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  #1  
Old 10-07-2004, 04:02 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Open discussion: iLok. All welcome.

Many of you know my thoughts on iLok 'Monopoly'. If not do a search and read to your enjoyment.


Q:
If there is competition ie: HASP, can I authorize my Massive Pack 3 via HASP?
Q:
Can I transfer my licences HD pack and Waves using HASP?
Q:
If developers are not in concert with iLok why is iLok required and HASP not mentioned?



I used to have my cell phone service w/ ATT for over 8 years. I reciently switched to Cellular One. I was able to keep both phones, the old one from ATT which is no longer in service and my new phone from Cellular One which has the same phone number and my new service. Now I don't own my phone number but I have an agreement to use it. I was able to transfer my phone # to a different carrier.
So, is HASP a viable compettitor with all the access that Pace has?

I know there are other issues such as transfer fees etc. If someone knows the answer to my question and can tell me that I can transfer all my licences to HASP I will never post on this topic again. Just think you can shut Rob Mackinnon's mouth on the subject!
If not let the discussion continue. Let's all be civil I know Digi has had a busy morning.
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  #2  
Old 10-07-2004, 04:36 PM
Icabod Icabod is offline
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Default Re: Open discussion: iLok. All welcome.

Cellular One is still in business??
Thought they got bought out. Had them in '87.

Oh yeah, it does seem as if iLok has a monopoly. Thing is, I always thought Digi/Avid owned them.
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  #3  
Old 10-07-2004, 04:40 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Re: Open discussion: iLok. All welcome.

oops did I say Cellular One?
I meant US Cellular.
Oh well. The illustration is still good.
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  #4  
Old 10-07-2004, 05:16 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Re: Open discussion: iLok. All welcome.

Search results

as opposed to

This Search
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  #5  
Old 10-08-2004, 07:58 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Re: iLok: Research pt 1

Included are links to some 101 level research. I am looking forward to the 500 level study but one step at a time.
Read if you choose. At this point I will refrain from charging iLok with being a monopoly since they are not the "sole" provider of anti-piracy technology. (again something I am in favor of and appreciate the convenience of) However, in just a few minutes of reading I am leaning to believe that what we are witnessing with iLok is a growing "Natural Monopoly" for our market ie: Audio if I am allowed to categorize it as such.
Here are the links:

Definition of Monopoly
Forms of Monopoly
Definition of Natural Monopoly
Definition of Antitrust
Definition of Anti-Competitive Behavior
Definition of Tying

Justification and relevance is due to the fact I am in audio paralysis with out the little green light on my MAC TDM system.
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  #6  
Old 10-08-2004, 08:57 PM
InSights7 InSights7 is offline
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Default Re: iLok: Research pt 1

Very interesting.
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  #7  
Old 10-08-2004, 09:58 PM
Rail Jon Rogut Rail Jon Rogut is offline
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Default Re: Open discussion: iLok. All welcome.

The developer makes a decision which form of protection they choose to use -- if most are selecting the iLok it's just an indication that they prefer that over the competition. It certainly doesn't indicate a monopoly - since there are plenty of other dongles to use... it's just that iLok has some nice features for both the user and the software developer.. and the iLok offers a very high level of security.

Basically it's the same as you deciding on which lock to buy for your front door.. there are plenty to choose from.. but there are certain brands which are more popular because they offer better features and offer higher security.

If you don't like the copy protection method used by the developer.. you have the option not to purchase the product.

For alternate copy protection software and hardware options.. just Google the term copy protection dongle... the iLok has far from a monopoly - they simply offer a good product/service.

Rail
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  #8  
Old 10-08-2004, 11:01 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Re: discussion: iLok

Quote:


Basically it's the same as you deciding on which lock to buy for your front door.. there are plenty to choose from.. but there are certain brands which are more popular because they offer better features and offer higher security.
This is true. However the illustration breaks down when I can replace the lock on my front door. To my knowledge I can't move my assets to another form of copy protection. The choice was made for me if I want to use Digidesign. (which I do)


Quote:

If you don't like the copy protection method used by the developer.. you have the option not to purchase the product.
Again, true. But as I read the definition of "Natural Monopoly", I believe this is a better charge, for there is no choice for the consumer. Oh I can choose not to use Digidesign or plug-ins, I could go into graphic arts and use HASP. But the consumer for audio does not seem to have a choice in the matter or the customer service and insurance that goes with it. The developer makes the choice. Again I agree there are many advantages to using iLok. Yet for the Digidesign user there seems to be a growing requirement to using iLok. With all that I have invested so far with Digidesign I doubt I will choose another platform. And still, I don't have the choice on a product ie an iLok that I have to buy in order to use the platform. This opinion is based on my presupposition that iLok is in a "Natural Monopoly" with developers.

Quote:

For alternate copy protection software and hardware options.. just Google the term copy protection dongle... the iLok has far from a monopoly - they simply offer a good product/service.
True again. This is why I will refrain from using the term "Monopoly" since they are not the "sole manufacturer" of copy protection technology but now believe they fit the "Natural Monopoly" model. Even so, for me, everywhere I look the term "iLok Required" is becoming the tag line at the end of just about every plug-in for use with my system.
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  #9  
Old 10-08-2004, 11:15 PM
Rail Jon Rogut Rail Jon Rogut is offline
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Default Re: discussion: iLok

Well, it would be impossible (or cost prohibitive, and just plain stupid) for a software developer to offer different hardware copy protection options... It would mean higher costs for everyone and a bookkeeping nightmare.

My analogy with the front door lock was from the developer's point of view.. not the end user's.

Rail
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  #10  
Old 10-09-2004, 01:35 AM
Infa Infa is offline
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Default Re: discussion: iLok

Hey guys --

I was thinking, lets say iLok IS a monoploy (I am NOT saying it is yet, I am just saying hypothetically lets say it is for now). What would/could we do ?? Is it actually illegal to be a monopoly ??

To my understanding it must NOT be illegal. Because everywhere I turn in my ever so great , wonderful society I see monopolies (I wrote a song about it, like ta hear it, here it go J/K ).. But see they are "covered" up monopolies if ya know what I mean. Which I think iLok might be, and Rob is just maybe accidently "un-covering". Let me explain. The public at large actually believe they have a choice in DIFFERENT Gas companies to buy DIFFERENT gas or oil from right ??? But this is WAAAAY wrong. Every single one of them so called choices we have ALL get the exact same gas from OPEC. Opec runs and owns ALL fuel/oil/gas as we know it PERIOD !!! So how are we really getting a choice ?? Therefore anyone intellegent can agree Opec is a true monopoly...

Now I have plenty of other examples, but that one SHOULD be sufficeint, and get the point across along with this next point.

So,,, therefore as we understand it is possible to be a monopoly BUT keep it appearing like it is NOT, how do we know when other companies of ANY kind from ANYWHERE have not conglomerated (in a sense) and are running this same TYPE of monopoly ??
Bottom line is WE DON'T ...

BUT, it brings me/us back to my original question --IF we do find out/prove there is a plug in authorization conglomerated monopoly, what can we do about it ?? Is what Opec doing considered illegal ? I never thought so, because they have been doing it for quite some time now.

What's your guys's OG outlook on this one ??
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