Microphone Suggestions for Film?

[spicyitaliano]

I'm budgeting for a film project, which will be recorded and mixed in PT|HD 5.1. I'm putting together the system now. I've got four types of microphones I need to get, and perhaps multiple mics for each role. Here they are:

ADR - male and female actors
Foley - on a foley stage, stereo needed
Location recording - various sources + atmospheres
On-set Dialog Boom

I have some good ideas for each of these, but a little extra push would help! Also, I'd like to get a nice multi-channel preamp to feed the system in the studio for foley and ADR. Perhaps something transparent, like a True Systems Precision 8?

Everybody pitch in! Thanks -

[Tom Smith]

Here's my two cents:

On-set Dialog Boom: Sennheiser MKH60
ADR: Sennheiser MKH60
Foley: Sennheiser MKH60, Neumann TLM-103 or Shure KSM-44
Location recording: Sennheiser MKH60, and MKH30

Don't forget a pistol grip, zeppelin and a woolie for the MKH60 & 30 (I like the Sennheiser stuff better than the Rycote).

For stereo can clamp the MKH30 to the MKH60 for M/S. I haven't done this for Foley but they both fit inside the zeppelin together and work great for stereo ambiences & such...

[spicyitaliano]

Thanks Thomas for the quick reply -

I see you like for the Sennheiser MKH60, which seems to be a very popular piece of equipment for this kind of work. As is the MKH416, which is a bit cheaper. Do you have any experience with this one? I''d love to hear your thoughts on the general tonal difference of the two.

I also see that you suggest using it in the ADR as well, which is a very good idea. Very often a large diaphragm condenser is used in the ADR, to capture the "best sound", but truth be told, you want the dialog tone to match what is already being kept from the on-set dialog. Unless of course you're re-recording all the dialog, in which case it might make more sense. Good call, and I will keep that in consideration when I start purchasing equipment.

Now excuse my ignorance, but do i need a woolie if I have a zeppelin?

[Craig F]

416 is the standard benchmark @ 25mV/Pa
60 is a nice option @ 40mV/Pa plus HPF and 10dB pad

[David Sandwisch]

I have an MKH60 and it is really nice although it does seem a bit short when using it outside. I also seem to get a nice hiss that's pretty high frequency whenever I use it. I'm not sure if that is normal or not or am I expecting too much from a shotgun mic? For example my U87 is rediculously quieter than the MKH60. Is this to be expected? I use a Millennia preamp or a Focusrite Green Range preamp when I use it. The hiss might also be caused by the poor preamps in the video camera that I sometimes hook it up to.

[spicyitaliano]

Craig, sorry for the question, but I have some catching up to do - what exactly are you referring to?

[Tom Smith]

I see you like for the Sennheiser MKH60, which seems to be a very popular piece of equipment for this kind of work. As is the MKH416, which is a bit cheaper. Do you have any experience with this one? I''d love to hear your thoughts on the general tonal difference of the two.

I do like the MKH60 over the 416 which I think sounds too "crispy" or "honky" or something: maybe it hypes the upper mids too much... I just think the 60 has a smoother top end, though it can be a bit bottom heavy too so I usually keep the low freq filter switched on. It's not my "dream mic" but one that can get good results. I am anxious to try the Neumann and Schoeps shotguns too.

I also see that you suggest using it in the ADR as well, which is a very good idea. Very often a large diaphragm condenser is used in the ADR, to capture the "best sound", but truth be told, you want the dialog tone to match what is already being kept from the on-set dialog. Unless of course you're re-recording all the dialog, in which case it might make more sense. Good call, and I will keep that in consideration when I start purchasing equipment.

It's pretty standard to try to use the same kind of mic for ADR as was used for production. On projects where I did both production and post sound, I've been able to use the same actual microphone. You're supposed to run a second mic (of the same type) a few feet back from the first but sometimes it doesn't work out that way. I've also put up an LDC or good quality dynamic too just for the hell of it. You may not use it but it doesn't hurt. Also, if the actors had body mics in production, I like to use them in ADR too (though recorded to a seperate track).

And even if you're going to ADR all the dialog for all the actors, I still like to use a "production" type of mic and use a mic placement that emulates what was done in production. VO and narration is another story...

[/QUOTE]

Now excuse my ignorance, but do i need a woolie if I have a zeppelin?

The woolie is designed to work with and enhance the function of the zeppelin (well, the one I have is anyway). In gusty, windy environments they really work wonders! I use the zeppelin even indoors to reduce whooshes from rapid mic movements, air vents, etc. I've been meaning to get a foam windscreen for indoor use but haven't gotten around to it.

[Tom Smith]

I have an MKH60 and it is really nice although it does seem a bit short when using it outside. I also seem to get a nice hiss that's pretty high frequency whenever I use it. I'm not sure if that is normal or not or am I expecting too much from a shotgun mic? For example my U87 is rediculously quieter than the MKH60. Is this to be expected? I use a Millennia preamp or a Focusrite Green Range preamp when I use it. The hiss might also be caused by the poor preamps in the video camera that I sometimes hook it up to.

I think it's pretty normal... Smaller mic diaphrams are more prone to self-noise than larger ones, though I don't remember why. I remember looking at the specs of an Earthworks omnidirectrional mic once (1/8 inch capsules I think) & being surprised by the stated self noise...

I hate running sound to the camera!!! And not just because of the crummy preamps and/or A-D convertors. If they insist, I'll send them a stereo feed from the mixer but record to my own recorder.

[philper]

The industry standard for interior dialog reocrding from an overhead boom is either the Schoeps MK41, Senn. MKH 60 or the Neumann KMR81. There are many other good mics available to do this work, but these are the ones against which the others are measured. Outdoors shotgun types are preferred, usually Neumann KMR82, Senn. MKH 70 and Sanken CS3. For the latter you will need a serious Rycote or DPA style zepplin windscreen, for the former, at least a foam windscreen. The choice of fishpole is a personal one--in the US most use vDB or KTek. There are many other necessities for getting set up to do location sound, not the least of which is a mixer, some way of communicating with your boom op and a way of sending a monitor feed to the director, script supervisor and a host of other people who want to hear the dialog as it is recorded. For more info on all this, ask on RAMPS (Google Group).

Philip Perkins CAS

[Craig F]

mV/Pa: mV per Pascal
1 Pascal = to 94 dB SPL

so at any given SPL level the MKH 60 will output more voltage than the MKH 416
useful if you are micing mumblers and bunny farts