Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Live Sound > VENUE Live Sound Systems

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-16-2009, 11:19 AM
J2sound J2sound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 63
Default External Pre Amps

I have seen a bunch of guys running external pre amps and just setting the Venue pres to +10. They tell me that basically takes the Venue pre amp out of the chain, I don't mean that physically though.

Justin
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-16-2009, 03:34 PM
TwoPort TwoPort is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Granite Bay, California
Posts: 121
Default Re: External Pre Amps

You'd see pictures of this stuff in magazines for years. Guys with great consoles with racks of other high end pre's, compressors, and eq's. Bringing the recording studio signal path to sit next to the live console. It would be interesting to hear what they're getting that was not possible with the Venue itself. I used to understand some banks of high end pre's like Millenia Media, Neve (emulations), API, Summit, etc. when you know something specifically you're trying to do and have no other way to get it. I had all this stuff and now it's all gone.

Spending time with getting guitar sounds (Eleven, amp farm and other plugs) that are additional channels with the in-line with the mic'd amp - I'm showing guitar players I can accomplish some very interesting and likable sonic signatures that are almost impossible micing an amp through any preamp because of the control you have over the signal inside the Venue. And the list goes on and on...

There was one lingering thing.... but now that's gone too...I play Bass and for the longest time I used a "high end" signal path of a Universal Audio LA-610, Distressor, and Manley Enhanced Pultec feeding the Venue. Lots of tube harmonics. Phat! One day I had the idea of trying to "get my sound" from the Venue. It took about 4 hours of screwing around with the myriad of plug in's (which I did) and wound up with what I was certain (and my sound engineers agreed) was an improved sound in every way with the Cranesong Phoenix and Waves C4 (on the bass de-esser preset with a few tweaks.)

For my 2-cents (errrr, maybe it costs more than 2 cents) I've found the Venue to be a platform to create any sound I'm looking for including the sounds from other gear I used to lug around.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-18-2009, 08:48 AM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Norwich, CT
Posts: 35,953
Default Re: External Pre Amps

Quote:
Originally Posted by J2sound View Post
I have seen a bunch of guys running external pre amps and just setting the Venue pres to +10. They tell me that basically takes the Venue pre amp out of the chain, I don't mean that physically though.

Justin
This may be fun for gear sluts, or it may impress the person paying the bills(the "money" channels") but(and this is my 2 cents only) if you can't put up a killer mix on a Venue, its down to the engineer/talent and not he fault of the gear. It made a lot more sense back when the sound Co sent a PM4000. The key to getting great sound out of the Venue is to run it hot(as close to clip as possible).
__________________
Gigabyte X79/intel i7 3930K, 32GB RAM, DIGI003 Rack
https://www.facebook.com/search/top/...0sound%20works


The better I drink...the more I mix.....

BTW, my name is Dave, but most people call me.........................Dave
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-20-2009, 05:19 AM
BradLyons BradLyons is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,985
Default Re: External Pre Amps

It is more common to be using outboard pres with those older (and newer) analog consoles and even some digital consoles----because their pres aren't exactly that great for the lead stuff. But you rarely see this with Venue boards, the Soundcraft VI-series, and DigiCo consoles because the pres are excellent! Still, one might want a good tube pre or Neve sound. When I am doing a large concert production for recording, I'll take out some of my pres for that very reason---to get some real tube warmth. For example anytime I take a Royer SF24 on location, there is always my Presonus ADL600 there to go along with it. It's not because I don't like the pre on the DShow, it's because I like the warmth of the ADL600. The reality is the less gear we have to take out and patch in, the more we like it! BUT this is why there are inputs available AT THE FOH COMPUTER RACK THAT DO NOT HAVE PRE'S BUILT IN.....so you can patch in your outboard gear.
__________________
Thank you, Brad Lyons
GC PRO- Pro Accounts Manager
(404)844-9758
blyons@gcpro.com
www.theaudioprofessional.com
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-20-2009, 09:28 AM
J2sound J2sound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 63
Default Re: External Pre Amps

I am running a SC48 and there are no "line in" on the console. So if I had an external pre amp I wanted to run then that would mean I would have to run a pre amp into another pre amp. Wouldn't that be defeating the purpose?

Justin
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-20-2009, 10:09 AM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Norwich, CT
Posts: 35,953
Default Re: External Pre Amps

Hopefully Sheldon will verify this, but I believe the Digi inputs are designed to be able to handle line level(like most pro-level consoles, which also do not have separate line inputs). While not ideal, it would allow you to capture the character of the external preamp. I agree with your point on not being able to bypass the pre on the SC48 but I suspect that this model is not aimed at the top tier, which is where using outboard pre's is more prevalent. Now, if(big IF) the I/O on the SC48 can be re-assigned to work as an analog insert point, then you could patch your external preamp to an insert return(which is where the big boys do it).
__________________
Gigabyte X79/intel i7 3930K, 32GB RAM, DIGI003 Rack
https://www.facebook.com/search/top/...0sound%20works


The better I drink...the more I mix.....

BTW, my name is Dave, but most people call me.........................Dave
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-20-2009, 10:29 AM
Sheldon Radford's Avatar
Sheldon Radford Sheldon Radford is offline
Avid
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Mountain View, CA
Posts: 1,293
Default Re: External Pre Amps

Hi Justin,

To truly bypass the mic pre you'd use an external mic pre and an analog-to-digital converter (either built into the pre or as a separate device), and connect this to the console's AES input(s). The SC48 has a single AES input, which would allow for up to two channels of external mic pre to be connected.

Setting the analog gain at +10 on the mic/line input doesn't bypass the pre - the signal still runs through all of the same circuitry. One could argue that a mic pre's character changes as the gain changes, but the VENUE pres are quite linear and don't impart that much color to the signal across the 50 dB gain range.

Sheldon
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mbox 3 Pre amps vs. External Pre amps? evanbgrove 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 2 11-10-2011 06:21 AM
Pre amps??? Crazycol Tips & Tricks 18 10-30-2009 09:26 PM
Mbox 2 pro... Pre Amps (vs) 003 Pre... Amps Norm Mix 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 2 03-24-2009 03:37 AM
mic pre amps? bork111 General Discussion 13 07-29-2008 11:40 PM
mic pre amps topaz General Discussion 4 03-01-2004 09:59 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:14 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com