Problem with Issues and Issues with Problems

[allen_gibberish]

Originally Posted by Bill Denton

Avid's goal is to make a profit. Avid sells software. Avid's goal is to make a profit. Avid allows/disallows interoperability with other products. Avid's goal is to make a profit.

My goal is being able to buy a product that does what I need and doesn't create me other problems I don't have

It's really time for some people to grow up and learn how economic systems work...

It is really time for companies to understand people needs things and they save money to buy stuff that meet those needs and, given the today trend of companies-[bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]-marketing-to-create-a-profit, are quire tired of trashing money in products that create problems and don't solve needs or being forced in upgrading stuff that never exit the beta testing zone and had already been discontinued and replaced by a new one that's even more buggy

Originally Posted by Southsidemusic

Well said Bill
Total agreement here and as you said, time to lay this whole discussion about rtas and vst not working with PT 11 to rest once and for all. Posting all these threads saying Avid doesn't care about us and hosed here and hosed there is really tired now..

That would be silly to believe if you totally agree with what Bill said.. then how could you even imagine a "concept" like that... how could you think Avid would care about us... quoting the one you quoted: "Avid's goal is to make a profit" not caring about their customers.. which would mean creating tools that deliver the expected results needed to solve a problem

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by allen_gibberish

My goal is being able to buy a product that does what I need and doesn't create me other problems I don't have



It is really time for companies to understand people needs things and they save money to buy stuff that meet those needs and, given the today trend of companies-[bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]-marketing-to-create-a-profit, are quire tired of trashing money in products that create problems and don't solve needs or being forced in upgrading stuff that never exit the beta testing zone and had already been discontinued and replaced by a new one that's even more buggy



That would be silly to believe if you totally agree with what Bill said.. then how could you even imagine a "concept" like that... how could you think Avid would care about us... quoting the one you quoted: "Avid's goal is to make a profit" not caring about their customers.. which would mean creating tools that deliver the expected results needed to solve a problem

You might make a better point if people could actually understand what you wrote. Bleeped out profanity only makes it worse to try and get your point. And PT does deliver the expected results but I don't understand what 'problem' you expect PT to solve? Or are you talking about a wrapper? Avid has already made it's point on this and time to let it rest and move on. There are solutions that do work: Blue Cat Audio MB7-1, Patchworks and VEPro are being used to great success. It's not Avid's part to worry about third party developers although they did throw a sop with allowing a co-install of PT10 and PT11. If you want to use PT11 and still have plugins that aren't being transitioned to aax64 bit then use one of the three products I mentioned.

[allen_gibberish]

Originally Posted by musicman691

You might make a better point if people could actually understand what you wrote. Bleeped out profanity only makes it worse to try and get your point. And PT does deliver the expected results but I don't understand what 'problem' you expect PT to solve? Or are you talking about a wrapper? Avid has already made it's point on this and time to let it rest and move on. There are solutions that do work: Blue Cat Audio MB7-1, Patchworks and VEPro are being used to great success. It's not Avid's part to worry about third party developers although they did throw a sop with allowing a co-install of PT10 and PT11. If you want to use PT11 and still have plugins that aren't being transitioned to aax64 bit then use one of the three products I mentioned.

Profanity? I had written "bullsh*t". Do you feel profaned? Why don't you point that out to the Duc webmaster.. that adding a beep for each letter that form a "bad word" (about which I don't know who is entitled in calling it bad, it is just a word, no need for judgement here) doesn't lead to comprehension? Surely it is worse than just reading "bullsh*t" because it censure the sense of what people is talking about... but yeah.. we live in that kind of hypocrisy and seems we like that

I didn't talk about PT, I was talking in general, because I'm tired of these kind of comments.

Justify everything because "they have to make a profit" yeah, I understand, but I also understand before 80ies, 90ies, things were done to achieve a goal, profit was just a consequence.

