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  #601  
Old 07-24-2013, 07:16 AM
Brahamnesik Brahamnesik is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

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Originally Posted by Emcha_audio View Post
I'm only bringing them up as it was part of the contentions of some, and to actually put in perspective the price factors. While the Control 24 in it's life time only worked by design with Pro tools, there was a fellow that actually reversed engineered to almost completion to work through midi with other daws like cubase and repear but he stopped and never publicly released it by recommendation of his lawyer. But that's beside the points.

There is also 1 point I was alluding to.. parts. How long till there's actually no more of the needed parts in circulation for the pro control and then for the control 24 before even the latest one becomes irreparable? And while factoring this (Avid would have a clear idea about this little fact better than anyone else here, I'd think) with the man hours needed to write the codes for the pro control and the control 24 to work with PT 11 and by extension further down the road (remember that Avid has not done any drivers/profile update for a while on these two and they are still working with PT 10, so opening them to pt 11 could potentially also open them for further down the line).

Anyhow I don't disagree that it's really not the news we were hoping for, that's for sure, but there are surely many variable that was taken into account. Note that I'm not trying to justify the why's, just that the decision is made and it's not a lone decision in the controllers/mixer world that breaks the mold.
The good news with this situation is that it reminds us that we shouldn't spend our money in software related devices. I'm still using Pro Tools HD 8 because Pro Tools 9 and 10 brought nothing interesting to the table.

Pro Tools 11 is a bit more interesting because it's 64 bits and have offline bounce capability. But let's be honest, every single other DAW have these features implemented for years now. so it's not groundbreaking.

So not only Pro Tools is overpriced but the company encourages us to invest our money in something else.

Instead of upgrading my Pro Tools system to HD 11 Native or HDX, I'll buy some nice outboards. Anyway, clients don't care about the software. It's no longer like when people were asking for Pro Tools. Now if you use PT, fine, if not just import everything manually in your DAW.

Moreover, on a commercial point of view, potential clients are more impressed by racks full of hardware than a computer full of plugins.

So, that's their choice. It's up to them to decide how to keep customers.
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  #602  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:19 AM
Kenny Gioia Kenny Gioia is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

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Originally Posted by Brahamnesik View Post
The good news with this situation is that it reminds us that we shouldn't spend our money in software related devices.
Not if you're looking for a return on investment in 10 or more years.

Not to excuse anything that happened here but when we bought our units, did we think they were going to last as long as an API, SSL or Neve console in terms of relevance?

I bought my Pro Control in 1999 and bought two Control 24s in 2001. If someone had warned me that they wouldn't work in 2013 using Pro Tools 11, I don't think it would have mattered to me in the least.

I was using Pro Tools 5.1 at the time with a Mix system and three 888s on a Mac G3 computer running OS9.

"This thing will work until Pro Tools 11????"

That would have sounded pretty good to me.
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  #603  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:26 AM
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JFreak JFreak is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

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Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
I bought my Pro Control in 1999 and bought two Control 24s in 2001. If someone had warned me that they wouldn't work in 2013 using Pro Tools 11, I don't think it would have mattered to me in the least.
So the lesson to be learnt in this all is:

Buy when it's new if you can justify ROI within 5 years after its last sale date.

That makes ICON and VENUE out of my league. Nice to rent, awful to own.
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  #604  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:27 AM
x9blade x9blade is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

Why wouldnt it work 10 years later with protools?
Basic functions should still work,no excuses.my mouse works on win 32 bit and 64 bit.i expect my procontrol to have basic functions.fader,pan,mutes,top menus,etc.this should not be a problem.
It will be very difficult for me to purchase anything from this company in the future
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  #605  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:29 AM
michael c michael c is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

All the talk about older SSL boards is still apples to oranges because those consoles STILL work as 3rd party people can work on them. If you paid 20k for an Emulator 1 or 200k for a Synclavier back in the day, (which is painful to think about!) people can still work on them, do modifications and this gear will still work if you want them to.

