mixing in pro tools

[major_thom]

hey.. i have digi 001 pro tools LE setup. i would like to upgrade to a TDM system to mix a upcoming project [the digi runs out of cpu power too fast, i can only add reverb to a few tracks and that really sucks] i have a decent amount of money to spend [12-15k] what pro tools system configuration is best for mixing, and realistically how many plugins can you get w/ just a basic mix 3 system?. would i need to buy additional mix cards? the music is similiar to radiohead/bjork/floyd so for mixing its important that i can add reverb to a alot of tracks for that ambient sound.

also how much outboard gear can a TDM system handle? i plan eventually to convert my studio entirely to analog but i dont have the money right now for that.

i was hoping i could buy some outboard gear [some vintage urei comps, lexicon reverbs, etc] and use those for mixing digital now, but also have things that will work when i go analog. thanks in advance

[Eric Bazilian]

You can probably deal with any mixing situation you're likely to encounter with a Mix 3 system. I've been running a Mix+ with two Vintage Farm Cards for years now and have rarely, and I mean RARELY run out of DSP. The real hogs are your reverbs and Amp Farm, though there are also eq and compressor plugs which, though very musical sounding and visually pleasing (e.g. the Bombfactory plugs), also eat a lot of this precious resource. Likewise, my fave DuI plugs, DaD Tape and DaD Valve. Waves plugs also tend to consume a great deal, though if you're sticking entirely to Waves plugs you'll tend to do a bit better.

Then again, there's McDSP....Filter Bank, Compressor Bank, Analog Channel, etc. which, though not as bell-and-whistle-like, really do a remarkable emulation of all the above whilst being miraculously DSP friendly. Go check out the website for the exact numbers. All I do know is that I'm able to set up a 32 channel mix with McDSP eq, compression, as well as the new Analog Console and Analog Tape emulators on every channel and still have plenty of horsepower to spare.

If you've got some good outboard reverbs and such you can also save a ton of DSP by using inserts (TDM only). The 'verbs will generally sound a lot better, besides. I tend to use a hardware compressor (Daking) as an insert on my mix bus as well...just sounds better, generally.

Good luck...

------------------
Eric Bazilian/The Mousetrap
"Music Is Good"

[Jules]

I agree with Eric, also the RTAS / TDM hybrid that is possible in PT 5.1 onwards will be a huge help to you Tom. Look into it



Jules

[emilano]

The only problem is 12-15K is going to go really quickly. If all you need is pro tools mix3 then you're fine. But you're talking about plugins and out board gear which is going to eat that up in NO time.

[Irene]

..if you're planning on doing any recording, external mixing, sample rate conversion, and/or dithering you could also consider a variety of manufacturers for your conversion, clocking and dithering needs..

Irene

[PT2GO]

Major Thom,
You need to set up Auxilary tracks. Don't add a reverb plug-in to each track you want reverb on.

Make a new Aux track. Set the input of that track to bus 1 (or any other bus). Bring the fader up to zero (option-click the fader).

Then set up a send (under the insert section on each track) to bus 1 on all the tracks you want to go to that particular verb. The more you add of each send, the more reverb on that track you hear.

If you have a reasonably fast computer, you should be able to do a whole lot with what you have.

You need to learn this way of doing things or you will be VERY disappointed in a $12-$15k Mix cubed system.


As for how many outboard gear will a TDM system handle... It's really only limited by the number of I/Os you have.

Jerry
Nashville, TN

[UV]

While mixing more than, say, 16 16-bit tracks in PTLE could eat a lot of power, it can be done if you know what you're doing. like the above aux track method, you can also use the physical analog outputs of your digi001 as a send to an outboard reverb and save lots of power.

[McGriffy]

It might be much cheaper to get a faster computer for the 001 than to move up to TDM. You get more than just the extra power with TDM, so this might not be a good choice but take a look at what the best host based systems can do before deciding. The lastest Mac's and P3/4 based systems are getting close to 100 digirack plugs and those Athlon guys are pushing 200. I have personally managed over ten d-verbs on my P4. And this upgrade might only cost you 25-3500 instead of >10K.

DMcG

[music]

P4?

[Jaleo]

I am a PTLE owner using an Athlon T-Bird 1.2 GHz PC with 256 megs of RAM. The system is extremely stable and in the Davec system test I was able to attain 140 plugins (24 tracks, 5 per track and 5 on each of 4 aux inputs). In my typical setup for a real session though, I will use 4 or five D-Verbs on Aux Inputs, and a combination of another 20 or so plugins...typically eq's compressors, delays etc. I do not argue that a TDM system is superior for track count, outboard DSP capability and quality of TDM plugins, video support and some additional features. But the line is becomming a bit blurred as to what you might truely need for your project. My PC (bought from a DAW Builder) including a 19" monitor CD burner and dual ATA 100 hard drives cost only $2500. If you only need 24 tracks and more system performance, buying a new PC could allow you to spend lots of that left over 13 grand on that vintage outboard gear you are lusting for...it could make a huge difference in warming up the mix. I have had many 24 bit sessions with all 24 tracks mix extermely easily and efficiently on this setup. I do not encounter errors, nor do I stress my CPU. I have never had to change my hardware buffer setting from 128 samples, and thus do not encounter latency problems durng recording.