I feel pretty duped when I read things like "finally now aux are compensated correctly" calling this a feature.. actually Avid always stated PDC works perfectly you don't have to worry about anything (as all the others DAWs).. well guess what, I never believed that, I ended up compensating everything manually.. and I got the results I was expecting, PDC didn't give me that... Now PT11 seems to have solved this problem

Or when I read things like "now automations are time stamped.." uh thank you

Or what about VI and midi not time stamped

And what about I put two sinewaves recorded to track and for some reason, sometimes don't null together.. or they null together.. then I turn on PDC and they don't null together anymore.. then I turn off PT two times.. and they null together again.. after some time, for some reason they don't null any more. That's one of the curious things I've experienced in PT9 (tested without any plug in on) and I got a friend reproduce it in PT10.. I hope has been solved in 11.. but that problem lead to the fact that when I was mixing using PDC.. after a while, things didn't sound properly.. I turned off PT two times and then they sounded properly again.. but I had to change the plug in settings I had changed in the last hours I was working, redoing half the work.. just because of a bug?

Or are we talking about the numerous number of -6101 errors and similar? Is that an expected behavior that leads to expected results? When you are recording a performance and suddenly everything stops because you get this error.. or the other one -9028 if I'm correct..? Errors that manifest themselves even with NO plug ins and few tracks? In a perfectly optimized system to be used with PT.

Do we pay for that? Is it part of the PT features? Do you translate that with "PT deliver the expected results"? What do you tell to the artist you were recording that, once he finally achieved the right level of inspiration, mood, to record "the best take" he is able to deliver.. well.. unfortunately there's a crash.. and your track is gone lost... oh wow.. then the guy start losing that right mood, confidence.. because he thinks.. no matter how I good I can do it, I also have to be lucky that nothing stops while I'm performing

Are all those results delivered as expected? Because if they are so, maybe it is me that I've chosen the wrong DAW for me, probably these are features other people like, maybe all the artists in the world like to lose a performance because of one of those cute errors.. because they keep them entertained.. I don't know

Those are just a couple of the things in which PT doesn't deliver the expected result (IMO), but it is not just an Avid problem.. it is pretty much all in that way today. I found like one or two companies that deliver what they advertise, no more.

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by allen_gibberish

Profanity? I had written "bullsh*t". Do you feel profaned? Why don't you point that out to the Duc webmaster.. that adding a beep for each letter that form a "bad word" (about which I don't know who is entitled in calling it bad, it is just a word, no need for judgement here) doesn't lead to comprehension? Surely it is worse than just reading "bullsh*t" because it censure the sense of what people is talking about... but yeah.. we live in that kind of hypocrisy and seems we like that

I didn't talk about PT, I was talking in general, because I'm tired of these kind of comments.

Justify everything because "they have to make a profit" yeah, I understand, but I also understand before 80ies, 90ies, things were done to achieve a goal, profit was just a consequence.

I feel pretty duped when I read things like "finally now aux are compensated correctly" calling this a feature.. actually Avid always stated PDC works perfectly you don't have to worry about anything (as all the others DAWs).. well guess what, I never believed that, I ended up compensating everything manually.. and I got the results I was expecting, PDC didn't give me that... Now PT11 seems to have solved this problem

Or when I read things like "now automations are time stamped.." uh thank you

Or what about VI and midi not time stamped

And what about I put two sinewaves recorded to track and for some reason, sometimes don't null together.. or they null together.. then I turn on PDC and they don't null together anymore.. then I turn off PT two times.. and they null together again.. after some time, for some reason they don't null any more. That's one of the curious things I've experienced in PT9 (tested without any plug in on) and I got a friend reproduce it in PT10.. I hope has been solved in 11.. but that problem lead to the fact that when I was mixing using PDC.. after a while, things didn't sound properly.. I turned off PT two times and then they sounded properly again.. but I had to change the plug in settings I had changed in the last hours I was working, redoing half the work.. just because of a bug?

