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  #21  
Old 01-27-2007, 02:11 PM
25ghosts 25ghosts is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Jeremy -

I am sorry that I am less to you just cuz my tongue aint english... I'll try to improve so I can earn your benefit of a doubt...

I am a user of protools. I have paid for it - many times considering various upgrades. I've been using tdm since '99. It's not like I can go to a dealer and complain when Protools is having a bug. If you read the start of this post you'll find no rant or bad language. I dont know danny and it dont really matter to me who he is... IF I find his statement to be a bad apology then I'll comment on it. I dont think he'll take it personally and quit his job you know. But with all due respect and all - I find it very very wrong to put an upgrade up for sale when there's know bugs in it and have been for quite a while... You dont see mercedes put a car on the market if the windshield wipers are faulty - they'll wait till it's fixed. As hard as it might sound; digidesign is not here to make friends with you or me or anybody else - they are here to make money, which I fully respect. But I cannot deliver an "under the standard mix" without my client coming back to me and have me do it again free of charge. My client can get to be because I am available. Digidesign is not really available and they will certainly not FIX a bug cuz I ask em to. However, they sold me a product knowing about a bug nesting inside..... get the picture --- or is my english not good enough....

So to Danny - if I have offended you in any personal way --- my apologies in advance... wasn't my intention.

My sole intention is for digidesign to finally fix KNOWN bugs in protools instead of dragging them around like a stubborn cold.
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  #22  
Old 01-27-2007, 03:09 PM
Markk Markk is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

It's been happening for me on G5's since 6.4. My G4 never had the problem. I have bought new G5's, swapped HD cards, everything - it's definitely a bug in the software. It is totally un-forgivable - as we (the engineers) face enough economic and business challenges to have to worry about our system freezing when recording 1 track in front of clients - it's in-excusable.
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  #23  
Old 01-27-2007, 04:05 PM
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crizdee crizdee is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Quote:
You dont see mercedes put a car on the market if the windshield wipers are faulty - they'll wait till it's fixed.
Dear 25ghosts, please start to live in the real world!

Here's a few reports on mercedes to help you......

Mercedes' improved fortunes couldn't have come soon enough. The prestigious automaker is finally emerging from the most painful stretch in its 127-year history: a three-year slump in which its once-hallowed reputation for quality and engineering took a beating even as rival BMW surpassed it in global sales. Mercedes' fall in recent years was so precipitous it helped spur the early departure of former CEO Jürgen Schrempp.

The troubles became apparent in 2003 when the world's No. 1 luxury brand landed near the bottom of J.D. Power's annual quality survey. Then, in 2004 and 2005, electronics snafus led to widespread recalls, further denting Mercedes' reputation and finances.

And this one?....

Mercedes-Benz SUV Recalls
Search our collection of Mercedes-Benz SUV recalls to find vehicle defects for your specific Mercedes-Benz SUV year, make, and model. Choose a vehicle below to read Mercedes-Benz SUV recall reports, with detailed explanations of the Mercedes-Benz SUV defects, problems, and solutions from the manufacturer. Don’t wait until the worst case scenario has happened! Be sure to check the latest Mercedes-Benz SUV recalls on a regular basis.

Oh! and this one?....

May 11, 2004
Mercedes is recalling around 680,000 passenger cars worldwide due to suspected problems with the braking systems.
The company said it is offering free inspections to customers of its E-class sedan built after March 2002, SL-class sports cars built after October 2001 and T-models built after March 2003.
A spokesman said that prior inspections showed that of all the models of these classes and years, roughly two out of every thousand proved to have problems with the Sensotronic Brake Control system.
If the same percentage applied, this would translate in this case to about 1,360 units affected out of the 680,000 vehicles.




Chris
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  #24  
Old 01-27-2007, 04:35 PM
25ghosts 25ghosts is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

crizdee....

you obviously didnt get the point

sorry that i mentioned a company which had dirt under their nails as well... I could have chosen another company. Jees - dont you get it? It's the principle...

