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  #1  
Old 09-28-2020, 08:04 AM
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Farhoof Farhoof is offline
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Default Protools needs an open beta

Protools desperately needs some sort of open beta system!

Each PT release since a few years (starting around PT 11) there are nasty bugs found within a single day which takes a few months to get fixed in a new release, which in turn introduces new bugs or even brings back old bugs. We carefully have to decide which bugs we prefer the most.

Currently we are running PT version 2019.6 because every single release after it has some critical bugs rendering it too much of a risk to be rolled out facility wide. Some of these bugs are over a year old. As of today about half (!) of all my bug reports are still open and some even a few years old. I doubt these will be fixed at all.

I am not asking for all bugs to be fixed at once, I am asking to have the software be tested and have the bugs fixed before a new version is released. There are plenty of bugs found by users within the first week of use. Heck, even within the first day. I know some big Hollywood facilities are beta testing (closed beta), but clearly this is not good enough.

Yes I am ranting, because I just installed 2020.9.1 and noticed a critical bug which has been around since 2019.10 it still not fixed. (see http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=407233 ) forcing me to roll back to 2019.6 yet again.
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  #2  
Old 09-28-2020, 08:12 AM
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

What you are requesting is free PT for all who can afford to use pre-release software. Not going to happen. Maybe in a perfect world Avid releases one time-limited PT beta when first Apple Silicon machines are out but other than that what you suggest is not a good idea, because:
- Avid needs reliable info from testers
- Avid does not have infinite resources to go through reports that are not reproducible
- Avid needs to tell its beta testers about what exactly to test, open beta is not that
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  #3  
Old 09-28-2020, 08:31 AM
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Who says it needs to be free? It should just work with your iLok license. By 'open' I mean anyone with a license can participate, not just the handpicked select few.

Are you saying an open beta system doesn't work in general or just not with Avid?
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Old 09-28-2020, 08:34 AM
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Please don't put words into my mounth. Being one of the past beta team members (PT7-10) I know how scarce the resources are. And the quality of feedback is very important.

It takes some time to understand what Avid needs to know about the issues and some effort to do regression testing to let them know where it was broken. Then fellow testers to reproduce the issue.

This is just common sense, not taking into account that all beta testers need NDA because beta software has unreleased features. Sorry to say, to repeat myself, just not going to happen.
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Old 09-28-2020, 09:29 AM
DontLetMeDrown DontLetMeDrown is online now
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Good ol Jfreak being Jfreak. Btw, asking you to clarify what you mean isn’t “putting words in your mouth”. Also, Avid’s archaic development methods are not “common sense” by any stretch of the imagination. I’d argue that having an open beta for paying customers should be common sense since they’re obviously having trouble squashing some of the old bugs and they’re very weak when it comes to adding innovative new features despite us essentially crowdfunding them by paying in advance for updates.

If Avid’s developers are curmudgeons like Jfreak, then it’s safe to say they’re probably incapable of extending themselves beyond their current bubble. This has become painfully evident in recent years. And quite frankly, Avid could improve PR substantially by 86’ing the condescending mods on this board. They only serve to perpetuate the garbage attitude that Avid consistently shown towards paying customers which isn’t helpful when you’re struggling with glitchy software.
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  #6  
Old 09-28-2020, 09:31 AM
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Just sayin' if they ever release open beta it will not have any new features, only testing compatibility to a new system like ARM transition that is coming soon.

New features need NDA for everyone involved. What is so hard to understand about it?
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  #7  
Old 09-28-2020, 09:54 AM
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

The are many important reasons. As Janne has said, it's not going to happen.
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  #8  
Old 09-28-2020, 11:08 AM
nedorama nedorama is offline
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Beta testing is about quality, not necessarily quantity.

having a bunch of users shout about what's not working and without the discipline to give feedback in a way that's useful for developers isn't helpful.

I've done beta testing for 3 different companies and it requires restraint and adherence to how developers want reports - logging into JIRA, for instance and outlining steps to produce the error/bug/crash, occurrences, and logging system info. It took me time to understand what feedback was helpful to developers vs. feature requests for future builds.

NDA's for outsiders is mandatory, iLok or not - if Avid adds new features, what would stop MOTU, Steinberg or others from signing up as well to the public beta to see new features?

Also, no one is forcing any facility to upgrade to the newest version of Pro Tools and most facilities that earn money from their PT rigs hold off on upgrades to the last possible time, and then only after they have tested in an isolated rig or during studio downtime.
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  #9  
Old 09-28-2020, 01:03 PM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

I am also against open beta. There are far too many users that can barely fire up a computer and those folks are not going to offer quality feedback. There are 2 very simple solutions and every user of any DAW should be implementing both.

#1-Backups. That means having drive images of your system drive, and those should be done at "intelligent" points. What I mean is; save an image with nothing but OS with all recommended tweaks. Save a second image when Pro Tools and drivers are installed and test good. Save a 3rd image when all software is installed, authorized and working good. Then, down the road, save a fresh image BEFORE installing any new software, or update(these can be deleted as you build up more and more images). The idea is that this makes it very easy to restore to a previous point, without costing you days of installs and such. This is a backup plan that will save your sanity.

#2-Always have a backup plan(see #1) If you won't have a backup plan, then at least ignore any update until its been out for 30 days. That way, you will know if others have issues and whether you should skip that particular update I would never install an update in the first weeks unless my backup plan is firmly in place(and sometimes, it isn't, and I have regretted that fact more than I want to think about)
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Old 09-28-2020, 04:14 PM
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TOM@METRO TOM@METRO is offline
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Default Re: Protools needs an open beta

Hey Dave, How do you feel about backups?
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Pro Tools Ultimate 2020.5 HDX
HD Omni and 192 I/Os
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Intel Hexcore i7
All Samsung Pro SSDs
Ampex MM1200 2" 24 trk tape
Outboard: UREI, Eventide, Lexicon, Yamaha, TC Electronics, Orban, ART, EchoAudio, Dolby, Hughes, API, Neve, Audio Arts, BBE, Aphex, Berringer, MOTU, dbx, Allison, etc.
Plug-ins: Too many to talk about.

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