Or are we talking about the numerous number of -6101 errors and similar? Is that an expected behavior that leads to expected results? When you are recording a performance and suddenly everything stops because you get this error.. or the other one -9028 if I'm correct..? Errors that manifest themselves even with NO plug ins and few tracks? In a perfectly optimized system to be used with PT.

Do we pay for that? Is it part of the PT features? Do you translate that with "PT deliver the expected results"? What do you tell to the artist you were recording that, once he finally achieved the right level of inspiration, mood, to record "the best take" he is able to deliver.. well.. unfortunately there's a crash.. and your track is gone lost... oh wow.. then the guy start losing that right mood, confidence.. because he thinks.. no matter how I good I can do it, I also have to be lucky that nothing stops while I'm performing

Are all those results delivered as expected? Because if they are so, maybe it is me that I've chosen the wrong DAW for me, probably these are features other people like, maybe all the artists in the world like to lose a performance because of one of those cute errors.. because they keep them entertained.. I don't know

Those are just a couple of the things in which PT doesn't deliver the expected result (IMO), but it is not just an Avid problem.. it is pretty much all in that way today. I found like one or two companies that deliver what they advertise, no more.

Yes - profanity and this is no place for it. It's not a matter of judgement it's a matter of good taste and respect for the community and those who might be checking this place out and seeing if PT is right for them. Foul language doesn't do that person any good.

If you weren't talking about PT then why did you even post in a 7 month old thread that has nothing to do with what you wrote? And if you've found product that does what you want and PT doesn't then why not use that product? Why waste your time here then?

[mesaone]

Why does this thread still prompt arguing?

VST can be hosted in Pro Tools. Audio Units, too. Maybe Sugar Bytes TransVST bit the dust, but let's see what is out right now that can integrate VST with Pro Tools, shall we?

• DDMF Metaplugin
• Blue Cat Patchwork
• Blue Cat MB-7
• Nomad Factory Magma
• Plogue Bidule
• Vienna Symphonic Library

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by mesaone

Why does this thread still prompt arguing?

VST can be hosted in Pro Tools. Audio Units, too. Maybe Sugar Bytes TransVST bit the dust, but let's see what is out right now that can integrate VST with Pro Tools, shall we?

• DDMF Metaplugin
• Blue Cat Patchwork
• Blue Cat MB-7
• Nomad Factory Magma
• Plogue Bidule
• Vienna Symphonic Library

And there's also rewiring Reaper into PT

There's so many options it's not even funny; but I guess some people like Mr. Gibberish (now there's an appropriate screen name) can't see that and just because the world doesn't turn their way they get all in a huff.

[allen_gibberish]

Originally Posted by musicman691

Yes - profanity and this is no place for it. It's not a matter of judgement it's a matter of good taste and respect for the community and those who might be checking this place out and seeing if PT is right for them. Foul language doesn't do that person any good.

All you said there is your personal opinion, my opinion is that what you call foul language or profanity is just hypocrisy that has nothing to do with respect and I don't see how what I said would be referred in anyway to the community. My opinion is that words are made to be used to express what one wants to express, without category of bad or good words.. and I have on my side of thinking like most of the guys who actually did the history of literature... as you could know reading interviews of the time or some of the authors idiosyncrasies in their books

If you weren't talking about PT then why did you even post in a 7 month old thread that has nothing to do with what you wrote?

Because what I wrote in my first post in this thread was referred to the users I quoted in my post and I felt in need to express my opinion regarding what these two users have wrote. My second and third posts in this thread are to reply to what you wrote to me

Is there anything illegal in doing this? Do I need your approval?

And if you've found product that does what you want and PT doesn't then why not use that product?

I use that product and I use PT because they do two different things and because I like a lot PT as a DAW when it works, compared to what's on the market, except some other daws that don't run on my OS, but still PT doesn't do what is supposed to do regarding other stuff I mentioned... which were advertised as fully working and are not.

Regarding PT I'd just like to being able to use it in a stable way, I don't care about features.. the greatest feature of PT11 for me is time stamped and curved automation... I just care to have it working properly specially when you have a supported computer and you've optimized it as Avid says.

