5.1 broadcast and stereo downmixing

[Tim R.]

It's my understanding (and correct me if I'm wrong), but More and more, the ONLY mixes that folks at home (I'm talking broadcast TV) will be able to hear are either true 5.1 or a downmix of that original 5.1 mix. It seems that a single 5.1 delivery (with stereo derived from THAT) will become the norm. BUT I'm finding the stereo downmixing of 5.1 mixes seems to be falling short in many ways. For example: Cool 5.1 reverbs, when folded down, appear to wimp out compared to their stereo counterparts. Also, tonal characteristics of, say a lead vocal panned across the 3 front speakers, can change when mixed into stereo. Not to mention that all the small level nuances that we so painstakingly tweek can get completely screwed when downmixed. Are there solutions on the horizon or tips and tricks you all use to minimize the downmix pain or are we resolved to a prestine 5.1 mix and a lack luster stereo downmix?

[Brandonx1]

How are you downmixing the 5.1?

[Tim R.]

How are you downmixing the 5.1?

I've used the Waves M360 as well as double bussing a 5.1 bus to mono aux channels, -3db, and outputting to a stereo bus.

[philper]

So far the networks I've worked for are still asking for us to make them stereo and LtRt mixes--I figure that they might be using those in cases where they don't want to devote the bandwidth to 6 chan. I don't see how you can 2nd guess a consumer downmix, esp if it isn't being done automatically to some standard, beyond listening to what your own gear does with it. If they can mess with the parameters....oh well.

Philip Perkins

[TheHenchman]

Well seeing as most clients don't want to pay to have a "remix" done for stereo, I just can't worry about it.

I suggest you do the same.

Mark

[hef]

Well seeing as most clients don't want to pay to have a "remix" done for stereo, I just can't worry about it.

that's a shame (of clients not paying for that). i would think more viewers are listening to the stereo downmix than the 5.1 right?

[TheHenchman]

that's a shame (of clients not paying for that). i would think more viewers are listening to the stereo downmix than the 5.1 right?

Yep, probably so.

[hef]

do you come across situations where clients hear the downmix at home and have concerns with it? do you ever hear the downmix? if so, how does it sound?
M
ost of what I mix is stereo right now but i would hate not to do a separate stereo mix. one thing i notice (with friends) is that many people who have surround sound at home only use it on DVDs and not when watching TV.

I guess its not just dependent on the clients but the networks also. cause some clients may be cool doing a separate pass for stereo, but if the network only wants the 5.1 and/or LtRt than it doesn't make sense to do a separate stereo pass. unless you monitor the stereo mix while mixing in 5.1- but then you're 5.1 will be [bleep]. do any networks send out separate feeds for stereo, 5.1, and LtRt?

[philper]

do you come across situations where clients hear the downmix at home and have concerns with it? do you ever hear the downmix? if so, how does it sound?
M
ost of what I mix is stereo right now but i would hate not to do a separate stereo mix. one thing i notice (with friends) is that many people who have surround sound at home only use it on DVDs and not when watching TV.

I guess its not just dependent on the clients but the networks also. cause some clients may be cool doing a separate pass for stereo, but if the network only wants the 5.1 and/or LtRt than it doesn't make sense to do a separate stereo pass. unless you monitor the stereo mix while mixing in 5.1- but then you're 5.1 will be [bleep]. do any networks send out separate feeds for stereo, 5.1, and LtRt?

The first paragraph is why I still do stereo mixes--they seem to be what gets "demoed" as a work in progress at other facilities and on personal systems. It also seems to work better for me to send stereo mix to the LM100--if I can get that mix to work then surround versions of same seem to work as well. For DVD I find that sometimes they only want a stereo or LtRt, they don't want to devote room to a full 6 audio channels. (This is for smaller market work, not big movies.)

Philip Perkins