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  #1  
Old 01-08-2017, 03:27 AM
Felix Andriessens Felix Andriessens is offline
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Default Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Since a couple of days, I am experiencing drifting sync with my Blackmagic video card. Measuring with Syncheck II, for each playback the sync goes from 5qt-frames video ahead to x qt-frames audio ahead, with x>>0 seemingly only depending on how long I let the video play without stopping. (To be honest, I never let it play beyond 3 minutes yet.)

I am on a mid 2011 27" 3,4GHz i7 iMac under Yosemite 10.10.5, Thunderbolt-screen on the iMacs Thunderbolt-port 1 (the left one, if you look on its rear), a Aikito Thunder2 Thunderbolt-dock on port 2, and the Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt on the Thunderbolt-screens Thunderbolt-port. I am using Blackmagic software version 10.5.4 after trying the latest version (which broke the video playback completely - the only thing that was sent to my TFT were stills, and as soon as I tried playback, the screen went black). ProTools HD without any AVID-cards (Fireface UFX), version 11.3.2.

Since I am in the middle of a tight delivery-schedule, I don't have time for further research, but maybe someone here had a similar experience and found a solution? I already had a short glance at http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=355244 (the Blackmagic Sticky in the video forum), but it didn't seem to offer a solution for me.

As soon as there is some time, my plan would be:
a) trying a newer ProTools version, possibly in combination with a newer Blackmagic version;
b) if that doesnt help: doing a complete re-install of my system (because this thing worked earlier this year, or better earlier in 2016)
c) if that doesnt help: ordering another Blackmagic or AJA thunderbolt video card and try if has something to do with that Intensity Extreme that seems to be already EOL from Blackmagics side. If I find something with a second Thunderbolt port, I could also try to change the order of my Thunderbolt chain.

So if there are any hints from your side, I'd appreciate that!

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 01-08-2017, 03:30 AM
Felix Andriessens Felix Andriessens is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

BTW: No, I can't remember that I did anything after which this problem began. All I can say for sure is that it for sure is that sync was a bit shaky in November 2016 already, and that it became really bad in the last approx. 5 days. I installed a couple of Zynaptiq plug ins three days ago, but that can't mess with my video sync, can it?!
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  #3  
Old 01-08-2017, 05:01 AM
tom_lowe tom_lowe is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix Andriessens View Post
Since a couple of days, I am experiencing drifting sync with my Blackmagic video card. Measuring with Syncheck II, for each playback the sync goes from 5qt-frames video ahead to x qt-frames audio ahead, with x>>0 seemingly only depending on how long I let the video play without stopping. (To be honest, I never let it play beyond 3 minutes yet.)

I am on a mid 2011 27" 3,4GHz i7 iMac under Yosemite 10.10.5, Thunderbolt-screen on the iMacs Thunderbolt-port 1 (the left one, if you look on its rear), a Aikito Thunder2 Thunderbolt-dock on port 2, and the Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt on the Thunderbolt-screens Thunderbolt-port. I am using Blackmagic software version 10.5.4 after trying the latest version (which broke the video playback completely - the only thing that was sent to my TFT were stills, and as soon as I tried playback, the screen went black). ProTools HD without any AVID-cards (Fireface UFX), version 11.3.2.

Since I am in the middle of a tight delivery-schedule, I don't have time for further research, but maybe someone here had a similar experience and found a solution? I already had a short glance at http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=355244 (the Blackmagic Sticky in the video forum), but it didn't seem to offer a solution for me.

As soon as there is some time, my plan would be:
a) trying a newer ProTools version, possibly in combination with a newer Blackmagic version;
b) if that doesnt help: doing a complete re-install of my system (because this thing worked earlier this year, or better earlier in 2016)
c) if that doesnt help: ordering another Blackmagic or AJA thunderbolt video card and try if has something to do with that Intensity Extreme that seems to be already EOL from Blackmagics side. If I find something with a second Thunderbolt port, I could also try to change the order of my Thunderbolt chain.

So if there are any hints from your side, I'd appreciate that!

Thanks!
The drift with BM cards on macOS is well documented. They seem better when they receive ref in (obviously not all models can) but AJA are more stable on macOS and it seems BM work better on Windows, and AJA are about the same.

I found the Intensity Extreme just about usable in various versions of PT 11 and 12.3 onwards when working at 25fps but unusable at 24fps.

