Expand Zone

[rcutz]

Hi Guys, yesterday I have a nice afternoon with Eduardo Andrade, who is the avid specialist for latin america, but in the end we find that with an M10 16F 5k, I can`t have two expand zones!!

It din`t make any sense to me, and he can`t explain me why the system did only accept one, since I can have two plug-ins expanded at the same time in each knob module if made manually.

So i was quite bit frustrating since I`m in love with expand mode, and would love to have DYN and EQ expanded at once for each channel I needed.

I would love to know why it isn`t possible.

Best.

[lucienpalmer]

In my opinion, a dedicated expand zone is a bit of a waste on a 16 fader S6 anyway. It's too easy to manually expand a function- and all of the knobs are already in arms reach. The expand zone seems much more useful in a large S6 with a dedication knob module.

But that is an interesting idea of having two knob modules expand separate parameters from the same track. Still, I only have two hands and one brain, so I don't see myself adjusting compression and EQ at the same time.

[rcutz]

Lucien. It isn`t a matter of adjusting two different things at the same time, but just diminishing the number of time I need to click in some button to bring up tools that are extensively used...

with the two expand zones, with one click I could have the most used plug-ins open at once on the console, maybe I adjust just one, maybe I will adjust a little bit of compression, a little bit of eq...

actually I have to select eq, expand, then select dyn, expand, if so, come back to eq, etc...

What I`m asking make totally sense, including the fact that S5 has a module that is a control center, where every attention populates eq, dyn, aux sends, etc...

[lucienpalmer]

Okay, I see. I can understand if you want the ability to ADD two knob modules to a 16 fader S6 and have them assigned to expand zones. I misunderstood and thought you wanted to make both of the existing knob modules on a 16-fader and make those dedicated expand zones. It doesn't make much sense on an S6 that only has two knob modules. You couldn't use the knobs for anything else.

In fact, if they did add the ability to have 2 expand zone knob modules on an M10, they would also have to increase the number of modules allowed. In most M10 setups, you only have 1-3 knob modules. I would find it awkward to have two of them dedicated to functions. I would have to start using the touch screen for adjusting send levels.

[Postman]

I think you're both right. I wonder why is M40 limited to 2 expand zones. Why is M10 limited to 1 expand zone? I thought the difference between M10 and M40 is support for TFT screens, at least that is what I believed as I walked out of my hands-on sales pitch with an Avid rep and local dealer rep (both of whom I like very much). I don't personally mind that M10 limited to only 2 slaves, but why? Is there further differentiation being contemplated?

More importantly, why does expand zone completely take away knob module(s) even when nothing is expanded?

[lucienpalmer]

Besides they lack of display modules, M10 is also limited to the total number of modules attached. My manual says 10, but I know they increased it since then. They also in crease the number of modules second time to accommodate the new post module and surround Panners.

The master module is just a Windows embedded PC. It's my understanding that the M10 is just a slower computer, basically. So they have to limit some of it's capabilities.

[EddieJones]

The M10 is a lower powered unit but also a lot less expensive than an M40. We wanted S6 to be available to a wider range of customers so came out with a lower cost and differentiated feature set. If the M10 had all the power and features of a M40....it would cost the same and we wouldn't have a console to sell in that lower price range.
The Expand CKM's really come into their own as standalone units and this was the original idea for them (Aka S5 CM402 module) Leave Expand on a normal strip and each time you press a function you will get it auto expanded out.
M10's will be allowed 1 extra CKM(for expand) and both the new MJM(joystick) and MPM(PECDIR) modules once they are out.

[lucienpalmer]

Eddie brings up a point I forgot about. If you want to save button pushes, press 'all' on he master module and then press expand on one of the channels. That puts all of the into expand-ready mode. Press ALL again to turn that off.

After that, every function you press on the process module with expand into the knobs.

Unfortunately it still won't address your original point of accessing two separate functions of one channel at the same time.

[rcutz]

Originally Posted by EddieJones

The M10 is a lower powered unit but also a lot less expensive than an M40. We wanted S6 to be available to a wider range of customers so came out with a lower cost and differentiated feature set. If the M10 had all the power and features of a M40....it would cost the same and we wouldn't have a console to sell in that lower price range.
The Expand CKM's really come into their own as standalone units and this was the original idea for them (Aka S5 CM402 module) Leave Expand on a normal strip and each time you press a function you will get it auto expanded out.
M10's will be allowed 1 extra CKM(for expand) and both the new MJM(joystick) and MPM(PECDIR) modules once they are out.

Hi Eddie. I totally understand the differentiation between M10 and M40 and could`t agree more. I`m totally satisfied with my M10 with 16 faders and knobs modules, it is a great controller, and even believing that the display modules, for exemple, could be a "must", for me they aren't`t a essential piece of "gear".

But reading your post, if I do understand it right, allow only one expand zone on M10 at this actual stage was one particular decision of Avid, not a real limitation of the controller. And, I would like to ask, was it really necessary?

@Lucien, the method you describe has only one "issue", when a layout is changed, we need to start it all over again.

[quadraphonics]

I have an 8 fader M10 and have 2 VCA spill zones, but only one Knob expand zone.