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  #1  
Old 04-10-2007, 04:27 PM
russ russell russ russell is offline
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Default Apogee + HD3

Hi All!

Can anyone help me out here

I'm just about to order my 24 i/o HD3 rig and I have a choice to make between-

a) 2 x 192 with expansion cards to make 24 i/o and an Apogee Big Ben to make it run smoooooth

or

b) 3 x Apogee Rosetta 800 and an Apogee X-HD card

Choice b) comes in about £100 less than a) so theres not much in it.

Does anyone have experience of the Rosetta - would i still benefit much from a Big Ben to go with them or are the clocks good in the rosetta? And has anyone had any problems with the X-HD card?

And just to confuse matters, are the Apogee AD16x much better? For an extra £1200 i could have an AD16x and a DA16x and make up the other 8 i/o with a rosetta

Any pointers from people with experience of these different boxes would be much appreciated.

-RR
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  #2  
Old 04-10-2007, 09:10 PM
iamnerdyrocker iamnerdyrocker is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

Russ-
Not to hi-jack your thread but I would like to add an HD3/Apogee question on the table if I can.
When using the Apogee boxes with PT, how is the I/O setup handled? With the X-HD card, do the Apogee interfaces show up as interfaces in the I/O setup?

Again, sorry to hi-jack. I am looking for folks with the same experience on these questions.
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  #3  
Old 04-10-2007, 10:08 PM
MiamiMusicMan MiamiMusicMan is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

I have an HD3 with a rosetta 800. It shows up in PT as a 192. Sounds way wider with better top, more air. go with the Apogee.
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  #4  
Old 04-11-2007, 12:58 AM
Michael James Michael James is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

Quote:
a) 2 x 192 with expansion cards to make 24 i/o...
That configuration will give you 24 inputs and outputs, but only 16 inserts.
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System info: PT Ultimate 2019.6 HDX, Mac Pro 5,1 Westmere, OS 10.13.3, UAD2 Octo PCIe, 2x Lynx Aurora16 w LTHD cards, 1x Lynx Aurora(n) 32 ch analog I/O DigiLink, 4x Dangerous Convert-8 (AES via Lynx), Dangerous Convert-2 (AES via Lynx), Dangerous Vonvert AD+, Apogee Big Ben, SSD boot drive, external FW800 audio drives
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  #5  
Old 04-11-2007, 03:26 AM
usd usd is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

RR, i would go with the ad/da-x converters. i compared them to 192i/o´s and for me they sound much "better". there is also an improvement compared to the rosettas cause of BB clock. the ad16x and da16x have the same c777 clocking technology. i use a AD16x and a DA16x along with xhd card in advanced routing mode which gives me the possibillity of 32ins and outs. so you physically have 16channels of apogee conversion and if i need to record/mix more channels at the same time i just switch in my old rme adi8pro (clocked by the apogees). its by far the best sounding PT-system i ever owned! never had any problems with it...
cheers, alex
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  #6  
Old 04-11-2007, 06:57 AM
kittonian kittonian is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

The Apogee X-HD card does not look/act like 192 i/o's do. The latency is different and you must use AD-CALC from the Apogee website to manually compensate. Also, you cannot use outboard gear as inserts if you are in advanced routing mode (i.e. 16x16 analog AND 16x16 AES/EBU) as the ports do not line up properly. In order to use outboard gear you must be in standard routing mode and therefore you lose the entire digital side of the 16X unit. Apogee recommends you purchase a Digi digital 192 i/o in addition to both the AD/DA 16X if you need any digital i/o for your system. Also, you cannot use the hardware setup dialog box nor duplicate ports (i.e. send everything going out 1/2 to also go out 3/4). If you don't care about any of these features, the Apogee's are great.

However, if you want amazing sounding (or rather not sounding since IMHO I think conversion should represent the source/sound exactly as it is without coloration) conversion that looks/acts exactly like the 192 i/o, you need to look at the Lynx Aurora16 with the LT-HD card. You get everything that you get with (2) 16X's plus a digital 192 i/o in a 1U rack unit (i.e. 16x16 analog AND 16x16 AES/EBU simultaneously, BUT, with flawless PT integration). You literally rack this 1U piece, plug-in a DigiLink cable, and away you go. I had the 16X's and switched to the Aurora16 solution and haven't looked back since.