I now use VideoSlave 3 and both 24 and 25 fps are much much tighter.

It seems the integration between AVE and the BM drivers is the fault. Get an AJA T-tap or VideoSlave 3, or both!
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  #4  
Old 01-08-2017, 05:40 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Felix, as mentioned in the BM sticky thread the issues started with the release of the 10.5 drivers.

Install the BM 10.4.3 and you should be fine. I have zero drift and minimal static sync offset on my rig (2 frames +/- 1ms) (see specs below).



Frank.
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  #5  
Old 01-08-2017, 06:39 AM
Felix Andriessens Felix Andriessens is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Install the BM 10.4.3 and you should be fine. I have zero drift and minimal static sync offset on my rig (2 frames +/- 1ms) (see specs below).
That did it! I'm down to 2qt video sync offset (from 16) in PT and the playback seems to be stable now. Although it sometimes just seems to start "on the wrong foot" and then has about 1 fr constant offset. 1000Dank an Dich, Frank!

Quote:
I now use VideoSlave 3 and both 24 and 25 fps are much much tighter.
You're using VS3 on a separate computer, right? Already been thinking about VS, but for now I think I'm good. Thanks nevertheless!
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  #6  
Old 01-08-2017, 06:48 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix Andriessens View Post
Although it sometimes just seems to start "on the wrong foot" and then has about 1 fr constant offset. 1000Dank an Dich, Frank!
Yes, that's normal because you're not genlocked.

Glad it helped.

F.
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  #7  
Old 01-08-2017, 09:29 AM
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Chief Technician Chief Technician is offline
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Arrow Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix Andriessens View Post
Since a couple of days, I am experiencing drifting sync with my Blackmagic video card. Measuring with Syncheck II, for each playback the sync goes from 5qt-frames video ahead to x qt-frames audio ahead, with x>>0 seemingly only depending on how long I let the video play without stopping. (To be honest, I never let it play beyond 3 minutes yet.)
Is it in sync for the first 30 seconds? I have found that with a DeckLink HD Extreme 3D+ on OS X v10.9.5 with Pro Tools v12.3.1 and Blackmagic v10.5.4 that if your SYNC|HD and Blackmagic peripheral are not genlocked to the frame rate of the video clip in your session that sync is not maintained beyond 30 seconds of playback. This happens regardless of where you start playback in the session, which to me means it is a drift/slip problem of some sort.

I reported my findings to Avid, and they effectively said "Since this problem doesn't occur in the video window (Command+9), it's not our problem. Talk to Blackmagic."
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  #8  
Old 01-08-2017, 12:22 PM
tom_lowe tom_lowe is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix Andriessens View Post
That did it! I'm down to 2qt video sync offset (from 16) in PT and the playback seems to be stable now. Although it sometimes just seems to start "on the wrong foot" and then has about 1 fr constant offset. 1000Dank an Dich, Frank!

You're using VS3 on a separate computer, right? Already been thinking about VS, but for now I think I'm good. Thanks nevertheless!
No use it on the same machine.

And to Frank I find (and tests confirm this) that VideoSlave 3 is pretty much as good as a genlocked system. It's only Pro Tools where these issues really show themselves.
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  #9  
Old 01-08-2017, 01:06 PM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

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Originally Posted by tom_lowe View Post
No use it on the same machine.

And to Frank I find (and tests confirm this) that VideoSlave 3 is pretty much as good as a genlocked system. It's only Pro Tools where these issues really show themselves.
Thanks, there's no way I'm going back to backwards selecting only with video like 10 years ago. I assume PT still doesn't cue a video slave forward in time when selecting via MMC? Or has that improved in the meantime?

Frank.
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  #10  
Old 01-08-2017, 01:19 PM
tom_lowe tom_lowe is offline
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Default Re: Blackmagic Intensity Extreme Thunderbolt Sync Drift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kruse View Post
Thanks, there's no way I'm going back to backwards selecting only with video like 10 years ago. I assume PT still doesn't cue a video slave forward in time when selecting via MMC? Or has that improved in the meantime?

Frank.
You mean when selecting in Pro Tools does VideoSlave follow? If so, the answer is yes. I'm not saying it's perfect, and there is slight lag, but the performance is way better than AVE and works flawlessly with BM cards. Sure, it's not a referenced system but it's as close as you're going to get and perfectly fine for most work at a tiny fraction of the cost of a fully referenced system.
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