Why waste your time here then?

Considering I was talking in general and you made me talking about PT in particular, why are you making me wasting time when I was there just to express an opinion regarding what I quoted?

And also, may I ask you another question? Why are you there wasting time in replying to a my post about two old posts in a 7 months old thread?

Thanks

Originally Posted by mesaone

• DDMF Metaplugin
• Blue Cat Patchwork
• Blue Cat MB-7
• Nomad Factory Magma
• Plogue Bidule
• Vienna Symphonic Library

A part from the fact, as I said, I didn't entered this thread to talk about its subject but I just wanted to reply to the things I quoted...

My opinion on this is I don't want to deal with other software's bug, poor integration and unpleasing surprises.. considering I spend more time solving problems caused by software then producing and finding workaround to bugs and stuff like that.

I need an environment I can trust, that's the main reason that justify me spending money.

Personally the ideal for me would be the ideal for Avid too.. being able to use the plug ins I like in AXX.. hoping that PT11 is now at level of being considered not a beta test product sold as new as it was PT9 and PT10.

That said, if plug in developer don't port their plugs in AXX, Avid, IMO, should start considering there must be some reason why this doesn't happen, instead just forcing developer in doing the AXX version of their plugs.. maybe there's something Avid could do incentivize developers in doing AXX version of their plugs, because all the time I had the opportunity to talk with some of them about that, they told me it is a pain and a big loss of money, doing the AXX version of plugs.. reasons they told me is that costs a lot of money, it is very hard to get them approved and you are doing that just for a very small cut of users, yeah the pro ones, but VST standard have all the rest

Another very good option for me is that, if VST works good for any other one.. why not implement and optimize VST in PT.. still using AXX as first choice, but being able also to put VST in there

My problem is, for example, I need to use Sylenth1 in PT because is essential to me, because recording it in real time in PT gives me the best quality of all the other DAWs I tried (Ableton, Logic).. even thought to use it I use a wrapper :P

[mesaone]

Originally Posted by allen_gibberish

That said, if plug in developer don't port their plugs in AXX, Avid, IMO, should start considering there must be some reason why this doesn't happen, instead just forcing developer in doing the AXX version of their plugs.. maybe there's something Avid could do incentivize developers in doing AXX version of their plugs, because all the time I had the opportunity to talk with some of them about that, they told me it is a pain and a big loss of money, doing the AXX version of plugs.. reasons they told me is that costs a lot of money, it is very hard to get them approved and you are doing that just for a very small cut of users, yeah the pro ones, but VST standard have all the rest

AAX wasn't developed just to squeeze more money out of people. It's an improvement over RTAS. As far as incentivizing the development of AAX plugs, third party developers already have multiple incentives: supporting their customers, attracting new customers, keeping on top of new tech. Regarding it costing money to develop: even the best investment is a loss if you only look at one moment in time. All software development costs money and resources, including VST.

If you've noticed, VST is kinda the wild west. Along with the great variety, there's also a wide range of compatibility issues. With AAX, this isn't really a problem - the plug-ins are developed with a solitary host in mind.

[louieshowers]

His opinion is absolutely valid. If the "experts" (also referred to as fan boys) can freely insult and antagonize (subliminally or directly) those who are struggling, then don't expect it to stop. It really comes down to the bare facts: Pro Tools is a phenomenal concept but the product is unreliable for MANY not all customers. Until that changes, until Avid can deliver a fully tested and ROCK solid release that will function efficiently and completely on a wide array of systems, until they drastically reduce the price of the product that is essentially beta tested and troubleshooted at no cost to Avid by unsuspecting customers for upwards of a year after a release, until certain users on here change their demeanor toward unhappy people, this hostile environment is inevitable. So we can either respect each other's differences or continue on.

[mesaone]

I simultaneously respect the opinion and disagree. My post was completely impersonal and did not say that the opinions of others are invalid. I would urge you to put away the "fanboy" stuff if you're making a plea for decorum and asking others not to antagonize.