However, I am glad that you dug out all that dirt on mercedes and brought me to the real world - obviously you dont know that you strengthen my case with what you said......

Mercedes at least has the decency to CALL BACK vehicles and admit mistakes - Like Apple and sony with their batteries....

Point is : DIGIDESIGN - DOESNT CALL BACK!!!! GET IT????? They just charge you for an upgrade and with new features and old bugs...

Thanks for your deep inside of the real world - glad someone has so much time to spend in front of a forum...
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  #25  
Old 01-27-2007, 05:20 PM
jeremyroberts jeremyroberts is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Quote:
I am sorry that I am less to you just cuz my tongue aint english.
[snip]
My sole intention is for digidesign to finally fix KNOWN bugs in protools instead of dragging them around like a stubborn cold.
25 - That's not what I said -- I said I am usually MORE forgiving of non-native English speaking (or writing) - but in your case, you are simply nasty.

As for your intention - my point is that you can be an [bleep], or you can post detailed technical reports. The moment you make this personal, the guys who are going to fix your problem probably lose interest.

You can be a professional, and report the bugs, without making it a personal grudge... this is NOT religion. Danny and his colleagues at Digi are VERY proud of their work, and their product. There will be bugs - and they fix them -- and it is inevitable that anyone upgrading to an early release will get bit here and there... this is the nature of the beast.

SO, you have two or three choices:

1. Help the manufacturer - make detailed, technical reports;
2. Bitch about it (you seem to like this one);
3. Use a different product;

I vote for #1, and when that doesn't work, I revert to a previous (so-called "stable" release) or use different tools.

Don't use the language barrier as an excuse... your English is better than most Americans -- you know you are being nasty and in my world, this is uncalled for. Think about what you're writing... if Danny were standing in front of you, would you have used these words? Probably not.

I WOULD say this to you... I would SCREAM OUT - BE NICE!!!

I'm done. Goodnight.

PS -- If you want an analogy of a car manufacturer that makes products that routinely fail, and does not back it up, look to the town of Wolfsburg, Germany...
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  #26  
Old 01-27-2007, 06:06 PM
Andre Knecht Andre Knecht is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Hi Danny — thanks for the help.

I’d like to submit some observations in regards to system freezing.

Normally, I experience them a handful of times in the course of a (long) day. Typically, they last 5–10 seconds, I don’t get the SWOD, and everything is normal after the freeze. (Auto Backup is always on, set to save every 7 minutes, and keep 99 instances.)

Yesterday, I imported data from a previous session for the drums group of tracks (Eight + Group Aux, Sends and 1 Aux FX return). I imported everything but audio, markers and tempo map.

Immediately after this process, my system became uncharacteristically sluggish, and I started experiencing freezes w/ SWOD with unprecedented frequency. Just about any and every action on my part (save for plug-in tweaks), brought forth a freeze+SWOD.

A partial list: Stop transport, place cursor to new location and start transport, Save session, copy region, edit fades, etc.

I performed all the standard troubleshooting steps, hoping that one of them would prove to be the fix. In the back of my mind, I always “knew” that it all related to the data import, and the changes that made to the mixer configuration and its plug-in load.

Eventually, I created a new session and began importing tracks from the afflicted one — no more than 4 at a time. After each import, I would “operate” PT to test things. Eventually, I imported a track which turned out to be the culprit — deleting it, immediately returned the system to its usual responsiveness.

Incidentally, I have experienced similar strange behavior in the past and, upon reflection, importing session data and/or its related mixer configuration changes seem to be a common trait among the “incidents.”


Dual 2.5 G5, 3GB RAM, Digi 64-bit Chassis, PT HD4 (core+3 Accel), Digi SCSI Kit 128, StoreCase UL3D chassis, u160 15K Seagate drives.

