Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Legacy Products > Pro Tools 9

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #91  
Old 12-17-2010, 12:36 PM
NewdestinyX NewdestinyX is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 593
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BaileyBass View Post
While in principle you have some points, your timeline is off by at least 10 years. Tape was alive and well in the early 90's and non-destructive editing and multi-track HDisk recording was later on that decade. And 100k was a VERY lowbudget Rock record in the late 80's, early 90's. Even contemporary Jazz had bigger budgets (than 100k) way back then. It is true that times have changed.... just later than you thought. SB
Oh MY! You're SO right. It just goes to show you how 'in denial' I am about my age and how time FLIES. You're right I was JUST outfitting the studio I worked for in '96 with 6 DA38's and 6 ADATs and getting them all to sync with each other and WITH our 2" - which Lynx had an amazing little piece for in those day to make a '2"" slave to MTC. You're right it was late, late 90's before Hard disk recording would yet again lower budgets. Budgets did start to drop when MDM's came in too -- but the plunge was when we went all computer. Good (hard) trip down memory lane, SB! Thanks!
__________________
Rig 1-Mix/Mast: PTHD 11.3.1; MacPro 6core (6,1) 3.5 GHz Xeon E5; 10.10.3 (SSD Drives for audio); Apogee DUET, FireStudio2626 as Hware Inserts to PT for outboard
Rig 2-Cutting&Remotes: PTHD 11.3.1; MacBook Pro (8,1) 2.8 GHz Dual i7; 10.9.2 (128GB int '6G' SSD drive); Profire LightBridge (FW800), 32ch Presonus Digimax FS
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 12-17-2010, 02:12 PM
getz76 getz76 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 1,491
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keybeeetsss View Post
How long can people seriously talk about & say the same thing when after u get done, it is what it is
Quote:
Originally Posted by getz76 View Post
I would guess another 20-30 posts.
Yup.
__________________
| Logic Pro 9 | Reason 6.5 | Pro Tools 10 | MOTU UltraLite mk3 | RME ADI-2 | Summit Audio 2BA-221 x 2 | MOTU 8pre x 2 |
| Mac Pro (4,1) 2.26gHz Xeon x 2 16gB OS X 10.7.4 | Macbook Pro (8,2) 2.2gHz i7 Quad 16gB OS X 10.7.4 |
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 12-18-2010, 10:20 AM
supersoul supersoul is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Berlin
Posts: 4
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

I find the habit of asking for stems very annoying. My experience is that they screw up the music if they have too much choice in terms of levels. They get all creative with your composition and feel entitled to 'tweak' your individual sections. But that's a different story. But regardless of that giving them more than 8 stereo stems is creative harakiri imho. You might as well give them the open session and let them mix your music hoping they'll get it right.

I have yet to hear a huge hollywood score that sounded good in the mix. Mushy mushmush is the usual result. By record mixing standards movies sound [bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]ty. Real [bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]ty. Usually the source music that is licensed and available only in stereo sounds best. See Tarantino films, he only licenses and the sound and effect of the music is always impeccable. Kubrick did that a lot too. These mutated scores with gigantic orchestras and additional electronics and one million tracks end up sounding like crap in 98% of the cases.

I am exagerating on purpose here... What I am trying to say is that you should rethink and resize what you give them because it sounds like counterproductive choice overkill to me. 16 stereo inputs is plenty by all means.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 12-18-2010, 11:31 AM
HD2 HD2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 928
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersoul View Post
I find the habit of asking for stems very annoying. My experience is that they screw up the music if they have too much choice in terms of levels. They get all creative with your composition and feel entitled to 'tweak' your individual sections. But that's a different story. But regardless of that giving them more than 8 stereo stems is creative harakiri imho. You might as well give them the open session and let them mix your music hoping they'll get it right.

I have yet to hear a huge hollywood score that sounded good in the mix. Mushy mushmush is the usual result. By record mixing standards movies sound [bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]ty. Real [bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]ty. Usually the source music that is licensed and available only in stereo sounds best. See Tarantino films, he only licenses and the sound and effect of the music is always impeccable. Kubrick did that a lot too. These mutated scores with gigantic orchestras and additional electronics and one million tracks end up sounding like crap in 98% of the cases.

I am exagerating on purpose here... What I am trying to say is that you should rethink and resize what you give them because it sounds like counterproductive choice overkill to me. 16 stereo inputs is plenty by all means.

