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Old 05-15-2012, 09:37 PM
somtech somtech is offline
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Post Routing to give a stereo group a stereo plugin on the VENUE plus AES EBU uses

In theatre I commonly route radio mic vocals to a mono group and then I use the Trim plugin to route the signal back onto a channel. This mono group can have various inserts placed on it and then gets sent to various matrixes requiring these dynamic and eq processed vocals. The channel then is a send only to the various orchestra foldbacks and as a general fx sends. The beauty of this is the signal is all post fader to foldbacks etc.

While having trouble sleeping the other night I worked out I could use the AES EBU in and out (as I haven't had the need to use them up till now), instead of the Trim plugin, to send a signal out and back onto a different channel while keeping everything in the digital domain. As the AES EBU is one cable that deals with two signals I discovered there is another use for it…..

Stereo groups containing drums or vocal backing or strings may require a stereo group plugin. I would send these to a stereo group but the SC 48 wouldn't allow a stereo plugin over this stereo group. By putting a cable from the AES EBU OUT to AES EBU IN I am able to patch the left and right side of the group to the left and right out of the AES EBU (one plug but digital signal is stereo). Then I can route the AES EBU in to either a stereo channel or a stereo effects return. At that point when we have the signal in stereo on a channel or FX Return where we can use the channel eq and dynamics or insert a stereo plugin. Of course this channel can then be routed to the various outputs. There is only one AES EBU IN and OUT on the standard SC48 but more on the Profile or if using an extra IO16 card (wish I had one… and the remote … oh well maybe one day).

In the mail is an AES EBU analogue converter (AJA ADA4) which seems a simple and cheap option to increase my SC48 input count to 53 + firewire inputs and output count to 20 + firewire outputs

Hope this 2 cents worth is of benefit to someone.

PS Venue 3 is great. Enjoying many of the new features. S
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Old 05-15-2012, 11:20 PM
Greg C Greg C is offline
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Default Re: Routing to give a stereo group a stereo plugin on the VENUE plus AES EBU uses

Quote:
Originally Posted by somtech View Post
Stereo groups containing drums or vocal backing or strings may require a stereo group plugin. I would send these to a stereo group but the SC 48 wouldn't allow a stereo plugin over this stereo group.
With Venue 3.0, you can now set the SC48 for 24 bus mode with Variable Groups. The groups can now be true stereo paired in that mode which will let you use stereo plugins. The only difference as far as assigning inputs to the vari-groups is instead of using the bus assign buttons, you have to use the vari-groups assign knobs and dial up the level like an aux send. A bit of a pain as far as the assignment, but it works. I've put in a feature request on Idea Scale to give an option to either allow the use of the bus assigns instead or allow them to be used simultaneously where you hit the assign and it automatically sets the vari-group gain to unity.
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Old 05-16-2012, 01:33 AM
Roland Clarke Roland Clarke is offline
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Default Re: Routing to give a stereo group a stereo plugin on the VENUE plus AES EBU uses

Quote:
Originally Posted by somtech View Post
In theatre I commonly route radio mic vocals to a mono group and then I use the Trim plugin to route the signal back onto a channel. This mono group can have various inserts placed on it and then gets sent to various matrixes requiring these dynamic and eq processed vocals. The channel then is a send only to the various orchestra foldbacks and as a general fx sends. The beauty of this is the signal is all post fader to foldbacks etc.

S
You could achieve this by double assigning the channel to two channels, one for FOH the other for Foldback, saves using a group. Not sure that I agree with the wisdom of using post fader foldback sends, could potentially lead to feedback problems.
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Old 05-16-2012, 03:19 AM
somtech somtech is offline
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Interesting. When running many radio mic headsets in theatre (I typically run anywhere from 18-43 at a time) we need to make send to band foldbacks post fade otherwise foldback vocals can sound distant from unmuted vocal channels onstage though faders may be down or they may bleed unwanted noise as cast move staging or are offstage. A good operator provides the same balance of Radio mics to foldbacks as to FOH without extra noise or phasing sounds.
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Old 05-16-2012, 09:29 AM
Roland Clarke Roland Clarke is offline
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Default Re: Routing to give a stereo group a stereo plugin on the VENUE plus AES EBU uses

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Originally Posted by somtech View Post
Interesting. When running many radio mic headsets in theatre (I typically run anywhere from 18-43 at a time) we need to make send to band foldbacks post fade otherwise foldback vocals can sound distant from unmuted vocal channels onstage though faders may be down or they may bleed unwanted noise as cast move staging or are offstage. A good operator provides the same balance of Radio mics to foldbacks as to FOH without extra noise or phasing sounds.
I didn't understand that was your use from your original post, I can understand now why you want this. My only question would now be, why is the processed feed, going to FOH not desirable? I originally thought the idea was to prevent feedback, I would have thought the processed feed would be easier to listen to if it's for band/orchestra cue?
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Old 05-19-2012, 07:43 AM
somtech somtech is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roland Clarke View Post
I didn't understand that was your use from your original post, I can understand now why you want this. My only question would now be, why is the processed feed, going to FOH not desirable? I originally thought the idea was to prevent feedback, I would have thought the processed feed would be easier to listen to if it's for band/orchestra cue?
The processed feed is going FOH via Matrix as the radio headset group is processed with inserts of EQ and Dynamics. I don't usually have feedback issues and if feedback was an issue I would stick a 31 band graphic inserted on the group as well. So this processed feed goes to FOH ... AND back to a channel where then the foldbacks can be dialed in
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