OSX 10.4.8, PT 7.2 cs2. All plugs at positively latest (and/or appropriate) version.


IHTH.
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  #27  
Old 01-27-2007, 07:17 PM
25ghosts 25ghosts is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Jeremy,

I'm in no way an unfair person. Neither am I someone to put silk between my hands when talking 'bout things. I can praise and I can bitch. If Danny would have told me exactly what he wrote I would have said the same thing. I LOVE protools OK. I have nothing but admiration for the folks at digidesign for making something as wonderful as TDM and a software to go along with it.

However, I cant help but feel offended by companies putting out stuff that aint OK. I BUY all my products and use NO cracks what so ever and I have the right to talk STRAIGHT without being candid or having to think about hurting someone's feelings. Now living in a world of adult people one should be able to say what one wants to say.

IMO I aint being nasty nor am I calling anybody names - I just say things the way I feel them.

But Hey :: This Is Me…
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  #28  
Old 01-27-2007, 08:11 PM
Mikey MTC Mikey MTC is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

25 Ghosts - Aside from Jeremy's comments which I totally agree with, I think you're making some unfair assumptions.

You implied earlier in the thread that Danny (or Digi in general) couldn't reproduce the problem. I think you'll find that they can reproduce it just like everyone else. I'm assuming the issue is that they are having trouble diagnosing it due to its randomness. Big difference.

Also, you seem to be laboring under the impression that other software (music or otherwise) gets released without known bugs. For example, isn't there some publlicised number of open Microsoft Word bugs which is well into the hundreds? Virtually all software has bugs, both major and minor.

The really offensive part of your rant was this:

=======
I find it rather scaring that you have not been able to reproduce this freeze - it only tells me that you dont care... If you dont care then you should not bother charging money for corrupted updates/grades... This is a shame - and it is resting on your shoulders and digging into our wallets and mood.
=======

Like Jeremy said, if you had any idea who Danny was, to imply that he doesn't care goes beyond insulting and heads towards ... I don't know ... English is my first language but I don't know the word I'm searching for here.
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  #29  
Old 01-27-2007, 08:23 PM
Stuart P. Stuart P. is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Quote:

Like Jeremy said, if you had any idea who Danny was, to imply that he doesn't care goes beyond insulting and heads towards ... I don't know ... English is my first language but I don't know the word I'm searching for here.
I do. It begins with "A" and ends with "hole".
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  #30  
Old 01-27-2007, 08:30 PM
sleadley sleadley is offline
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Default Re: PT 7.3.1 - Still Features Random Graphic Freez

Dear 25Ghosts probably the most frustrating thing for Digidesign is that this problem does not occur for everyone. I have 10 TDM systems and only one of the exhibits this behaviour and then really rarely. Last week, for example on my Accel 2 system on a G5 Dual 2.5 we were recording orchestra for 2 sessions a day and then editing into the night. These were 48 tracks, 48k/24 bit and we were renaming playlists with quick Keys (for Take numbering) and really pushing the system, but it only exhibited this behaviour once for 5-7 seconds after we pressed record. It is connected to a DM2000 running HUI emulation and other than that all has been fine. So a bug like this is difficult to pin down. If we were Digidesign, then I would say that we were unable to reproduce the problem, not because we don't care. I know Danny and he is like a dog with a bone when there is a problem, he takes this stuff really seriously. But until they can reproduce the problem or find the common thread that makes it occur for some people and not others, then we will have to wait.
I wonder what happens if you turn of indexing on all connected drives, we have done this on our SCSI record drives to make sure that PT is running at peak efficiency. I would try that and see what happens.
Digidesign is not in the habit of releasing software with lots of bugs and they have a great track record of announcing and squashing bugs, better than any of the competition IMHO. I don't work for Digi, but I do rely on their software for my livelihood so far it has been the best investment I have made in audio equipment, and I have owned it from the Sound Designer™ days.
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