Legal Issues using movie samples

[music]

Does anyone know what the law is concerning using samples from movies in songs. I have heard and read some things. I was thinking of calling a lawer but I thought many of you have probably run across the same situation. Any information appreciated.

Thanks,

Keith

[Reverend Dan]

Call a lawyer just to be sure! Better safe than sorry. I've used samples from pornos in some of my music without asking permission from anyone. Havent been sued yet!

[rtcstudio]

You definitely want a lawyer to check this out.

We were going to use three 15 to 45 second sound clips from Clint Eastwood's "The Good, The Bad and The Ugly" on one song (only one clip involved Mr. Eastwood's voice). We got the record company's legal dept. to check it out. Basically, we waited too late to get all the paperwork done before the release, and if we'd been able to get it done, it was going to possibly cost us as much as 6 grand! That was the estimate from the film's legal dept.

So be careful.

[Jeff Schmidt]

Just ask Fun Lovin Criminals what they paid Tarantino for the drops they used in "Scooby Snacks".

El Grande Dinero! [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img]

[dBHEAD]

I'm certainly not a lawyer, but I have run into that issue before. There is some grey area but I'll explain it as best I understand it.

Using a relatively small snippet from a movie once during a song should be acceptable with no obligation to pay royalties to anyone. It is only when a snippet is used repeatedly that there could be copyright violation.

The basic concept, as I understand it, is this: if you are an artist (any kind of artist) what you are creating is an abstraction of what you have experienced in reality. Because we are surrounded by media (television, billboards, movies, newspapers, magazines, radio, recordings, etc.) it would be ridiculous to ask artists to NEVER have even the slightest references to copyrighted material in their work.

However...if a snippet of audio is used repeatedly , especially is some thematic way, the argument is that the copyrighted snippet is a substantial part of the "new" created work and therefor is covered by copyright protection.

This has been an issue with rap music in the past. If you are going to create a dance groove with, for example, Humphrey Bogart saying, "here's looking at you, kid" over and over again, you'd have to pay royalties. But if you just spliced it in there once, it should be a go.

Now, the other aspect is length, but I'm not really sure what the reasoning is there or if there is any specific length which is not covered.

I do know production directors at local stations do use snippets from old movies and TV shows with wreckless abandon. Especially in their promos. One of the local stations had a hilarious promo using several snippets from The Andy Griffith Show where the local DJs were "interviewing" Andy and Barney Fife about how that radio show had turned Aunt Bee into a total slut.

[img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[rtcstudio]

Just be sure that your lawyer, the record company's lawyer and the film owner's lawyer agrees with the last post's interpretation.

I know a friend right now who is embroiled in a lawsuit right now. He's in the right, but the other guys are exercising their right to drag him into a multi-year, deposition after deposition, agonizing experience. He'll win, but only after spending thousands to defend himself over the next two years or more.

Make sure it's worth it to you in the long run to exercise your "rights".

[CPettigrew]

Originally posted by music:
Does anyone know what the law is concerning using samples from movies in songs. I
Thanks,

Keith

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you mean sampling an actor's voice? Or use of a piece of music from the film's soundtrack? Regardless, rights will have to be secured from the owner of the film, usually the studio or production company that retains ownership.

Isak Rahm did some very cool remixes of music from the film "Blade," but he used Wesley Snipe's voice from the dialogue track, and the CD was not allowed to go public (though I have a copy).

If it's dialogue you want to sample, it's even stickier because there's the film ownership gauntlet and then there's a little matter of the actor's persona, and possible infringement thereof. (Radio's different; airwaves are public and all that "sampling" falls under the "parody" label and you won't see those bits for sale at your local Tower, published by either BMI or ASCAP)

Isak Rahm, it should be noted, is the Hip-Hop Ubermensch of Dance/Trance/Romance, an unlikely lad who started out by programming beats for Ofra Haza. His true nationality is open to speculation, but his earliest noteriety came from bringing Rave parties to the dark side of the Balkans. That's when he fled to Israel, moved to NYC, then points further west....

Do a Google search; it's a fascinating story.

Craig

[ekuehnl]

The repitition argument above is simply not true. It is my understanding that unless you are making a "parody" you have no right to use any portion of the material without permission. In any case, I would have a lawyer contact the appropriate intellectual property owner. Often they are willing to work out a deal if they think the project is worthy.

As for the radio parodies--what film/music studio is going to sue radio?

-Eric

[dBHEAD]

Originally posted by ekuehnl:
The repitition argument above is simply not true. It is my understanding that unless you are making a "parody" you have no right to use any portion of the material without permission. In any case, I would have a lawyer contact the appropriate intellectual property owner. Often they are willing to work out a deal if they think the project is worthy.

As for the radio parodies--what film/music studio is going to sue radio?

-Eric

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">According to the government copyright office, the following are not protected by copyright:

"Titles, names, short phrases, and slogans; familiar symbols or designs; mere variations of typographic ornamentation, lettering, or coloring; mere listings of ingredients or contents"

Beyond that, there is the Fair Use Doctrine which, among other things, stipulates that segments of copyrighted materials may be used if:

"The nature and substantiality of the material used--In general, when other criteria are met, the copying of extracts that are "not substantial in length" when compared to the whole of which they are part may be considered fair use.

The effect of use on the potential market for or value of the work--In general, any use that supplants or diminishes the normal market for the original work is considered an infringement."

And this is from the actual US Code (literally, the law itself):

In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include -

(1)
the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

(2)
the nature of the copyrighted work;

(3)
the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

(4)
the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

Again, as I said, there is a grey area, but I'm quite certain that the example I gave is pretty accurate. Throwing a phrase from a Bogart movie into a song one time is an insubstantial portion and would not harm the market for the original work.

[rtcstudio]

Again, let me just say: You can be right and IN the right and still get sued.

An injunction can be put against your record while things get settled.

You can be dragged into depositions and courts.

You can spend literally thousands of dollars.

No matter what the law says in a book, YOU better check it out with all the legal departments that are involved BEFORE you decide to use Bogart, Eastwood, or my Aunt Sue on your record.

Then again, Aunt Sue would probably pay you to put her on your record...