Need help synching new drum track-PLEASE

[LSJ]

Hi Folks, I'm in what is probably NOT a Unique situation. Half way
through recording a CD our drummer left on the spur of the moment and
was quite hostile. We have a great new drummer.

The situation is, we have 5 finished tunes with a lot of work in, no
click because prefer not to work with them, and have to put new drums
down because 1. we can't release the CD with the old drummers work as
we have no release and 2. the new drummer is 5 times better.

Overdubbing drums worked fine on two of the tunes that are simple and
straight ahead. But two other tunes which have real changes are just
not working out. Does anyone know a solution?

I imagine that I could create a tempo map of the first drummers
playing and then superimpose it over the new tracks and quantize them
to it. Is this feasible and is there any hope it would sound ok? Is
there another solution? Particularly I have a killing SAX solo on one
tune I paid a studio musician for and would hate to lose.

A simple outline of steps to take would be helpful as I've never attempted anything like this.

Any ideas will be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Lonny

[Giles Reaves]

Since you say you have a good drummer, could be all he needs is a click track. HOWEVER, to do this you will need to create one manually. This means that someone will have to hit a midi pad or key, or tap out the time on a mic (a pencil on a cd case with a Shure 57 works great for me!). After you record this track you will have to manually align any missed hits to be more precise, and then use Beat Detective to create a tempo map if you really need it (for conforming, if you decide to use BD later).

I'd suggest this approach rather than trying to fix the part later (which you may still need to do in places). Especially since you have had good luck with this drummer on the simpler songs. Always best to get it right from the start whenever possible, even if it means more work up front.

Good luck!

[Rail Jon Rogut]

This means that someone will have to hit a midi pad or key, or tap out the time on a mic

No - it means you'll have to use Beat Detective on the original drum track to create a tempo map or use Identify Beat.

Rail

[BaileyBass]

No - it means you'll have to use Beat Detective on the original drum track to create a tempo map or use Identify Beat.

Rail

Both ways work for me, and both can be labor intensive. If the "clikker" (the one tapping to record) can get a nice "lock" with the original track, it is usually easier to extract a tempo map from a 4/4 click track, than, say a kick or snare. With EA, then manipulating that click track to perfectly match the Drum track is a breeze.... then Beat Detective/tempo map. i can get much longer chunks mapped this way. Seems to be a bit quicker in the long run, at least for me. If the song is simple, no meter changes/metric modulations.. and nothing is midi/ticks.. i will just use that printed click, and forego the tempo map, saving quite a bit of time. ( If I had to do it often I might be a little better with Beat Detective... ,..I am more of a Beat Patrolman, have yet to make Detective, and not sure I even want the job). SB

[Steve MacMillan]

I imagine that I could create a tempo map of the first drummers
playing and then superimpose it over the new tracks and quantize them
to it. Is this feasible and is there any hope it would sound ok? Is
there another solution? Particularly I have a killing SAX solo on one
tune I paid a studio musician for and would hate to lose.

It is really easy to create a new tempo map. You could use Beat Detective, but I would do it manually. If the original drummer was tight as can be, you might want a detailed map (down to 8ths, like you might get from Beat Detective). More than likely, he was a little loose, and you wouldn't want to magnify his inconsistencies by tracing them too tightly. If your goal is just a click map (and not a global time correct of the track), I would mark the top of each bar. Put the transport into tempo map mode by selecting the conductor button, and display the red tempo markers line along the top of the edit window. Make sure all tracks are in samples mode (little world icon next to the voice selector on the edit window). Start at the top, and zoom in tight on the first beat. Put the selector right on the top of the beat and be as accurate as possible. Type Command-i, and set to bar one beat one. Play ahead to the 2nd bar. Zoom in and place the selector. Command-i and set bar 2 beat 1. Repeat until the end. Turn off the original drums, and generate a metronome click. Listen to the click against the track, manually adjust the placement of the previous tempo marker if the click doesn't feel great with the instruments. The click needs to groove. Record the new drums to the click.

STeve

[BGee]

Put the transport into tempo map mode by selecting the conductor button, and display the red tempo markers line along the top of the edit window. Make sure all tracks are in samples mode (little world icon next to the voice selector on the edit window). Start at the top, and zoom in tight on the first beat. Put the selector right on the top of the beat and be as accurate as possible. Type Command-i, and set to bar one beat one. Play ahead to the 2nd bar. Zoom in and place the selector. Command-i and set bar 2 beat 1. Repeat until the end.

It's way easier to do it with beat detective and adjust the resolution of beat detective to generate markers on the bars using the kick or snare if it's a reasonably straightforward 4/4 track. Realistically, if the original drummer's time slides back and forth, you'll need at least quarter note resolution to generate a click that won't change feel dramatically from one bar to the next when the new drummer is playing along with it.

Another option, if you really want to get crazy, is to create a tempo map of the original drummer with beat detective. Then record the new drummer on his own, who probably has a much better feel, playing along with new scratch tracks and not listening to the old tracks, and then cut the existing instruments (all instruments except for the new drums) to match the feel of the new drummer. Might work. Might be a disaster. But it only take a little while to try it and see if its a possibility. I've done it a few times in somewhat similar situations.

[BGee]

The situation is, we have 5 finished tunes with a lot of work in, no
click because prefer not to work with them, and have to put new drums
down because 1. we can't release the CD with the old drummers work as
we have no release and 2. the new drummer is 5 times better.

While I'm thinking about it, re #1, since when does a drummer who is probably working for hire having any say in the matter? #2 pretty much invalidates the point, but if it was just #1 at issue, pay the guy his session fee and use the tracks anyway. What's he gonna do? Sue you? Doubtful. He'll be reasonable after he sleeps on it for a while.

Just a thought.

[LSJ]

Thank you everyone! Ill let you know how it goes. Regards, Lonny

[LSJ]

THank you. I am wondering what EA is?

[elicious]

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