel the world on the company's dime for installations.
That sounds like a pretty good gig!


Any suggestions you might have about a mod to fix the pedal would be most welcome. If it's just a matter of replacing a resistor or capacitor or two, I might be up for it.
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