Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Legacy Products > Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 12-12-2004, 10:28 AM
Lee Blaske Lee Blaske is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Minneapolis, MN U.S.A.
Posts: 3,625
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay for

Quote:
well it had to happen sooner or later than my ilok key that came with my hd3 rig would crap out, hell it's a piece of cheap plastic made in china.
It is a frail device, that's for sure. It's not as robust as dongles from Apple/Emagic or Yellow Tools. Since it needs the card slot, it's not totally sealed like other dongles. It's also rather long, so when it's inserted into a USB socket, there's greater chance for breakage (because it's a longer lever).

For those needing to travel with iLoks, it might not be a bad idea to rig up some system to make them harder to break, lose or steal. One good way to add protection and security would be to buy a Tupperwear like container, and then glue a USB hub inside it. Cut out a hole for the hub's power and USB cable. Then, put the iLok in the hub, fill the container with foam peanuts, and put the top on. With this kind of rig, you won't have to worry as much about the iLok breaking, wearing out or damaging the iLok connections. It would prevent wear and tear. It would also add a little security (especially if you glued the top shut). Actually, there's a really good opportunity here for someone to make a sturdy, locking metal container (with a hub in it) that had some heavy duty hardware that could be used to chain it to furniture, etc. to prevent iLok theft.

The ease of stealing an iLok (that could easily have in the neighborhood of $10,000 worth of plugs on it) is frightening. Sure, you can insure it, but it's not good to be making huge insurance claims if you want to keep your rates low. In a busy commercial studio, people sure as heck don't leave $10,000 mics laying around.

The iLok is a flawed system that is disliked by many people. Many people have also developed an intense dislike for Pace. This is a negative for Digidesign, and no doubt if preventing some software sales. Something new must take its place. The sooner the better.

Lee Blaske
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-21-2004, 07:43 PM
delphypop delphypop is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 338
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

so have digi design got any plans for upgrading thier software antipiracy security to make it less of a burden on their customers?
digi?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-21-2004, 09:37 PM
D. Weeb D. Weeb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 73
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

I've resisted commenting on this for some time, but since you won't let it go, I can't help but comment on this kind of typical behavior in this day and age.

Part of running a business is maintaining your equipment, even the little plastic iLok. Even without purchasing zero downtime, there were things you could have done that would have made this easier, and quite possibly even avoided any problems at all if rough use by the user is what caused the iLok failure.

On iLok.com:

Synchronize your iLok before you have problems, so all the vendors can give you temporary licenses in the event of a problem.
Price: free

Dongle Buddy
"This flexible 8 inch (20 cm) USB cable extender is custom made to help protect your iLok from accidental damage."
Price: $5.95

Blaming everyone else because you didn't do either:
Priceless
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-22-2004, 01:52 AM
delphypop delphypop is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 338
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

Quote:
I've resisted commenting on this for some time, but since you won't let it go, I can't help but comment on this kind of typical behavior in this day and age.

Part of running a business is maintaining your equipment, even the little plastic iLok. Even without purchasing zero downtime, there were things you could have done that would have made this easier, and quite possibly even avoided any problems at all if rough use by the user is what caused the iLok failure.


you're missing my point. Ilok is nothing to do with my audio equipment, its got nothing to do whatsoever with recording mixing and producing music, its a security device to protect the authors software from piracy. it doesn't help me do a better mix, or get a better performane, it simply protects the people who wrote the software from piracy.

I object to this system costing me money, and (I) locking me into a system that will cost me and continue to cost ME money to maintain.
a challenge response system does not cost me money to maintain.
you're mine and everyone's ilok is going to fail at some stage and we're all going to have to deal with it. and we're all going to have to pay for that miantainance. I object to that. you're cool with it. sweet. mind pay for mine?

Quote:


Blaming everyone else because you didn't do either:
Priceless
My key is presently going, I opened it and repaired it myself. I look after it, don't treat it badly and still it faulted. this time I could fix it, next time?
I can't get Ilok.com to see my key, I can not syncronise for what ever reason.
Ilok will look into it for me, but I've got to give em my credit card number first.
they may well not charge me, but they also might.
not a system I like.
luckily my dealer is going to look into it, but I have to post em my key, have some down time, a few days.

your key is going to fault sometime. shall I shut up until you feel its a problem? then maybe you can solve it for all of us?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-22-2004, 07:19 AM
Duardo Duardo is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 978
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

Quote:
Ilok is nothing to do with my audio equipment, its got nothing to do whatsoever with recording mixing and producing music, its a security device to protect the authors software from piracy.
Actually, there is at least one advantage to the iLok, and that's that it allows you to easily use plugins on several different computers. I like that. And I've found it much easier to use than challenge/response authorizations.

Quote:
you're mine and everyone's ilok is going to fail at some stage and we're all going to have to deal with it. and we're all going to have to pay for that miantainance.
I don't think that's true. How do you know that "everyone's" iLok is going to fail? I have a few of them, and I haven't had to pay anything for mine yet, and my oldest one has been up and running for years.

-Duardo
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-22-2004, 07:44 AM
jeremyroberts jeremyroberts is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: New York, NY, USA
Posts: 3,020
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay for

Quote:
[IMO, the challenge/response systems implemented by companies like Native Instruments and Spectrasonics are VASTLY better than the iLok.
Lee,

Although we must agree to disagree on this, if you travel and need to being your tools with you, as many of us do, you will HATE challenge/response.

If you have had the pleasure of a CPU migration recently, you will HATE challenge/response.

I can jump to other studios, bring my dongle on the airplane, work on someone else's rig, and never worry that the other system doesn't have my tools.