Hope that sheds some light on the situation.
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  #7  
Old 04-12-2007, 12:03 AM
MixerGuy MixerGuy is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

Quote:
The Apogee X-HD card does not look/act like 192 i/o's do. The latency is different and you must use AD-CALC from the Apogee website to manually compensate. Also, you cannot use outboard gear as inserts if you are in advanced routing mode (i.e. 16x16 analog AND 16x16 AES/EBU) as the ports do not line up properly. In order to use outboard gear you must be in standard routing mode and therefore you lose the entire digital side of the 16X unit. Apogee recommends you purchase a Digi digital 192 i/o in addition to both the AD/DA 16X if you need any digital i/o for your system. Also, you cannot use the hardware setup dialog box nor duplicate ports (i.e. send everything going out 1/2 to also go out 3/4). If you don't care about any of these features, the Apogee's are great.

However, if you want amazing sounding (or rather not sounding since IMHO I think conversion should represent the source/sound exactly as it is without coloration) conversion that looks/acts exactly like the 192 i/o, you need to look at the Lynx Aurora16 with the LT-HD card. You get everything that you get with (2) 16X's plus a digital 192 i/o in a 1U rack unit (i.e. 16x16 analog AND 16x16 AES/EBU simultaneously, BUT, with flawless PT integration). You literally rack this 1U piece, plug-in a DigiLink cable, and away you go. I had the 16X's and switched to the Aurora16 solution and haven't looked back since.

Hope that sheds some light on the situation.

Hmmmmmmmm - here you are again - pushing the Lynx Aurora16..... don't tell me - do you SELL them?

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  #8  
Old 04-12-2007, 06:54 AM
kittonian kittonian is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

Quote:

Hmmmmmmmm - here you are again - pushing the Lynx Aurora16..... don't tell me - do you SELL them?

Although we do happen to sell them, I am not "pushing them" in my response. I am simply stating the facts of the situation. A question was posed and I answered it honestly. Would you rather that people have wrong information or even no information before moving forward with a hefty purchase like this?

Fortunately or unfortunately, however you choose to look at it, the Digi 192 and the Lynx Aurora with the LT-HD card are the only solutions that work flawlessly with PT|HD at the moment. If you don't need all the functionality PT offers that's cool. There are a bunch of 3rd party options out there (Mytek, Apogee, Prism, etc.).
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  #9  
Old 04-12-2007, 04:07 PM
russ russell russ russell is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

Wow,

I was out for the last couple of days and have only just been able to get to a computer, BIG thanks to all of you for your info on this subject.

Going back over some of your points,

having 24 i/o but not having 24 inserts is not really a problem as its all going in and coming back through an 80 channel board.

i think i would go for the apogee 16 ad/da but i need 24i/o so i'd have to go for 2 of each (giving me 32) but thats just too much money right now - i got a zillion £ of plugins to buy too you know!!!

having to use separate latency calculator software sounds like a ball ache - bit of a turn off.

Lynx Aurora16 - havent seen these before - will def check it out, sounds interesting.

At the end of the day i know i can make great records with any of these things - i've used Tools since it was born and even a 192 running off its own clock is way better than anything we had back then!! I've been using 192's and a Rosenthal clock lately and all my clients have been very happy with the results so now its time to buy my own rig i'm not worried at all about the achievable results - I basically just want to squeeze the best i can out of it without spending loads more money.

Thanks again for all your help - keep it coming if you got any more. I'll let you all know how i get on.

Cheers - RR
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  #10  
Old 04-12-2007, 04:40 PM
russ russell russ russell is offline
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Default Re: Apogee + HD3

ok, i'm back!

So it would appear that i could have 2 x Lynx Aurora16 and a LT-HD card for less than 24 i/o on 192s - if they really are that good then this seems quite unbelievable - why isnt everyone buying them?

And are the clocks in them as good as a BB? or would they be even better with a BB?

On another note - does using anything other than digidesign stuff with your HD rig affect the warranty or support in any way?

Hmmmmm... so much to look into.

Later - RR

oh yeah sorry for my spelling earlier - rosendahl - i'm just an illiterate producer
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