First off I think the OP was talking about delivering stems to the orchestra conductor. But regardless of that, delivering a stereo mix the way YOU want it to the dubbing stage while in theory it sounds good, it doesn't always work that way. Composers are usually working to a guide track of just production dialog and a lot of times they even turn that off and just compose to the visuals. This can be a real problem on the dub stage if there are no stems to adjust. There may be a violin piece over a percussion bed with a string bed as well, that is just fighting with the dialog. If it is stereo the whole score has to be lowered or EQ'd is such a way that it detracts from the piece, where as if there are percussion stems, string stems etc. then the violin piece can be EQ'd separately and lowered slightly if needed. Then there is also all the sound FX that the composer isn't aware of while doing the score. Sometimes elements of the score fight with the sound FX and visa versa. In the end it is the director and or producers who work in collaboration with the re-recording mixer to get to something that is as close as possible to what the composer was trying to achieve but as I said the composer isn't always thinking about or hearing the "BIG" picture while doing the score.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 12-18-2010, 11:36 AM
NewdestinyX NewdestinyX is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 593
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HD2 View Post
First off I think the OP was talking about delivering stems to the orchestra conductor. But regardless of that, delivering a stereo mix the way YOU want it to the dubbing stage while in theory it sounds good, it doesn't always work that way. Composers are usually working to a guide track of just production dialog and a lot of times they even turn that off and just compose to the visuals. This can be a real problem on the dub stage if there are no stems to adjust. There may be a violin piece over a percussion bed with a string bed as well, that is just fighting with the dialog. If it is stereo the whole score has to be lowered or EQ'd is such a way that it detracts from the piece, where as if there are percussion stems, string stems etc. then the violin piece can be EQ'd separately and lowered slightly if needed. Then there is also all the sound FX that the composer isn't aware of while doing the score. Sometimes elements of the score fight with the sound FX and visa versa. In the end it is the director and or producers who work in collaboration with the re-recording mixer to get to something that is as close as possible to what the composer was trying to achieve but as I said the composer isn't always thinking about or hearing the "BIG" picture while doing the score.
I learned this the hard way by almost losing a commercial account that needed to put voice over material on top of my music bed.. They said they needed 'more room for the voice'.. I didn't get what they meant.. Until one time I asked THEM to send ME the voice over material. My mixing of the music bed had to change DRASTICALLY to 'make room for', EQ-wise, etc -- the voice.. I imagine with dialogue in a movie the challenge is even greater. What we perceive as 'great mix' of our music -- wouldn't be what translates well to the screen. It would be great if the movie houses sent US, the engineers, their dialogue dubs and let US do their FINAL mixing to surround. What are the chances of THAT happening?
__________________
Rig 1-Mix/Mast: PTHD 11.3.1; MacPro 6core (6,1) 3.5 GHz Xeon E5; 10.10.3 (SSD Drives for audio); Apogee DUET, FireStudio2626 as Hware Inserts to PT for outboard
Rig 2-Cutting&Remotes: PTHD 11.3.1; MacBook Pro (8,1) 2.8 GHz Dual i7; 10.9.2 (128GB int '6G' SSD drive); Profire LightBridge (FW800), 32ch Presonus Digimax FS
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 12-18-2010, 11:37 PM
supersoul supersoul is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Berlin
Posts: 4
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HD2 View Post
First off I think the OP was talking about delivering stems to the orchestra conductor. But regardless of that, delivering a stereo mix the way YOU want it to the dubbing stage while in theory it sounds good, it doesn't always work that way. Composers are usually working to a guide track of just production dialog and a lot of times they even turn that off and just compose to the visuals. This can be a real problem on the dub stage if there are no stems to adjust. There may be a violin piece over a percussion bed with a string bed as well, that is just fighting with the dialog. If it is stereo the whole score has to be lowered or EQ'd is such a way that it detracts from the piece, where as if there are percussion stems, string stems etc. then the violin piece can be EQ'd separately and lowered slightly if needed. Then there is also all the sound FX that the composer isn't aware of while doing the score. Sometimes elements of the score fight with the sound FX and visa versa. In the end it is the director and or producers who work in collaboration with the re-recording mixer to get to something that is as close as possible to what the composer was trying to achieve but as I said the composer isn't always thinking about or hearing the "BIG" picture while doing the score.
Well, that you shouldn't compete with the dialog with your composition is composers 101. Usually you do receive a rough dialog and efx track with your version to work to. My experience is that there is a proper competition fight between sounddesigners and composers for who gets more room. I have been preaching to directors to use less music but when using it to give it to appropriate room. I remember watching Godzilla in the cinema and thinking: Poor David Arnold, all this work into composing a complex orchestral score and then you get buried underneath tons of collapsing buildings. Why? It seems pointless and a waste of money too... As i mentioned i find Tarantino and Kubrick are masters at using the music. If it's there it's there, don't try to hide it. And if you want your EFX to be loud have the {bleep} to press the mute button...

But that's more of a general discussion and off topic here. Sorry to divert.
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 03-21-2011, 10:17 PM
MacPC MacPC is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 64
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Decided to get an HD system. Thanks to everyone who helped with the discussion; it was not what I wanted to hear but it was certainly candid.

Take care,

MacPC
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 03-22-2011, 05:35 AM
BobbyDazzler's Avatar
BobbyDazzler BobbyDazzler is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,000
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Good for you MacPC, It hurts the wallet, but its a great system.
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 03-22-2011, 08:53 AM
TOM@METRO's Avatar
TOM@METRO TOM@METRO is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 16,919
Default Re: Can this be? Only 16 stereo inputs in PT9?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacPC View Post
Decided to get an HD system. Thanks to everyone who helped with the discussion; it was not what I wanted to hear but it was certainly candid.

Take care,

MacPC
Native or TDM?

And judging form you’re decision, I guess Avids business model does kinda' work for them.
__________________
~ tom thomas

Formerly hobotom

Pro Tools Ultimate 2019.6 HDX
HD Omni and 192 I/Os
Windows 10
Intel Hexcore i7
All Samsung Pro SSDs
Ampex MM1200 2" 24 trk tape
Outboard: UREI, Eventide, Lexicon, Yamaha, TC Electronics, Orban, ART, EchoAudio, Dolby, Hughes, API, Neve, Audio Arts, BBE, Aphex, Berringer, MOTU, dbx, Allison, etc.
Plug-ins: Too many to talk about.

www.metrostudios.com
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
using stereo inputs francois ICON & C|24 1 07-04-2012 09:52 PM
MBOX PRO 2 STEREO INPUTS!!??? houseofoaktree 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 3 12-03-2007 11:18 AM
D-Command Stereo inputs Reckless Erik ICON & C|24 3 05-24-2007 01:33 PM
DIGI 002 inputs - mono or stereo? JLSIII 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 15 05-08-2005 03:29 AM
can' t cofigure stereo inputs desil 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 1 10-26-2001 03:56 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:09 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com