Unfortunately, not everyone owns Spectrasonics or NI plugs... But I can bring my entire arsenal with me. I plug 2 iLoks into a non-powered mini hub, and that's that (except for my 4 or 5 plugs that are C/R that I can't use unless the system has it).

You can't uninstall C/R auths -- so I can't put a temp auth onto another studio's rig. Of course, I can bring an external system drive...but why - if i can only bring an iLok?

We will never see eye to eye on this until your work/lifestyle demands that you move to other rigs.
__________________
--Jeremy
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-22-2004, 07:54 AM
jeremyroberts jeremyroberts is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: New York, NY, USA
Posts: 3,020
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

Quote:
My key is presently going, I opened it and repaired it myself. I look after it, don't treat it badly and still it faulted. this time I could fix it, next time?

My car has one of those "security key/alarm/remote" keys. It has a microchip encoded with a code that only THIS KEY can start my car. if the key is not inserted, car will not start. My key failed after warranty expired. It cost $135 for a new key + $70 to the dealer to program it.

At the same time, I bought a 2nd (spare) key. The hassle taught me a lesson.

I have 2 blank iLok's sitting around. My primary (fully loaded) iLok has ZDT. I have one iLok for Waves (as they have their own system). So, for $30/year I don't worry about iLok failures. Ever. No issues. Problem solved. No bitching, no headaches, no worries.

What's that worth?
__________________
--Jeremy
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-22-2004, 09:15 AM
Logichead Logichead is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 427
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

Interesting that few of you seem to appreciate the concept that is at the core of the issue - that USERS are paying to protect the copyright of the software companies.

Of course, ultimately the user pays, but iLok as a separate entity, is more expensive and more cumbersome. Instead of having the software companies as their clients, they have the end users. Lots of them. Each one of them pays iLok.

While many end user needs are being met, obviously some of their needs are not. Remember, without copyright protection, there would be no need for iLok.

The fact that this has been discussed to death is irrelevant. The iLok system has problems that could be fixed. For example, the dongle itself is poorly designed - it hogs space on the usb hub, it is prone to breakage. The Logic dongle, being smaller, is better in this regard.

If iLok never charges the $25, why do they ask for it? The first time I saw that I had to agree to a $25 charge before asking a question was - annoying to say the least. This policy is not well thought out and causes bad feelings towards iLok. Goodwill from your clients is crucial and iLok squanders it.

This has been mentioned before, but so what - a local Digi dealer told me of users that had bought a Waves package, but used the (k) versions to avoid dealing with copyright protection.

FWIW, I don't use ANY (k) software, and i don't advocate it. But morality aside (and moral issues can get pretty murky), it is not hard to see why someone would.

Those of you who are happy with iLok as is, great! For the rest of us, iLok has some work to do. I am always trying to improve on the job I do for my clients. A little more of that attitude at iLok would be a good thing.

Happy holidays!....H
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-22-2004, 02:11 PM
delphypop delphypop is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 338
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

Quote:
Quote:
My key is presently going, I opened it and repaired it myself. I look after it, don't treat it badly and still it faulted. this time I could fix it, next time?

My car has one of those "security key/alarm/remote" keys. It has a microchip encoded with a code that only THIS KEY can start my car. if the key is not inserted, car will not start. My key failed after warranty expired. It cost $135 for a new key + $70 to the dealer to program it.

At the same time, I bought a 2nd (spare) key. The hassle taught me a lesson.

I have 2 blank iLok's sitting around. My primary (fully loaded) iLok has ZDT. I have one iLok for Waves (as they have their own system). So, for $30/year I don't worry about iLok failures. Ever. No issues. Problem solved. No bitching, no headaches, no worries.

What's that worth?
Jeremy you're having trouble grasping this simple concept aren't you.
its ownership.
you own your car, so the protection of it benefits you. if its stolen you lose.
protecting the copyright of software does not benfit you directly, perhaps it benefits sociey asa whole, but not ou specifically. it benefits the writers of that software, yet under Ilok you pay directly to a third party (Ilok) to protect and maintain that protection, and they use that position to charge you, the end user and hike the price up. why can you not grasp this simple concept. you're making sound engineers look dumb.
you're arguing at cross purposes. no ones denying that the portable authorisation is a sweet feature, but that shouldn't be the primary purpose of the key. its to get the software running on one system, and it should'nt cost the user an ongoing expense.

You seem to be arguing for the right to pay for this stuff when really you're arguing for the right to move your authorisations around, and thats really an add on feature, and if you really want to you can argue for the right to pay for that in addition to your normal costs. it is a special needs feature after all.

I'm arguing for you and me to not have to pay for the anti piracy protection. two different things. I don't mind ilok sticking around if digi makes efforts to cover the maintainance and costs of it and perhaps even takes away the power from ilok corp. digi I trust, ilok, well they haven't really made themselves look good have they.
read logicheads post and see if that makes it easier for you to understand.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-22-2004, 02:35 PM
D. Weeb D. Weeb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 73
Default Re: ilok - someone elses security system you pay f

You broke your iLok because YOU took lousy care of it. What part of that don't YOU understand?
Everything else you've written without acknowleging that basic fact is just noise. Who really looks dumb here?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PT on a new system, iLok stuff Danko Getting Started 2 05-21-2013 07:31 PM
About Plugins and the ilok system swalleight 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 9 10-12-2006 06:11 AM
TDM Ilok authorizations and LE System spigots 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 1 02-01-2004 02:44 PM
OT - sampling from someone elses CD MidnightFlyer 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 3 11-28-2003 11:47 PM
iLok Security BIRD DAWG General Discussion 1 08-31-2003 06:18 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:01 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com