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Old 06-22-2004, 05:03 PM
MarkPresti MarkPresti is offline
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Default extra airy sound on guitar

I am trying to record my guitar amp....i know, this is another one of those damn "amazing guitar sound" questions (i hate them too). Here is my problem, when i recorded a 4x12 cab the distortion sounded great. However, with my 1x12 fender combo the distortion sound is ok, but on top of that is a sort of sound that seems like a mixture of different sounds. it doesn't sound like one guitar amp. sort of a swooshing or extra air coming over the mic. I am using a 57 on the amp. i tried miking it from the front, the back, on and off axis, mixing it with a condenser and the 57, from farther away, closer, moving things in the room to get rid of reflections, etc....having some difficulty. any suggestions to fix that sort of sound that i am getting so it sounds more unified and less swooshy?

sorry for this dang question
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Old 06-22-2004, 10:55 PM
Bhennies Bhennies is offline
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

could be comb-filtering although I'm not really sure what you mean by the sound you described. I usually drape a sound blanket over the amp and mic to cut down on the room reflections- try that. Can you hear the noise without recording? i.e. is it the speaker or single coil pickups in the guitar?
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Old 06-23-2004, 12:20 AM
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

that is a feature of a single 12" speaker cone in an open case - most such amps have the same fehaviour. the extra air is supposedly making the high frequencies harsh, too.

sometimes i get better sound by placing the mic in the back and reversing the phase, and sometimes with only a room mic. and sometimes (line6!) from line out.

i have not yet seen such an amp (single 12" with open case) that would behave well in the studio. those are designed to sound nice in rehearsal basements or small stages. read: designed to use the room acoustics to make the final sound.

if you want to get a good sound by close-micing a speaker cone, you'd better have a good speaker cone in a good speaker enclosure. that's it. that's why 4x12 cabinets sound better - because they are designed to do so.
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Old 06-23-2004, 06:52 AM
where02190 where02190 is offline
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

We have several 1x12 cabs here, many of them open back, that record just fine.

Perhaps the original poster could put up a short example of the sound, so we have a better idea of what the problem is. Also, more detail on the instrument, preamps, etc., would be helpful.
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Old 06-23-2004, 09:24 AM
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

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We have several 1x12 cabs here, many of them open back, that record just fine.
good for you! can you please give examples which brands/models perform the best?

Quote:
Perhaps the original poster could put up a short example of the sound, so we have a better idea of what the problem is. Also, more detail on the instrument, preamps, etc., would be helpful.
yes. and i assume he didn't point the mic straight to the cone. but i still have a feeling that i know what he's talking about in here, and while it might not be 100% the open-back-single-12" fault, it's a huge part of the problem. i mean, because of the open back, it's designed to give its sound to the room it sits on, and micing just the speaker gives a totally different kind of sound that it's supposed to. 4x12 closed cabinets are more faithful when miking the cone.

maybe that's just my experience? i know by heart that closed-back 1x12" speakers sound different (better!) than the same brand open-back 1x12" version. i just cannot get the same sound from the speaker cones of open-back cabinets than i have gotten used to when working with closed cabinets. the problem might lie in expectations, and if one expects to get a closed cab sound, the open-back cabinet isn't going to cut it.

to the original poster: have you driven the recorded material through a spectrum analyzer? have you noticed anyting unusual in the 8k-20k range? if you place a lowpass on 5k, does the material sound close to what you expected?
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Old 06-23-2004, 09:54 AM
where02190 where02190 is offline
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

The most used are a pair of Marshall 1x12's, and a Mesa 1x12.

"Better" is a subjective opinion. Depends on what sound you're going for.
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Old 06-23-2004, 10:41 AM
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

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The most used are a pair of Marshall 1x12's, and a Mesa 1x12.
i have very good experience about marshall 1x12 closed cabinet speakers - not combo amps, but separate small speaker - connected to vintage tube laney amp. great sound! never liked the open-cab-combos though.

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"Better" is a subjective opinion. Depends on what sound you're going for.
yes, greatly. and as i said, some tricks work sometimes and others somewhere else. and when the guitarist has no opinion on which sounds better, i put in a line6 or amplitube
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Old 06-23-2004, 11:34 AM
MarkPresti MarkPresti is offline
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

American Fender Stratocaster, Bridge pickup. PR8MK2 preamps and also digi001 preamps. I have miked it from the side, i have not tried reversing the phase, i even tried pointing the mic in the opposite direction of the speaker and it sounded a little better, but still rather kruddy. the sound is the high frequency sound that one of the previous replies spoke of. I will try the analyzer and see if i can try to fix stuff with EQ, but i prefer not to use a lot of eq on things. I also tried putting the pickup in a different position (bridge, mix, etc..) and i tried changing the settings on the amp so less treble and mids are coming through, but no dice.

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Old 06-23-2004, 12:47 PM
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

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i even tried pointing the mic in the opposite direction of the speaker and it sounded a little better, but still rather kruddy.
to me this seems to be an indication of the room sound being better than the speaker cone sound. why not putting a room mic farther away from the amp (LD condenser if you have), turning the amp as loud as it gets while still sounding good, and forgetting about miking the speaker cone? try this, it won't take much longer than anything else, and has a good chance in solving the problem. after all, those open cabinets are designed to sound good in a small room, so try capturing the room sound rather than the speaker sound.
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Old 06-23-2004, 02:44 PM
where02190 where02190 is offline
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Default Re: extra airy sound on guitar

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yes, greatly. and as i said, some tricks work sometimes and others somewhere else. and when the guitarist has no opinion on which sounds better, i put in a line6 or amplitube
Again to each their own. IF I lived in an appartment I might have one of those things, but I'll never consider them for recording, as IMHO they sound nothing like the real thing.
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