ProControl and Control24 ONLY will work with ProTools and they were the flagship controllers offered back in the day. Everyone realizes they are a legacy product now. There is NO easy way for a 3rd party to possibly mod these units to work unlike almost all other hardware units. If you have a ProControl with external packs you are talking a LOT of money invested in a certain company. Strikes me as odd that it is too bad for the loyal customer who has invested the MOST money in this company.

We will still use ProTools because we have for over 15 years. We won't be upgrading to HDX or PT11 at this time. No idle threat here. Things may change in the next few years and we may move up then, but not in 2013. We also will be very wary to upgrade anything AVID in our coming business plan and will sit on the sidelines and see where the industry goes.
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  #606  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:46 AM
x9blade x9blade is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

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Originally Posted by michael c View Post
All the talk about older SSL boards is still apples to oranges because those consoles STILL work as 3rd party people can work on them. If you paid 20k for an Emulator 1 or 200k for a Synclavier back in the day, (which is painful to think about!) people can still work on them, do modifications and this gear will still work if you want them to.

ProControl and Control24 ONLY will work with ProTools and they were the flagship controllers offered back in the day. Everyone realizes they are a legacy product now. There is NO easy way for a 3rd party to possibly mod these units to work unlike almost all other hardware units. If you have a ProControl with external packs you are talking a LOT of money invested in a certain company. Strikes me as odd that it is too bad for the loyal customer who has invested the MOST money in this company.

We will still use ProTools because we have for over 15 years. We won't be upgrading to HDX or PT11 at this time. No idle threat here. Things may change in the next few years and we may move up then, but not in 2013. We also will be very wary to upgrade anything AVID in our coming business plan and will sit on the sidelines and see where the industry goes.
Ive stayed out of this because i thought for sure avid would resolve this.
What sane company would do this?

I retired my hd4 ,purchased hdn and was finally able to build a modern computer without being handcuffed to my tdm cards. I thought it was time to move foward and leave pt 9 for 11. 11 is basically useless for me no vi's,waves or procontrol.if i could go back i think i would stay in pt9.

What is the big problem with making a driver with basic functions?
Im not a coder or programmer but if i had a similar issue in my day job,it would be resolved.

Seems like all the explanations about how difficult this would be is a bunch of nonsense.yes we want to move foward with protools,use it everyday.have too much invested.this just leaves a bad taste with everyone affected.
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  #607  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:46 AM
Craig F Craig F is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

You guys are talking about old analog desks
yes that analog audio paths still work but try and get some of the old automation systems working like:
NECAM
Flying Faders 1
a E or G SSL automation computer
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  #608  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:50 AM
x9blade x9blade is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

We are talking about controllers that do the same as a mouse.this should work
Just as the spacebar works on your comp.keyboard the play button on transport should work on my procontrol
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  #609  
Old 07-24-2013, 10:58 AM
louieshowers louieshowers is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

Why are the moderators the only people who painfully defend and justify this....? ex: "We are unhappy with the outcome, but here's is a million reasons why I understand and accept it...." It is a colossal slap in the face from Avid and these damage control attempts do not help ease people's concerns or change their opinions. It is a poor business decision and brought Avid's already compromised customer service reputation another 1000 leagues under the sea.

If you put lipstick and a dress on a pig, she still smells like a pig. This was wrong. End of discussion.
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  #610  
Old 07-24-2013, 11:10 AM
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Bob Olhsson Bob Olhsson is offline
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Default Re: Control|24 with Pro Tools 11?

The maintenance cost for those old consoles has been staggering on top of the immense original outlay. The cost of recapping them so they'll work at all is more than the cost of a Control 24 and most have needed it several times. So is the cost of the studio wiring. Those manufacturers have also all gone bankrupt!

Finally, there's nothing at all wrong with not being able to afford to upgrade. Every investment is always a trade-off. My choice back when HD came along was to only invest in native with premium converters and simply rent any studio time or gear that I needed to continue doing do first class work for my clients.
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