Why PT10 is not 64 bit... let's get this over with ;)

[chrisdee]

Originally Posted by Dism

Yes.

32 bit float point is standard across all of PT10.

Ok thanks.

Not shure I fully understand the 32 bit float point thing.
What benefit would i gain by recording in 32 bit float point when my Mbox 3 Pro converters are limited to 24 bit ?

Im thinking its more of a mixing benefit than recording ?

[Dism]

Originally Posted by chrisdee

Ok thanks.

Not shure I fully understand the 32 bit float point thing.
What benefit would i gain by recording in 32 bit float point when my Mbox 3 Pro converters are limited to 24 bit ?

Im thinking its more of a mixing benefit than recording ?

32 bit float point is kind of an "invisible" mixer, if you will. It's not handled by the converters, it's a completely internal process. It's nice for a few reasons, but most importantly is how much more headroom the software has. Basically, with 32 bit float processing, you can never clip internally. This gives you infinitely more breathing space in the mix.

[huzzam]

Originally Posted by Dism

It's because both plugin formats are designed exclusively for real time processing. They have no rendering capabilities in their current incarnation.

I understand that.

RTAS and TDM are why Pro Tools is still 32 bit. You wouldn't be able to run a 64 bit Pro Tools with 32-bit float point math on 48 bit Time Division Multiplexing cards. Because of that, there's no point recoding TDM or RTAS for 64 bit (which would be required for a 64 bit Pro Tools version, unless you create a bridge, which could only add more problems).

AAX solves both problems at once.

AU or VST would solve the same problems, at much lower cost to 1) users and 2) developers. But we have another thread for that debate, don't we

~peter in oakland

[bortraws]

What Avid should do though to bridge the time until we get a 64-bit version (and I put this up on the ideascale site as well) is to allow third party Rompler and Sample plugins, that support disk streaming, to stream the samples from the new RAM disk Cache in PT 10.

This will allow those plugins to read and write their samples from and to the RAM cache and sort of ditch the memory limitation until they come up with a full 64-bit version of Pro Tools. This will keep the user base happy AND give them time to develop the ultimate 64-bit pro tools version without being harrassed every odd minute.

Would be a cool feature

Maybe in version 10.1?

[microstudio]

There is one reason and only one reason PT is not 64bit already it is because they are a Cash Cow. They have milked RTAS & TDM for so long at the cost of our money while every other DAW out there was using VST and going 64bit.

Mean while PT used their major market share to bleed everyone till the bitter end. Now the day is growing near that we will see PT 64bit and RTAS,TDM will be gone and a new standard will be made to take their place at a major cost to us all the while there are other DAW's out there that only lack one thing PT milks all of us with... Market Share.

[spenner]

Originally Posted by microstudio

There is one reason and only one reason PT is not 64bit already it is because they are a Cash Cow. They have milked RTAS & TDM for so long at the cost of our money while every other DAW out there was using VST and going 64bit.

Mean while PT used their major market share to bleed everyone till the bitter end. Now the day is growing near that we will see PT 64bit and RTAS,TDM will be gone and a new standard will be made to take their place at a major cost to us all the while there are other DAW's out there that only lack one thing PT milks all of us with... Market Share.

Ignoring the facts in the OP does not make them not true.

[Rationalizer]

Originally Posted by Dism

The answer is quite simple.

RTAS and TDM.

Both are based on 32 bit architecture and to rewrite both would be a complete waste of time.

Hence... AAX.

AAX is the answer to our prayers. No more drama about which sounds better, whether or not one will open on your system... it becomes all the same. It can also become 64 bit.

PT10 HAD to be 32 bit, so to be able to still run TDM and RTAS since adoption of AAX will take time.

That has got to be the lamest excuse EVER. I mean Avid didn't want to rewrite code so they force every 3rd party plugin manufacturer to do yet another version for PT10. And in 32bits.

Interesting to see how much market share Avid will loose with this strategy. Cubase and Logic has been 64 bit for a long time now, Reason 6 is 64 bit, Reaper is 64 bit. But the new and future shaping PT10 is 32bit...

[emluper]

It's also about the legacy hardware guys. The drivers for the old hardware are still based on 32 bit programming. All of the other programs that you're mentioning don't have a LARGE user base of hardware owners out there. The post industry alone has a HUGE investment in hardware, and they are not going to have it become obsolete overnight. They've already given us hints of 64 bit because there is a phase out for the legacy hardware (which has been around since 2002 I believe). If you're ticked off now, imagine if NONE of your plugins or hardware would work today, and you couldn't upgrade at all without a substantial outlay of cash. They're trying to find a way to transition EVERYONE to the next level while alienating the fewest number of users. If 64 bit is what you need more than anything else, then switch platforms. If 64 bit Pro Tools is what you need, then you're going to have to be patient.

[mike connelly]

I don't buy this excuse at all. It makes sense that it's impractical to update RTAS and TDM to 64 bit for whatever reasons. But that's no reason not to include 64 bit support.

Just make an app that runs in 64 bit with the new plugin format, and if you need to run RTAS or TDM plugins you have to run the app in 32 bit mode. Not the best for users but way better than not supporting 64 bit at all. At least users who have all the plugs they need in the new format can run 64 bit.

And if digi really wanted to they could create a bridge so the 32 bit plugins ran as an external process and just send the audio back and forth. Which is what all the other 64 bit audio apps have been doing for years. And if they really wanted to have 64 bit support this decade they could have gone with VST and AU instead of creating yet another new proprietary plugin format, since there are a good number of 64 bit plugins already on both PC and mac.

Same goes for hardware support of old stuff that can't be updated. Release a 64 bit app but with older hardware you can only run it in 32 bit mode. PT is hardware independent now, no reason to punish people who are running other hardware that has 64 bit drivers.

[Kobra]

"When the next version of Pro Tools comes out and drops RTAS/TDM support, we'll see 64 bit processing across the board."

I'll wait to upgrade until that happens then.

"Just make an app that runs in 64 bit with the new plugin format, and if you need to run RTAS or TDM plugins you have to run the app in 32 bit mode."

That's what Logic has been doing for a couple years now - you can choose between opening it in 32-bit or 64-bit mode. The 32-bit plugs still run in 64-mode, with a "bridge". An extra step, clicking on a window to open 32-bit plugs is somewhat annoying, but still better than no 64-bit option imho.

"Basically, with 32 bit float processing, you can never clip internally. This gives you infinitely more breathing space in the mix."

Cubase had this 10 years ago (yes, 10 - a decade).