kool and the gang production

[Castaliamusic]

As if musicianship is not required these days in dance music.Thats a good one.I say this with all due respect to your appreciation of 70's musicianship.I love underground 70's disco.Its the precurser to todays house music and I'm a house head.Electronic musicians and DJ musicians are full of natural musicianship.Have a good day.

Hey 6969, do you think in 2030 people will dance on today's house tunes? I respect DJs, but you have to respect that billion hours spent with an intrument: you can't edit with it, you MUST play it right every time. And when it's played right, people feels something more than a well programmed groove

[6969]

Much respect for what I do? Thats a good one.Your post actually says otherwise.Turntablists practice for years to master the art form, for one thing.So do good mix DJs for another.For another,you seem to not understand the evolution of musicianship. I love how some think they know how GOOD electronica and house is made without any experience creating good electronica and house.Electronica and house is the perfect meld of synthetic and acoustic.Both are very important.On top of all that alot of these musicians learn how to engineer thier music as well.Who is to say that alot of these electronic musicians didn't study an instrument for years as well.I myself played the drums for a few years so I have a definite understanding for beats and just because I may not be able to physically play the drums as good as I can program them,doesn't mean that I couldn't as a possibility. Its interesting how people love the Beatles and thier musicianship but Ringo was a crappy drummer.Have you ever heard of Eric Kupper? Major underground dance music keyboard player.Amazing. To create GOOD and ORIGINAL electronica is as fleeting as creating any other type of music.It takes great musicianship.

DJ

P.S. Funky Disco,Synth Disco,Funk and Soul are what house originated from.Its all there in HOUSE!

[Castaliamusic]

I have nothing against electronica. I enjoy it. I simply can't understand your first post: have you read the thread? I play trumpet, but I don't need to explain here that trumpet players has musicianship like bass or drums players... it's obvious!
However, music needs to be 'played'. If you use samples (I use many) then someone have played them. If you only use synthetic waveforms well... maybe people will not have the same reaction than with a good sounding real instrument (yes, I know, you could use them for particular effects). But it's also true that today's dance music (at least most of it) don't use real (and good) instrument/players/engineers/producers/studios because you have to pay them. It costs much more money and djs I know are payed at least 3 times more than musicians (players). Are you ready to share your money with musicians (players)? Or maybe you think you can have the same result working alone with PT? That's the point, it isn't the same result.... Last consideration: I knew a lot of good DJs doing great mixes but, for example, I knew only a few great bass/drums players. Maybe you need a particular talent to do that....

[B.Ray]

Much respect for what I do? Thats a good one.Your post actually says otherwise.Turntablists practice for years to master the art form, for one thing.So do good mix DJs for another.For another,you seem to not understand the evolution of musicianship...

Cool down bro. If you re-read my post, you'll see that I tried to make an intellectual argument that Turntablists ARE musicians. I'M AGREEING WITH YOU ON THAT POINT! OK?
In fact, I found a nice concise definition of Musicianship:
(n) The art of performing music.

A guy editing loops is not performing music. He's just editing loops. Now, if he could do that in real-time, like a Turntablists, that would be different.

As far as my lack of understanding of the evolution of musicianship is concerned, well all I can tell you is I started studying music and musical instruments in 1959.

[fredsparky]

How about the electric tuba? Would that be musicianship or magicianship?

[Castaliamusic]

Electric tuba? I want it!

[Travis Mitchell]

Actually, the definition is: "One who composes, conducts, or performs music, especially instrumental music".

So, the editing guy chopping beats and dragging loops is technically exhibiting musicianship.

[Aln]

So, the editing guy chopping beats and dragging loops is technically exhibiting musicianship.

Only he didn't supply the beats to chop or loop,the musician provided those.I gues he could call himself an arranger or editor or musical proofreader.

[B.Ray]

Actually, the definition is: "One who composes, conducts, or performs music, especially instrumental music"....

Yeah, that's the definition of a Musician but it's not the definition of Musicianship.

Musicianship is (n) "The art of performing music".

Off-line editing is not a performance. If you say it is, then a guy transcribing a manuscript is performing music. Or, how about the guy loading files for a CD pressing and adding PQ codes? No, none of that constitutes a performance and is not musicianship.

A Turntablist is scratching in rhythm, and he's synchronizing loops between two records all in real-time. You can argue that that is a musical performance exhibiting musicianship. Editing requires a sort of musicial sensibility but it's not a performance.

[6969]

Sometimes its hard to teach old dogs new tricks. The wierd thing is some of those old dogs are young.

DJ